Shdy314

To prove what you said isn't justified, let me give you an example: MAJOR STAR WARS: EPISODE III SPOILER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Before the Anakin/Obi-Wan duel, Padme gets out of the ship that Obi-Wan came in. Obi-Wan didn't know she was in there. She was in there to try to come and bring Anakin back to good. Anakin loved her and everything, we see this in Attack of the Clones. But Anakin is so upset that Padme is not seeing things his way, he force chokes her, and uses force push to throw her body up against a wall where she is knocked out. Later on she dies just after giving birth to the twins. END SPOILER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So what you are saying about you being DS but doing what Bastila says cause you love her doesn't mean anything as I proved in that example. Yeah you don't know what happens in EPIII so you can not use a bunch of rumor and speculation in your argument. Anyways it proves nothing he said a LS Jedi might fall to the DS because they love Bastila. In your example Anakin is basically DS all upset and angry and then CHOOSES to force choke Padme. What about when he chooses to kill the Emperor after 20 years of evil deeds because he loves Luke? It's about choice. Your idea takes that away and that is why it will never happen. Try and be open to the evidence and don't just react to disagreements with your idea.

Your analogy is comepletely fallacious. People are not objective like a test. I already said this before but Ill say it again. LS JEDI ARE ALWAYS IN DANGER OF THE DS. No matter how great and good your character is through the whole game he can still fall to the DS and this is reflected in KOTOR 1. You idea gives me roleplaying options through the game but then suddenly at the end I get no control of my character? No thank you.

You are forgetting that the Sith Empire stood for a thousand years because they were hiding from the Jedi and rest of the galaxy on that world. The instant those people (names I forget) came to their homeworld giving the Sith hyperdrive coordinates for important planets throughout the galaxy the Sith began fighting and disagreeing. One side wanted to keep biding their time and the other wanted to try and take over the galaxy. It was not overdone in KOTOR because the Sith have never had rules to face each other in any book, movie or game I've ever seen. They have always backstabbed and betrayed each other like this. So for continuity reasons you can't just suddenly make the Sith a more united race. The Drow are a good analogy but remember the Sith are not the Drow. The Drow have rules for killing each other and the Sith don't. The Sith in fact ENCOURAGE their apprentices to take any opportunity to kill and advance their station. Also the Drow could probably have taken over Faerun long ago but they too like the Sith are divided. In the case of the Drow they have the houses.

I think you're wrong. First of all your earlier decisions are not nullified by giving you a final decision. Playing it LS or DS affected your characters powers, how quests went, how people viewed you, what items you could use etc. People think just because one thing happens everything earlier is suddenly unimportant. Like nothing we did mattered in KOTOR 1 because the universe is threatened five years later even though in the books its saved and threatened every other day. In addition it made it easy for people to save their game there then check out the DS ending. Helpful for casual gamers or people that didn't want to play the whole game again just to see the DS ending. Bioware decided to give you a choice to go DS here just like in every other quest. I reached full LS status way before then and every quest I still got the opportunity to be evil. This is because the DS is an ever present threat no matter how "good" you think you are. You only think it's final because 1. it is simply the final quest you get. You are forgetting all those other quests you could do, and 2. because choosing the DS in this quest led to repercussions so vile and heinous you immediately fell to the DS instead of just slipping like in other minor quests. It is also supposed to be dramatic. It's the moment of truth for Revan. He is being offered a chance to regain everything that was taken from him. Will your LS jedi resist the temptation or finally fall. And likewise will your DS Jedi realize the error of his ways seeing Bastila the way she is or seize the opportunity? It is called Role-playing. DO NOT EVER FORCE ME TO BE GOOD OR BAD IN DIALOGUE. Always give me options.

The Sith consider themselves superior to everyone but especially non-force sensitive aliens. Not to mention being the hateful, racist type certainly makes you more susceptible to the DS in the first place.

The Empire did relegate aliens to second class citizens status.

