Bartimaeus

Fair enough, you make some good points in support of reddit. I can understand why people would want to create an unusual or possibly older discussion like that example you gave about Frozen 2. You wouldn't have the same number of people participating in that type of discussion if you created a thread like that on these forums So then what went wrong in your opinion? It seems that the reddit admins don't really understand the relevance or importance of the moderators that maintain the smaller discussions and subreddits ? Is that why there is "reddit revolt " from some forums ? Small correction to what I said: I was actually trying to say Frozen...2 years after it was released. Not Frozen 2...years after it was released. Doesn't really matter, but Frozen 2 hasn't, you know, released yet or anything. I think a number of things went wrong...and are continuing to go wrong. Funnily enough, what Zoraptor and Barothmuk kind of mention one aspect of it: the terrible functionality of the website...though not quite in the way I think they were talking about. Moderators have to install third party plugins for their browsers to be able to moderate beyond anything besides basic functions. I didn't know this until recently, but apparently they've been complaining about this for years, with the administrators consistently promising change but delivering nothing. Another problem is the issue of censorship...the former CEO of reddit, some guy named Yishan, said that the stated ideal of reddit was to be a free speech platform. The current administration, under CEO Ellen Pao, has gone against this, saying that it is not meant to be a free speech platform. Even though this wasn't really true, in my opinion, even with the previous administration, they've certainly kicked things up a notch or two since, banning subs that are determined to be "harassing"...and being extremely inconsistent in doing so. I have mixed feelings about this: on one hand, I don't like those harassment subs myself...but I don't think they should be Big Brothered. I also think that a company like reddit should have the ability to clean itself up of content that it, and most normal people, would find reprehensible. What I would've preferred to have seen is removal of such offending subs from ever being visible from the /r/all front page (essentially, the page where all subreddits can be visible depending on some upvote/time created formula...which is the page that guests users see when they visit...as opposed to what is simply called the "front" page, which is personalized based on what subreddits you're subscribed to as a logged in user): not only would this clean up the site, it would decrease the likelihood of new subscribers/content for those subs. It also would've likely prevented the huge crapstorm calling out reddit for its censorship as well as its inconsistency: the subs that were banned were vile, yes, but there were many more just like them that have still not been touched in any way since. As a result of these complications, the userbase was kind of split on whether the subs being banned was a good thing or not: some thought free speech (to a point) trumped whatever reasons for banning them were, others hated the content so much they were simply glad that it was gone and weren't really interested in any such implications. Then there was the fact that Victoria, almost absolutely the favorite admin for being an apparently genuinely wonderful person as well as actually critical to some subreddits...the very large default subreddit iama as well as smaller subreddits who would do similar things and employ Victoria's services...was fired for reasons still not yet explained, and absolutely no communication about it was conveyed by the admins to the moderators who required her services in order for events in their subs to work. Furthermore, the admins have been pretty unhelpful even since the crapstorm: took a look at kirottu's post above, where you can see the head admin basically try and strongarm the iama science mods (who were going to do an AMA with Stephen Hawking before Victoria got fired) without offering any real information or *anything* concrete in return for cooperating. (EDIT: If you're having trouble reading that image, uh...I can't blame you. Took me a bit, too. Pay attention to the "to" and "from" fields: red kn0thing is the admin, the green users are the moderators, and when the message itself is green, it means the moderator is sending a message to that user. There are still a few odd bits - like, why does the admin repeat lines of what the moderator says and then stick on additional bits - but that should help.) Just stupid behavior on the parts of the admins. FURTHERMORE, what was probably the SECOND favorite admin was also fired recently...and for, get this...having cancer. That admin ran the reddit secret santa program, which you can Google if you want more information about, as well as this story, if you wish. Finally, Ellen Pao, the CEO, keeps going onto news sites like buzz feed and trying to downplay the events that recently transpired, as well as the complaints of the userbase, saying that it was "minor", and that most users did not really care about all of this. I don't know how much truth to that there is, but the fact of the matter is, you shouldn't be saying crap like that as the CEO of one of the largeset websites in the world...that just got more or less incapacitated by those so-called "minor" issues/complaints. Bah.

