Grimlorn

I didn't read the entire thread, but I hope you're not accusing me of being sexist.

No more romance threads, why do we need them? Let Obsidian do their own thing. They don't need our input to create a romance if they want to put one in the game.

It's true: male wizards always have their wands handy. Haha, and they get a lot of practice with them.

It was a study actually (I think, I read it in the newspaper), but I'm not sure I can find a non-swedish article on it. You'd need a couple independent studies that last through the age 20 or something to even get me interested. You're just basically saying that boys and girls who were raised the same acted the same at the age of 5. That's nothing and doesn't prove anything about the biological differences between men and women being cultural. So you are agreeing that we do raise them differently? Do you think how we are raised doesn't influence our behaviour or do you not think the way girls are raised differently disadvantages them? I think men and women have different strengths and weaknesses. I also think variety is good. I wouldn't want to date a woman that's like me. I do agree that we raise men and women differently, but that those differences stem from the biological differences of men and women. It's not entirely environmental. That's what has shaped our culture. It's not like men woke up one day and said this is how I'm going to keep women down by raising them differently. Men and women are different and different things have been expected of them in the past and continue to be expected. I kind of doubt they will change. Unless women are willing to give up a lot of what makes them women and men are willing to too. I mean do we really want to be physically and mentally equal with sexual organs being the only difference? Sounds pretty crappy to me.

It was a study actually (I think, I read it in the newspaper), but I'm not sure I can find a non-swedish article on it. You'd need a couple independent studies that last through the age 20 or something to even get me interested. You're just basically saying that boys and girls who were raised the same acted the same at the age of 5. That's nothing and doesn't prove anything about the biological differences between men and women being cultural or environmental.

No we wont be the same but saying that in-equal pay is the singular discrimination against women in society is just plain wrong. Sure there are biological differences but our culture (actually, most every culture) encodes us with values that disadvantage women in more ways than that. Just for one thing we raise children drastically different depending on gender (or do you think there is biological cause for little girls to prefer pink and boys to prefer blue?), and attempts not to do this have shown that while biological differences in temperament exist (esp. post puberty when we get all those hormones) girls and boys who are raised the same show much less difference in behavior (they did this in kindergarden not far from were I live, once hey got old enough for school the teachers thought the boys were unusual well behaved while the girls were "wild" when the truth was they behaved pretty much the same). Yeah there are cultural ways of raising kids that differ from culture to culture, but a lot of those differences in culture are shaped by our biological differences and stem from them. That's what shaped the culture in which we raise our children differently. Different things are expected of men and women. I can't really comment on what you're talking about. It's sounds more like a personal experience than an actual study, and I doubt those kids' behavior remained the same when they hit puberty.

Nah if magic existed, men would be better at it than women, so they'd have just as much dominance if not more.

Why not just wear clothes like it's the medieval age? Why not have the rights they had back then, sewing, cleaning and cooking all day long. One of the reasons women wore a ton of clothes like that was because women were looked down on by society for showing skin. So then you'll have women complaining about there being nothing wrong with a woman's sexuality and her showing it off and how it's empowering. It's not like the majority of women today don't show some form of cleavage, wear tight clothes so you can see their curves, show legs off, etc. It amazes me people can complain about this stuff in video games, when we see this everywhere in society. TV, movies, magazines women purchase, etc. Women sure as hell aren't fighting all those things. They consume all of it daily.

Men and women can never be equal. Our differences have come from thousands of years of evolution and are biological. The woman in the OP is complaining about something that exists not only in video games but society itself. So singling out the video game industry is incredibly stupid. But hey she got 7,000 people to give her $150k. Really women only have the not getting equal pay for equal work thing to complain about. All the rest is BS. And there is nothing productive that can come out of talking about this because everyone already knows that we can never really be equal. The truth isn't going to change.

It's a massive ball of 'oh god stop making my side look like raging idiots facepalm cringe headwall how did people donate to her again'. Yes. There's searching for examples of inequity in media, and there's flying off the handle for everything that does not make women super-empowered and super-capable. Both of which are just as bad. Well she did get 150k for doing probably a month of part time work. Maybe I'll do my own video series on how men are oppressing women in video games. I'm a man so it should be more controversial and my voice for females rights should be more poignant.

I just watched the video in the OP. All I can say is WOW. That girl is coo coo.

I am special, so I should roleplay someone special.