The Sith are comepletely self destructive because they value taking any opportunity to betray and kill higher ranked Sith to take their place. Take Malak for example. Their in the middle of a battle and he orders his ship to fire on Revan's flagship. Revan didn't show any weakness, killing him didn't make the Sith stronger. What rules are there? I've never seen these rules in any SW book, game or movie. It'd be one thing if you had to challenge them one on one in fair duels but there seems to be no difference between that and posioning their drink or stabbing them in the back while their in the middle of a battle. No matter how strong/careful/etc. you are anyone near you gets opportunities like this eventually. Think of when you stand in a train terminal and the train is coming. If someone pushes you right in front of the train, you didn't die because you're a weak and incompetent leader. Someone just got lucky. In the EU aren't all the Sith but Darth Bane wiped out in a major battle because of this betrayal and dissension? That's serious proof of their self destructive behavior right there. Not only that but masters hold things back from their students to keep them weak nd less likely to betray them thus weakening the Sith as a whole. I see some people saying the Sith should be rewritten so they aren't so treacherous. Sorry but this is really stupid. This is supposed to be the Sith's greatest weakness. They don't have many you know. Unlike LS Jedi. And it comepletely goes against everything they are. The DS is based on passion and power. Look at their creed. By their very beliefs they cannot temper their passion or pass up opportunities to gain greater power. This is why the rule of two was implemented.

That'd be kewl. They just need to give the little guy a bit more personality.

Revan described as one of the greatest tactical geniuses in SW history with Battle Meditation and a massive ever expanding fleet on his side would have to have made some HUGE mistakes in a really important battle. B)

Noob is just boon spelled backwards. Newb is the ugly word. Noobs are boons because they will become new vets and buy the game and increase sales and profits encouraging sequels and keeping good companies in business. Some can be annoying though. Noob is "Elite language?" Come to think of it what is elite language?

PnP don't often translate well to crpgs. Often some things just aren't possible to implement which unbalances things forcing other things to be dropped for balance. If I want to play SW D20 Ill go play that. Otherwise I prefer game developers to feel free to pick and choose what they wish and design their game based on what is best for their crpg and not feel pressured to include little unimportant things because they are in D20.

The game was not supposed to be a replica of the SW D20 system. It took ideas from it but it was never supposed to be a pnp translation to computer like NWN s yeah they put in their own feats and things.

Didn't happen like that for me. Bastards.

Carth always ran away. Even if you were a female and had a romance going. At least in the X-box version.

