Plano Skywalker

oh, I have no doubt and, for the record, I'm not all that attached to Revan, anyway...I was just trying to find a way for it to still be "Revan's story" as I know there are a lot of people who see it that way.

hmmm, I like the idea of joinable NPCs lying to the PC (really doesn't matter if PC is good or bad) because such a thing adds a highly immersive element to the game. I really do think that a Personality barometer would (in addition to good/evil and law/chaos) would work wonders here. If the NPC is comfortable with your personality, they tell you the truth, otherwise, they lie. I can definitely see Atton, for instance, lying to you one playthrough and then telling the truth on the other, soley based on personality (without regard for good/evil or law/chaos). Others, like Handmaiden, would be less swayed by personality and would be looking for indications of your actual alignment. And I do like the idea of a Mutany attempt (in games where there is an actual ship or base of operations)....but all of this is contingent on Party Management. The PC has to be able to figure out who the trouble makers are and fire them if necessary.

I agree that a new PC is a must but I also agree that 3 chefs in the kitchen is one too many. And, indeed, how would you even explain why this n00b is being asked to go to the Unknown Regions to look for Revan? I think the only viable answer is that the PC is a blood relative of Revan (cousin, whatever) and has been having dreams/nightmares about this man he has never met. Come to find out, Revan and the PC share a Force Bond (ouch, I know, but consider the story we are in and how it has been told thus far) and that, because of this connection, the PC is confident he can find Revan even though no one has any idea where, exactly, he is. With the PC being a blood relative, this still makes it Revan's Saga. Just as Anakin fulfilled the Sith'ari prophecy vicariously though his son, Revan beats the True Sith vicariously through a blood relative. Revan could die or be caught in some sort of anamoly that could set up future games. Revan cannot become just another Master walking and talking. Exile can. Like it or not, Revan has become the all-purpose plot device for the forseeable future.

some might argue that the Sith race died out in previous wars. while this is true to a point, there are certain factions of the ancient Sith whose fate was never accounted for in the comics. also, Exar Kun (just some 40 years before the time of Revan) had Massassi bodyguards (Massassi is an elite warrior sect of the Sith). IIRC, Kun did turn on his Massassi but some could have escaped. anyway, there are ways to bring these guys back that do not contradict EU continuity and I suspect that is who the True Sith will end up being.

yes, but they would also be polarizing. so, if you are playing a Sith Lord with the Corrupt feat (or whatever it is called), the PC should be able to sway some but others will leave the party. the problem with giving the PC alignment-changing powers over the followers is directly proportional to the lack of party management in the newer games. fine, give us followers who are easily swayed but also make it believable (i.e. some will leave) and introduce opportunity costs (if you want to be surrounded by fanboys, you have to give up some quality followers)....in other words, the mindless acolytes aren't in the same league as the more independent-minded. As someone mentioned on another thread, persuasive powers should shine during the actual story encounters, not so much with the NPC joinables.

there is, in fact, a currently-running Dark Horse comic series called "Knights of the Old Republic" and it is really good. the main character is (I think) going to end up being Nihilius. anyway, if you can't find them in shops, you could always order them online straight from Dark Horse.

OK, OK, I'm not going to try to address everything mentioned right now, but, the REAL QUESTION is "just who are the True Sith?". I agree, that if we are talking about Kreia and Malak types, the civil war idea is fine. But, remember, Revan essentially started that Sith order. No, I believe the True Sith are these guys: and that changes everthing. Revan is not going to start a civil war among them. They are the ones who have been playing both sides all along.

by far, the best ST film.

correct, but it could certainly be used in a single-player RPG (gee, can't seem to think of the name right now <_< ) as most it would be non-walkable scenery, the important stuff (i.e. Senate Chamber) who be flown to (and probably cut-scene-based). The actual "free roam" area would be quite limited.

the problem is not with Revan being some maverick Admiral, the problem is Exile being either 1) another Nihilius or 2) a sidekick of Revan that you never hear from in-game. Exile does need to be given a prominent role and I think rebuilding the Order (while PC is running missions for Revan) is an excellent role for Exile. Exile could even be controllable at certain segments of the game.

that would indeed wrap everything up nicely storywise but where does it leave the PC? polishing Revan's boots? no, Revan provides in the intel (True Sith have some vulnerability) and Exile goes and rounds up the Lost Jedi and reforms the Council. the PC saves the day. Revan is flexible, Exile is LSF and it all fits nicely with canon (which will be an important factor, to be sure).

Tigranes, I think you about hit it. Perhaps the easiest way to somewhat achieve what you are talking about is to first weigh whether the response was Lawful or Chaotic. So, in this scenario, a young child whose mother was recently killed by invading forces asks the PC "Is my mother dead?". PC's response options: 1) Yes. 2) No. 3) I don't know. 4) I don't know but such a nice girl needn't worry herself with such things. 5) Don't know, don't care. if the PC chooses option 1, then he has chosen the only Lawful response as that is the only truthful response. Any other response will result in a shift toward Chaos in the Law/Chaos barometer. Option 2 (No) and 3 (don't know) are effectively the same answer and would not, on their own, involve a shift on the Good/Evil axis. Option 4 is essentially the same as Option 3 except it also Patronizes the NPC. That would be logged the same way as Option 3 but with a Personality shift towards Patronizing (well, such a thing *could* be done....3 different barometers). Option 5, in my opinion anyway, is not only Chaotic but Evil as well. This response would involve a shift towards Evil (DS, Bad, etc) in addition to Chaotic. now, that was just to illustrate how the system may not be able to make a LS/DS shift based on one answer alone but can definitely make Law/Chaos decisions every single time there is a PC response.

wow, Architect, that does seem like a really good fan fiction but it just seems too complicated for a game. and, it does, essentially, nullify LS Revan and LS Exile endings of K1 and K2. I realize Revan was "brainwashed" but still, he had plenty of choices after that time to decice what side he was on. LS Revan at the end of K1 is *Revan's* choice, not just the result of the brainwashing. also, it minimizes the significance of the True Sith and basically makes Revan the Big Bad. My Revan is LS and I don't particularly want him to be the Big Bad. Plus, it would seem that such a role amounts to fan service. K2 established that the True Sith are the Big Bads...having another Nihilius out there means the True Sith don't have a chance......that is not the direction I want it to go in. Revan has to play some significant role in K3, no question, but K3 is ultimately about the True Sith....and they, more than anyone else, have been "playing both sides".