It's as moderated as the moderators want to spend time moderating it. Obviously, for the larger subs, it's harder to maintain a cohesive subreddit culture a la what you'd find here on the Obsidian forums, where you probably have sub-100 active posting users (particularly if we're considering different sections analogous to different subreddits: then the number is surely even lower for individual sections). That's the result of having thousands to tens of thousands of active posters...and that's why you branch out to smaller and more tight-knit subreddits. Besides for really rare cases, I never bother posting in the larger subreddits, because there's no sense of community and unless you're one of the first posters into a topic, basically nobody's going to read your post, anyways. Smaller subreddits, functionality and community-wise, are often pretty analogous to a forums like these...it's just a matter of finding them. Reddit serves as a great collection of little communities that you can integrate yourself into: if I want to discuss Frozen 2 years after it's released because I just watched it for the first time recently, reddit is pretty much the only forum-type website where I could possibly do that that's going to have any amount of activity...because though the Frozen subcommunity will be small by reddit standards, reddit is huge, and it doesn't take too much effort to stay "current" with smaller subreddits that are a little slower than others...and if something interest pops up, a bunch of people will still see it and be able to interact with each other...whereas a forums-website specifically dedicated to Frozen will surely have died off by now. Furthermore, due to the mechanics of reddit, subreddits aren't usually as susceptible to "forum politics" as much as actual forums...since it's much easier to hold people - even moderators - responsible for their insane actions/opinions via downvotes. This, in itself, sometimes has problems, but in my opinion, usually does a decent job at hiding stuff most decent people don't want to see and highlighting, at the very least, O.K. stuff. And if you want the stuff that's controversial, well, it's usually still there if not actually breaking the rules of reddit and/or the subreddit - just go down. "When people are allowed to say what they want with no sense of consequence they start to believe what they are saying and this leads to anti-social behavior and perspectives" They are held accountable: by moderators and by user downvotes: that's more accountable than you'd ever find on a forum like this, where people like Volourn are able to launch personal attacks constantly and with seemingly zero consequences...so I'm not sure what you're talking about. Reddit has problems, certainly...but so would any large website with its gigantic number of users in the larger subreddits. That's why you go to the smaller ones...and the ones not directly related to size are different, but IMO equal, problems compared to any forums. (e): English, more thoughts.

The amount of prejudice (and possibly ignorance) in this thread is a little surprising to me. What's made the lot of you hate reddit so much?

As some people in America do...illegally or at least immorally, I might add.

I don't think I've ever seen the actual word "customers" used in relation to redditors at any point over the past year or so I've been on reddit. Perhaps you've been on reddit longer than I have and know better, : I'm sure there are people who have, but I seriously doubt it's in any way a significant proportion.

??? Reddit's community knows all too well that they are not the website's customers: hence the campaign against buying reddit gold as well as turning on advertisement blocking plugins. They're not reddit's "customers", but they have some influence over how happy those customers will be.

Wasn't that weeks ago, though?

Looks basically like the difference between no anisotropic filtering and max anisotropic filtering...

Not really. It's simply a humongous waste of bandwidth, digital mediocrity of the most egregious sort. The same could be said of everywhere.

Hah. To be fair, that IS/was part of the problem...in my opinion, such contentious subreddits should've been simply restricted from being seen on /r/all as a sort of test trial, to see if that would ease the image problem some. Certainly would've been a better first step than outright banning, anyways. The administrators refused to back down from that, though...however, this current "revolt" seems much more widely supported and clean cut than that one was, which I am glad for, since the current administration really does suck and needs a change. To be completely honest, I think the majority of the "defaults" (essentially, for anyone who doesn't use reddit, the biggest subreddits on the site that everyone is, by "default", subscribed to when they sign up to reddit) are pretty bad. The biggest subreddit I'm subscribed to is the NFL subreddit, which only has like 500k subscribers...paltry compared to the millions and millions for the defaults, and it still has some pretty serious issues. Still better than most any other football-dedicated forum you can go to, though...so that's where I go! (edit): BBC article: http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-33379571 Funny: "about 100 [...] subreddits [...] are believed to have been shut [down]". Last I saw, the number was almost at 10x that...which was a few hours ago. More: http://www.businessinsider.sg/reddit-in-chaos-hundreds-subreddits-go-private-after-victoria-leaves-iama-2015-7/#.VZZn0_lK35o & http://www.forbes.com/sites/emmawoollacott/2015/07/03/ask-me-anything-except-why-victoria-taylor-was-fired-from-reddit/2/

Clarification? I haven't heard anything about this. This sounds more related to the subreddit bannings earlier...uh...last month or so. I'm sure that particular bit of business taking place so recently hasn't helped this situation either, but the current protest still seems to be more about Victoria and issues with the current administration in general rather than that.