How could they have an if it ain't broken approach to skills when they are so obviously broken? These are my thoughts and an attempt to organize the problems with skills so not every idea is good. Please expand on mine and chime in with your own. Ok, so there were a lot of problems with skills. The biggest problem, as was mentioned, is of course the lightsaber. So the question becomes how do we keep the lightsaber as powerful as it should be without nerfing it with something as stupid as putting Cortosis in everything? Which I will address in Security. We also need to think of how every skill was implemented and what made it useless? Awareness: Arguably this and demolitions were the second least useless skills since credits were so hard to come by in the game (X-box version at least) I always used Mission to recover traps and then sell them. However the traps did not do nearly enough damage. By the end I could run through them and If I needed to then force heal. And there were not nearly enough. I wouldn't change this skill other than to put in more traps and increase their damage. This would neccessitate making Powerful hostile NPCs like Dark Jedi do awareness checks or for gameplay reasons traps just don't do as much to enemies as they do to you. Otherwise setting traps and luring enemies could become really cheesy like in Throne of Bhaal. I think being a Jedi should confer an automatic bonus in this well as well due to the force and/or allows you to run without awareness penalties. Also possibly use it in dialogue sometimes to use this as insight. Like PE in FO2. Demolitions: Basically the same as Awareness. Increased power in traps makes recovering/disarming them more important and desirable. Careful scaling of their difficulty to disarm and their damage ability makes keeping this skill high more important. Computer Use: Everything important had a keycard. No way around this except for missions where someone with high computer use HAS to be in your party. The suggestion to remove computer spikes comepletely is a good one. There were hundreds and hundreds of spikes in the game. I didn't care if the cost was 20 or 2 I am willing to bet if you took all the spikes in the game and then checked the maximum cost for every time you could use them there'd be a lot more spikes than uses. Hacking should be based solely on the skill and have DC like traps. A FEW spikes throughout the game to help in one time situations is fine. High computer use can be neccessary in sidequests just not plot critical ones. Stealth: IS useful. I know not many people used it but Mission can be a real bad ass with it. HOWEVER the belt is no good. It isn't so useful you'll want your character to wear a stealth belt over something like CNS strength amplifier. And switching the stealth belt to CNS after every "backstab" would be annoying as hell. So get rid of the belt. Items can still enhance it but not be required. To appease people that want realism simply make it activated by some item in your inventory or even kewler add it to the equippable inventory. Like an addon that can be attached to any belt. This would allow for some cool new items that clip onto your belt and let someone with a low stealth skill but a really good stealth enhancer slip by low DC aware enemies. Repair: Only useful for HK-47. Apparently it and security will now affect the workbench and people have already made some really good suggestions so I can skip over this. Persuade: Slightly useful. As with the other skills include more times to use it AND make it a viable alternative to Dominate:Mind. For example dont let me use dominate when it's a powerful force user. Make it less likely to work on force users so If Im really charismatic I'll have a better chance with Persuade than Dominate:Mind. Let Dominate Mind work as a back-up in some situations so If I fail in a persuade check I'll have the option then to Dominate:Mind. Make other characters more mindful of when and how I use it. There were some great conversations with party members when you used it especially for landing fees. That was great but all they did was talk. Hopefully this should be a part of the party members reacting more to a DS or LS character. This way I can ask for a larger reward from a good person using persuade and not get DS points and not angering good people but using Dominate:Mind to do it would be. (Longest because it addresses the lightsaber issue) Security: The lightsaber issue. Yes, the lightsaber is the master key and should remain so. Here's what you do. Trap more items! This is so easily explained in a futuristic universe. In bases for example practically everything should rigged to either explode or set off an alarm that spawns extra enemies that converge on the alarm. Why? Very simply, KEYPADS. Security should be able to hack them and open doors and let you feel stealthy and sly where a brute character forces it open alerts the whole base, maybe sets off a bomb (now more damaging) and fights extra enemies. If the keypad is destroyed by a lightsaber or senses a door open without a code being entered there should be repercussions! Hacking should be a part of security and vice versa. Security should be enhanced SLIGHTLY with stealth. Perhaps these could be sync bonuses like in NWN a certain amount of ranks in disarm traps got you a +1 in setting them and vice versa. Let characters inclined to steal (especially DS people) anything that isn't bolted down stealth and then use security to open containers and steal from them without being caught and without turning characters hostile. Like a DS character may want to steal some armor from a Republic base but for many realistiuc and logical reasons doesn't want to anyone to know and have to slaughter a bunch of soldiers. Or even an LS character that justifies it by really needing the armor BUT obviously doesn't want to kill a bunch of good guys for it. I asked way back when in the KOTOR forums and was assured some things wouldn't be bashable and there would be opportunities where you would want to steal unseen rather than kill everyone and bash open containers but I was lied to. Also if combat is made more difficult this will encourage stealthy play. One possibility is to let the extra guards spawned in by the alarm give no xp or equipment. Then players will really want to avoid smashing their way through what should be a very heavily well defended base. Not every place should be like this obviously. Go ahead and let plenty of doors and containers be openable by lightsaber but keep it in context. A lock box in an apartment obviously wouldn't be trapped with a bomb or summon a bunch of guards. Some very important doors can be lightsaber immune. These can be big thick vault or blast doors etc. with cortosis and very difficult keypads to hack. Take for example that mining station the Ebon Hawk is on. Maybe there is a big vault like area with some super valuable ore or a lightsaber crystal or tons of credits that is quite obviously very expensively designed to keep people out no matter what. Then security people could try to hack the keypad. Computer users may find it buried deep in a computer's encrypted files and brute characters may find it in a desk that in addition to being trapped also is by a worthy foe they have to fight. Finally the most useless skill Treat Injury: Way more useless than even security or computer use. Why? One reason and one reason only: Force Cure/Heal. I must admit I'm kind of stumped by this one. I don't think I want to decrease the effectiveness of force healing or anything and should definitely be kept. You'd have to increase the medkits usefulness by a ridiculous amount and if you did that it'd probably already heal enough where it didn't matter if your treat injury was 0. I don't think crippled limbs and making it a doctor like skill is feasible either. Maybe just nix it comepletely. Ideas on this are very welcome. FINALLY (I know big sigh of relief) lessen the number of items there are that increase skills or make skill DCs very high. With the proper items Canderous could have some really high awareness and demolitions. Most characters by the end had some outrageously high skills with nothing in the game nearly difficult enough to justify needing them so high. So give out fewer skill points and items OR increase the DC. Make specialists more viable and make it so your character cannot do everything alone. And definitely do not add skills. Make the ones already in more useful in more situations. This is a lot better than having 20 skills and 2 times where each one is truly useful. Questions, suggestions, etc. all welcome so long as they are constructive and not "That is the longest dumbest post I've ever seen," kind of stuff.