[sLIGHT SPOILER ALERT] you mean "pushing the envelope?" since they had already done pretty much what I described in the Fallout games and in PST. that would have been fine had they adjusted the NPCs dialogues and cutscenes. Visas, for instance, never has a LS thing to say even if she is swayed all the way over to LS Mastery. still, unless you are going to pay through the nose for this kind of influence, I don't like the PC changing NPC's alignments very much. it was too much built in to the PC's backstory...didn't cost nearly enough.

right, having alignment play any significant role in influence was a very bad thing....sure, there will be people you just can't reach. but that is what party management is for. influence should be along the lines of letting Bao-Dur help you fix the speeder (which was part of the game), going to the pistol range with Mandalore, etc...and, there should be opportunity costs with influence, and not just of the romantic variety (i.e. the whole Visas/Handmaiden thing).

No matter what they do, they will tick some people off...but the worst thing they can do is "cut and run" (to a different story).....that would be supercheap.

Architect, You do have some good ideas there. I especially like the bit about Revan's mask...I would like to see that developed in K3....it might also explain Nihilius's mask. However, I don't see LS (redeemed) Revan using a "Force sucker" like Nihilius to wipe out entire worlds. That is something pre-redemption Revan might have done but I don't think it is consistent with the LS ending of K1. (I do want a lot more backstory into Revan's ties with the 3 big bads of K2....that needs to be really fleshed out in-game). So, if I am correct that your story idea is not consistent with redeemed Revan, then we have 2 Yellow Brick Roads which is something they have not done yet and, unless they go to 2 shrinkwraps (KOTOR: Blue and KOTOR: Red, for instance), I doubt we will see 2 different story progressions in these games. No, I'm afraid DS will be just another frustrated ANTI-HERO in K3. And, as far as allowing for every possible contigency (DSF Revan kills Carth on the Star Forge), I would much rather the devs spend their time giving us an NPC pool that is larger than the max ship compliment. That way, we can have some meaningful choices in K3 that affect the quality and replayability of K3. Imagine dialogue influence that takes into account real consequences: "keep talking like that and you are off this boat!".

I agree that we should never see Tatooine again in these games as a story world. However, I wouldn't mind having it as a destination that just happens to be on the astrocharts (much like the Yavin Space Station was in K1).

The Doors -- Greatest Hits

well, I don't want KOTOR 3 to "cut and run"....the True Sith thing is just too much of a canon issue not to be resolved. KOTOR 3 has to resolve what Revan was chasing after (whether Revan is personally involved or not). I see no problem with a flexible Revan in K3, at least based on alignment because, even if Revan is DS, he did what he did for the good of the Republic. Revan is either hero or anithero, not an outright villain. Exile is more problematic because DS Exile is a villain who has some uber-powerful anamoly attached to her that is much more of a threat than the True Sith or anything else....simply put, DS Exile is not viable to make an appearance in K3. Still, they could ask the PC about Revan and the Exile's alignments. Revan appears either way. If you say that Exile was LS, she plays an important part of the war effort (possibly taking Vrook's place as the head of the Dantooine council). If you say Exile was DS, then you find out in conversation that she was killed by the True Sith as they saw her as a threat and understood the anamoly did not fit into their plan. I would like something like that as opposed to outright hard-coding of alignments.

BSG MMO, no thanks. As to the direct-to-dvd movie, well, I have Season 1 of the TV show Columbo on DVD. Those episodes were all 2-hour movies (counting commercial breaks). If BSG is going to be moving to a time slot that is, shall we say, not exactly prime real estate, I say start making the episodes 2-hours long anyway. (This could also be a test balloon to see if the viewers will plunk down cash for the movie....if they do, then that would help justify a continuation of the series "off air" as it were).

I don't want a film made of these games. Rather, I would like these games mapped out as trilogies and, in the third installment of each trilogy, you get a seperate disk that is, essentially, the "perfect playthrough" of the entire trilogy (possibly with some added cutscenes and animations). If GL does decide to make more movies, it has to be between Epi 3 and ANH. That is the time period where the military breaks up into the Imperial forces and the Rebellion and Vader, presumably, goes out to the Outer Rim to hunt the remaining Jedi. There is actually a lot going on in that time period.

didn't Space Rangers 2 have that horrific copy protection program on it?

hey Chan, just an idea, you might want to use that image as your profile avatar instead of sig.....IIRC, the avatar scales down to appropriate size automatically while, with sigs, it is easy to be over the allowed height.

I think that's right. The Wii interface was the big gamble that paid off. I mean, I'm not the kind of person who would play a Tennis game with a joystick but, if I can play it kinestheticly in a virtual sim, then, yeah, I just might. It makes a world of games interesting that otherwise would not have been that interesting to me. I think Sony is really just trying to get the Blue Ray out there...that is their main focus with the PS3.