Victoria was a community liaison, I guess you could say. In particular, she served as a go between for celebrities or other persons of interest and the reddit platform and community, specifically for the "IAmA" subreddit (as well as any other subreddits doing anything similar), which stands for...uh, I think stands for simply I Am [blank] or I Am A [blank], which combines with "AMA", which stands for Ask Me Anything. Basically, in forum terms, it's one of the biggest "sections" (subreddits) on reddit, and the IAMA threads are huge, particularly when you get celebrities like Arnold Schwarzenegger or Morgan Freeman or whomever answering random questions upvoted by the community to be answered by them. It was essentially her job to set this stuff up and be there to communicate for them if necessary (as well as make sure the "correct" questions were being asked of them: she would ask them the frivolous questions like "what's your favorite movie(s)", but also throw in the harder questions when asked appropriately, like "explain your flip-flopping on this one political issue" or whatever), and without her, the entire system of things broke down. The current reddit administration stinks so bad, they didn't even bother telling anybody she had been fired until they were actually trying to do the AMAs, by which point it was clear that yeah, it's now pretty much impossible to do it. This, combined with some other stuff, has culminated with subreddit moderators basically going, "screw the current administrators, their lack of communication, and what's been going on lately with reddit", and proceeding to shut themselves down temporarily as a form of complaint: this hides/restricts content and destroys traffic. Essentially, the message is "fix/clean this crap up". Nearly a thousand different "subreddits" (community-moderated sections that have a particular focus, essentially...like the aforementioned IAMA or others like /r/jokes or /r/news or /r/gaming, etc.) have shut themselves down at this time. (edit): Oh yeah, and the President, too, I guess. There have been many, many, many different celebrities over the years. *shrug* And yeah, reddit is...extremely popular. Very likely the most popular "forum"-type website on the internet: I certainly can't think of any websites like this that are more notable...besides maybe 4chan? I would think reddit has outstripped 4chan at this point, but maybe not.

https://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/comments/3bw0vc/people_even_neogaf_founderadmin_evillore_is_tired/ The link the reddit topic goes to is currently dead, unfortunately, but I assume that'll be back sooner or later. (edit): The reddit link may or may not be broken, too: with the current reddit crapstorm going on, the subreddit may disappear like a lot of others.

Some people need to put a bit more value on their time. It's one thing to sit through the last hour of a movie, it's another thing to finish up a 50+ hour video game. How many hours were spent in misery? Say we round up and call it a 60 hour game, and we spent $60 on it. That means you spent a dollar an hour. So once the game has become a chore, you are basically grinding to get that last dollar per hour out of a bad game. Throwing extra time at a bad investment is never a good idea. A friend gifted me Dark Souls 2 and its (then) $40's worth of DLC on Steam...I completed the game even though I knew I hated it almost immediately. Sometimes, you just feel compelled to finish things you don't like...

Cradle of Western civilization...not the pinnacle. The Renaissance kept moving on without the Eastern Roman (Greek) Empire for a reason, after all. Possibly something to do with a kebab, last I heard...

The only thing Quinn really deserved criticism for, IMO, was her demonization of the Fine Young Capitalists project. Outside of that, she may not have been exactly a lovely-seeming person, but anger should've been more focused at the actual game journalists whom she may or may not have had relations with...who're the ones that actually failed to disclose said relations.

What if you dislike both series equally?

