jaguars4ever

*crickets chirping*

If we're dividing it into infinitesimally small intervals, then it would be infinitely long.

Try it AT gmail DOT com, Skynet.

Perhaps not - but you do for his website I believe.

I also assume over 2,000,000 people in this country filed for banckrupcy, maxed out their limits and are heavily in debt as a result, thereby destroying their credit & rendering their ability to purchase online unviable this year.

He's also stated that he's going to be playing PC games for a very very very very very very very very very long time. People's opinions change, as do their financial diversity. Although he might have quoted the above previously, he most definately stated the above-above in this thread. --- I'd be surprised if he didn't have the ability to purchase the game. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The ability to purchase online differs from the ability to puchase off retail shelves given the intrinsic nature of credit cards and e-commerce.

Not ostensibly, but yet it was a factor. Hades stated he doesn't/has never/will never buy games online. That straight aways implies his market demand criteria. -- Willingness alone does not constitute market demand, although it is one of the the two necessary components. Willingness AND ability to purchase puts an individual in that market.

Ah - becase Ender stated that for someone like Hades (who constitutes a part of the common PC game market demand), $25 for for software (that solely caters to an online niche market supply), is not considered overpriced (for the common PC game market).

Neither did I. (w00t) Also: The book bundle with shipping and taxes is clearly around $100 if I'm not mistaken.

I still fail to see how this claim to be hardcore RPG player that doesn't care about graphics, yet can't look past the poor graphics of Geneforge, relates to me.

Well, atm it doesn't have common market value as it's not on the market. If it were however, I'm sure the invisible hand would determine what it would sell at. Interestingly enough, if it were on the shelves for $1, although people would buy it at $1, that wouldn't be it's market price. For you see, Spidersoft would not be albet to affored to sell it at that price. As such, even though buyer demand is present, seller supply is not. Hence, $1 would not be the market price. --- So? His game specifically targets that niche market. In fact, the majority of successful online resellers have very limited product selection and market to specific audiences. It's easy to sell someone a product if they are specifically looking for it. It's why Overture began offering reverse lookup tools to see what people were searching for and whatnot. If he was to try to get non-RPG players to play his game, then yeah it'd be more difficult. But he doesn't. He knows his market, and the games he makes appeal to his market. That's all that matters. The entire PC gaming market is NOT the market for Geneforge. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Right - so although $25-32 may be the market value for his online niche market based of his website, it is not for the general PC game market. As such, $25-32 should not be expected to be the price for the common PC game market. Given that Hades doesn't purchase games online (as thus does not participate in his online niche market), but instead buys off retail shelves, he shouldn't be expected to be charged that rate.

Rat Poaching Galore. :D

Except for the fact that people art not willing to pick up Genofoge off the shelf for $25 OR Spider cannot afford to sell it off the shelf at $25. Which is why it's not there. As such, Genoforge fails to have a normal PC market value of $25.

Maybe you're right - but you speak of a niche market based of a website online rather thand the actual PC Game market from retailers. For the latter Genoforge has a maket value of $0 ; as either buyers demand is not sufficient to meet Genoforge's asking price to warrant competion in this market, or Genoforge finds it financially unprofitable to sell at a price the PC game market base desires to purchase at. Either scenario puts it out of the normal PC game maket base - which is why it's not there.

The invisible hand my friend. If Genoforge was put on retailers shelves, the value at which most sales took place - be it $49, $29, $15 or whatnot, etc. is what determines the market value. In other words, what the majority of demand is willing to pay for it.

Yes - I'm saying value is not directly proportional to quality of experience. Irrelevant - see above: Value is not directly proportional to quality of experience.

A seller's asking price is not market value Alanschu. Only where the asking price intersects with the buying price of the market demand, one deduce the market price. The fact is, Genoforge neither has a market supply or demand based in the tradition PC market, i.e. on retailer shelves, most likely because it's not capable of competing in this maket base. It caters to and online niche from it's website alone. You can buy bubble gum wrappers from people's websites for $10. That doesn't make it market value.

You would. Maybe I would. But the majority of the PC game market base probably wouldn't. --- You're putting words in my mouth. An unusual habit of late. I never said Genoforge was not capable of immersion, nor did I pass judgement of the quality of the game based on screenshots. I merely noted the technology used and inferred the market value of said obsolute tech.

Every piece of software has market value Alanschu. You may not like it, but it's a fact. Athtough few might be willing to pay more than market value for their purchases, the majority will not. If General Motors were to sell their '95 vehicles on the lot for the same price of their 2005 Mustangs it would not sell - even if it's been thoroughly serviced, upgraded, or is even faster or more luxurious than their newer models. Software, just like cars, also depreciates. "Quality of experience" is a subjective concept. Market value, however is not. Old tech simply isn't worth as much as their newer counterparts. It's economics I'm afraid.

@Ender: Nah - that's only Roshan. :D The determining factor you speak of for us "purists" is immersion. Many modern glitzy RPG's tend to suffer from this not necessarily because of their graphics - but from poor writing, lack of character development, overuse of deus ex machina or other plot devices etc. But yes, some might argue that ultra pseudo-realistic RPG's are actually counterproductive due to an uncanny valley of sorts. However, any detraction in immersion is most likely to be due to the aforementioned former rather than the latter.

It's not just hours though Ender - game software depreciates with age. You could pickup the quality threesome of FO, FO2 & PS:T for $10-15 - for ALL of them. The Genoforge's probably aren't that old (perhaps Ender or Alanschu can shed light here), but it's practically equivalent to the same thing as they're using obsolute 16-bit technology. True - graphics hardly bears any correlation to a quality role playing experience, but you simply can't compete as a software developing company if selling obsolute tech at that kind of price. That's why tradition developers don't do it. But Spiderweb seem to have found their forte catering to an online market niche, as opposed to the traditional industry. I'm inclined to believe Hades does have a point - even though the quality of experience may rival full price RPG's, when abandonware offers similar quality technology, $25-32 can be argued to be pushing it. Say, someone comes up with a FO sequel based on the Wasteland engine (bless it's soul), and puts them out on the shelves for 30 odd bucks - how many folks do you think will buy it?

Not too mention he was lame. Fine - he had is place in the plot, but as a party NPC? C'mon you gotta be kidding me.

I gue$$ not.

This is how it's done. :D

This was certainly a very parodic session. "