Weirdos maybe, but still a large group of consumers who will snatch any game, that has word "romances" in the description. If included we want them done good, while they don't particularly care about the quality of said romances. Large? No. To be honest these people are one of the reasons RPGs have declined in recent years. These people should be chastised and shunned from RPG forums. WAT? What the hell? Am I child that needs to have his ego stroked every 5 minutes. Ego stroking is one thing I utterly hate. Yes. He's really just talking about enjoying the game in different ways. Whether it's character progression or solving a puzzle, or NPCs complimenting your deeds in the game.

Yeah but that's different from needing to have donated $25 which is what you mentioned. There also hasn't been mention of any separate forums that only people with badges can post in.

MCA mentions in a blog recently about companions should be optional so you aren't forced to bring them along if you don't like them. http://forums.obsidian.net/blog/1/entry-168-project-eternity-and-characterization/ Some good stuff in there.

Don't worry about us getting left out Dlux. If they do create a badge system, you can rest assure we'll have ours and be posting the same stuff we post here there. It'll be just as civilized and unbiased in that thread.

I want to make an unbiased and very civilized poll on romances, where only backers can vote after the Kickstarter has ended. I do not doubt that any of the romance haters have not pledged and I have also not even written this. Keep playing innocent. Anyone with a brain can see you're full of crap and insinuating that. That's why you keep mentioning the poll in every post. Ohh, are we getting mad and resorting to insults? lol. Keep on going, so that this thread is locked. :D I only brought it up again because evdk did. Think before you post. Anyway, that is the problem. Some of you romance haters are extremely aggresive and stubborn. I'm not mad at all. I just call it how I see it. You're the one who is passively, aggressively insulting people who don't agree with you. Saying you want an unbiased and civilized poll. That implies that anyone who doesn't agree with you in this thread isn't.

I want to make an unbiased and very civilized poll on romances, where only backers can vote after the Kickstarter has ended. I do not doubt that any of the romance haters have not pledged and I have also not even written this. Oh come on. You keep mentioning only kickstarters can vote in the poll in every post. You're also insinuating the people who don't support your opinion aren't civilized and unbiased. I guess we're biased for playing RPGs and not liking romances.

No he isn't saying that. Nice try at flipping it off of you. He just thinks they're plan matches up with his opinion. That's not manipulation. He's not trying to create another thread and poll that's more favorable to his opinion with only certain people able to vote like you are. Oh really? Is that what he meant when he wrote this: Nope. Wrong. Anyway: If you can'tr afford $25 and back the game' date=' then you won't be able to vote. It will just be a simple unbiased poll with many choices (unlike this one). If you don't like that, well then stop me. ^^ [/quote']That's not the same as creating a poll that supports your opinion. He just thinks they won't announce no romances until after the kickstarter is over. That's not him manipulating anyone. So now you have to have donated at least $25 instead of backed the lower tiers? I guess those early birds who donated $20 are screwed then for donating early.

Yeah that does sound good, but a lot of people like black and white decisions types. That's why we have alignment bars and alignment points we gain by performing certain actions. It's not too difficult to choose and requires little thinking. I'd enjoy a more gray system though.

No he isn't saying that. Nice try at flipping it off of you. He just thinks they're plan matches up with his opinion. That's not manipulation. He's not trying to create another thread and poll that's more favorable to his opinion with only certain people able to vote like you are.

I've often thought about this myself. Evil usually is pretty bad in games. The problem I see with this is when you're good you're helping everyone with their problems and doing all their quests out of the goodness of your heart. I can't think of a way to make evil smart in these kinds of situations. It would just come off as being a brute, or evil for the sake of it because you'd be threatening them or doing it for gold and then betraying them. I just can't see it. The evil character would have to be doing things completely different, maybe in a different part of the world, which would mean a different story and options in the game which isn't feasible yet.

Amen! Addition a romance to the story is not a problem of recourse. It is a problem of depth of the game, sure you can have wonderful over all story, but weather that is a relationship in form of romance or just friendship it WILL be included in the game, I am almost 100% sure of that. Why? because NPC;s are not just mobs that run around with you for killing things, they have their own stories and they bring something of their own to the story. Romance can only add to that not damage it (if it is not a complete fail that is - however that is story writers problem, not developers) When people are talking about romance, they're talking about pursuing relationships with their companions. That doesn't include friendships with your party and background about them. I'd like to see those too, but I know they will fall by the wayside if there are romances.

Read the poll. There are people who have voted for romances no matter what significant resources were taken from other parts of the game. That's incredibly entitled.

And that's why Dlux wants to create another thread and poll so only people for romance can vote, so she can manipulate the developers.