At the start of this whole thing, I was mildly in support of GG: I agreed with a lot of their stated ideals (though not all), but I didn't particularly want to be associated with them due to reputation issues: more specifically, the louder more fringe (in my opinion) elements, but as well as the problem of needless polarization and demonization (again, in my opinion) between the different factions at least partly borne out of what I felt was a combination of both ignorance and obtuseness on both sides. I just did not want to be a part of it regardless of which side I more closely aligned with. There was also the fact that I view the gaming industry as a bit of a lost cause for a variety reasons at this point anyways (and not limited just to GG's stances, I might add: I take at least few from opposing viewpoints, too, though I may have somewhat different thoughts on them...but that's true for GG's stances, too). Nowadays, even though my opinions in this regard haven't much changed, I feel more strongly aligned with GG than before - even though I sometimes still disagree with some of the methods and ideas employed by the movement, I disagree even more with some of what I consider to be the lunacy of the anti-GG. I am still, however, not actually associating with them, though. However...I find it ironic that you're the one asking me this, Bruce, because you're at least partly to blame for that: when somebody mentions "anti-GG", I can't but help think of you as being my sort of mental "representation" for their ideas and ideals and arguments...and your posts on this subject as well as in other political topics are genuinely so infuriating to me (yes, yours specifically: no-one else in these topics that I disagree with - even those I chronically disagree with - has ever gotten even half as bothersome to me so far), that the anti-GG side seems almost anathematic to me at this point. I don't mean this to devolve into a personal attack, particularly because you seem like a mostly genuinely pleasant person outside of these topics (and also you seem to attempt to be pleasant even inside of them, although it mostly seems to have the opposite effect on me)...but every time I enter one of these topics and I see posts like your latest ones in this topic (not necessarily the ones in reply to Amentep - besides the "degrade" one - or the one to aluminiumtrioxid, but the oh-so-condescending ones before in reply to Meshuggah and Orogun), I can't help but consider putting you on my ignore list because I know that there's no way that I can discuss with you in a acceptable manner (in regards to the rules and basic politeness) without at least reverting to extreme passive-aggressiveness...which is still not acceptable to me, seeing as I'm very often not correct/100% on the mark all of the time, which, combined with me likely sounding like a jerk to you and everyone else, is not something I really want to be engaging with. It's also not very healthy/satisfactory for me, either. Again, sorry if this seems mean and overly personal: I really don't mean to be, and I'm trying to make it as polite as possible while still being honest: you just drive me crazy in these sorts of topics, Bruce. I also recognize that this is purely a personal problem. Anyone who wants to criticize me in turn, feel free to take a shot so I can feel better about this post. Alternatively, you can deny me that and make me extra feel like a jerk. It's up to you, readers. (edit): Also, this took me literally like 45 minutes to write out. Don't say I didn't try my best, at the very least.

Amentep edited this in after I already liked his post and refreshed the page (and so it's not possible to change it), so I would just like everyone to know before people possibly start to think differently of me as a result...I really liked that part, too.

Not if one of the groups is wearing hazmat suits. The hazmat suits would get dirty. And in taking them off the people inside might get dirty. And the person who cleans them might get dirty. And the person inside might get dirty if the suit isn't properly sealed... ...what was my point again? The hazmat suit wearers can wipe each other down before taking off their hazmat suits. Crisis averted. (edit): Except for those not wearing the hazmat suits. They're still very dirty.

Not if one of the groups is wearing hazmat suits.

Alexander the Great would like to have a word with you. (edit): Never mind: I guess this is supposed to literally refer to the modern day countries, not the region/land itself. Turkey being blue also makes zero sense. Carry on!

From the previous topic. Why not make your own topic? (edit) Look, if you're hesitant to post your own thread because it will not receive its due notice or whatever...consider the fact that other posters often make semi-ridiculous threads with very limited scope/focus, and are still able to get some replies at the very least. You think yours is better than that at the very least, right? Maybe you won't get the replies you want...but after like 3 or 4 posts in this topic (and the previous iteration of it) without any real discussion on what you're posting, you clearly aren't getting that in here, either. (e): I also hate feeling like I'm being mean and trying to mini-mod or something...but I just don't feel like your posts are appropriate for this topic. If others disagree, speak up and start discussing now!

I thought italicizing would be sufficient, but alas, I should've stuck with my initial instinct to bold instead.