How do you play Hierophant?

[Kadayko]

I like Cipher and I like Wizard, but does this multi-class actually work?

 

If you're casting wizard spells, you are not attacking, so you are not building up focus, but if you are attacking and building focus and casting cipher spells, where do the wizard spells come in?

 

What is the play pattern of this multi-class supposed to be? 

Edited May 12, 2018 by Kadayko

[Raven Darkholme]

I personally would use the wizard for selfbuffs, since they have 0 recovery time you can spam several selfbuffs at combat start, finish this with casting Concelhaut's staff and then got to work and build focus.

[nstgc]

I personally would use the wizard for selfbuffs, since they have 0 recovery time you can spam several selfbuffs at combat start, finish this with casting Concelhaut's staff and then got to work and build focus.

I actually found it a bit pointless, at least up to level 5, to cast the Staff. It uses up a spell slot and has a lengthy cast time. Also, it's bugged in my game and doesn't seem to actually heal. I would suggest going club instead so you can brain things so your spells stick better (-25 Will for several seconds).

 

But yeah. The general idea is to buff with wiz and then use Soul Blade to actually deal damage, though Arcane Assault is VERY nice due to its low cast time and ability to daze.

 

https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/97800-hierophant-advice-wizardsoul-blade-or-beguiler/

Edited May 12, 2018 by nstgc

[Lanyx]

I feel like there's just too much anti-synergy with wizard/cipher, and it's the class I wanted to play since multiclassing was announced.

Wizard spells don't generate focus, obviously, so you will mostly use them for buffs. That part is fine, but when you finally reach power level 7 and pick up your "ultimate" buff spell, Citzal's Martial Power... It disables spellcasting, so all of that focus you're generating will go unused, leaving your cipher class as just a 20% damage passive. Having to use borrowed instinct instead makes you wonder if your wizard half wouldn't be better as a fighter, rogue, or monk.

If soul annihilation was considered an ability instead of a spell so it could be used under CMP, this multiclass would feel much better. DAOM adding a little bit of action speed in addition to the dex inspiration (like swift strikes for example) wouldn't hurt either.

[nstgc]

I feel like there's just too much anti-synergy with wizard/cipher, and it's the class I wanted to play since multiclassing was announced.

 

Wizard spells don't generate focus, obviously, so you will mostly use them for buffs. That part is fine, but when you finally reach power level 7 and pick up your "ultimate" buff spell, Citzal's Martial Power... It disables spellcasting, so all of that focus you're generating will go unused, leaving your cipher class as just a 20% damage passive. Having to use borrowed instinct instead makes you wonder if your wizard half wouldn't be better as a fighter, rogue, or monk.

 

If soul annihilation was considered an ability instead of a spell so it could be used under CMP, this multiclass would feel much better. DAOM adding a little bit of action speed in addition to the dex inspiration (like swift strikes for example) wouldn't hurt either.

Its not an OP min-max build, but its very viable. At least so far for me. The wizard provides defense, and you don't need to pick up CMP. Even then you can go "Rarg! Hunk smash!" for a while to build up focus then when the buff ends you can one hit something with SA.

[RevBlue]

I actually use this multiclass to max CC and ability use.

I use the wizard's spells, mostly starting with chill fog/slicken for 1st level or starting with whispers of treason , then i have miasma of dull mindedness or bewildering spectacle on 2nd level.

3rd level i just recently got to, and i took Arduous Delay of Motion and Arcane Dampener.

 

When i spent my wizard spells, i got into cipher CC and some dmg spells. ie soul shock, more whispers of treason, eyestrike and most recently mental binding.

 

 

I think it works pretty well. Unless im missing something completely here?

[nstgc]

I actually use this multiclass to max CC and ability use.

I use the wizard's spells, mostly starting with chill fog/slicken for 1st level or starting with whispers of treason , then i have miasma of dull mindedness or bewildering spectacle on 2nd level.

3rd level i just recently got to, and i took Arduous Delay of Motion and Arcane Dampener.

 

When i spent my wizard spells, i got into cipher CC and some dmg spells. ie soul shock, more whispers of treason, eyestrike and most recently mental binding.

 

 

I think it works pretty well. Unless im missing something completely here?

That reminds me of a D&D (3.5e) character I made which was a CC-bot. No real damage output but no amount of defense could keep you safe. Give a round or two (never three) and everything was debuffed into uselessness.

[Spleenless_Extortionist]

I actually use this multiclass to max CC and ability use.

I use the wizard's spells, mostly starting with chill fog/slicken for 1st level or starting with whispers of treason , then i have miasma of dull mindedness or bewildering spectacle on 2nd level.

3rd level i just recently got to, and i took Arduous Delay of Motion and Arcane Dampener.

 

When i spent my wizard spells, i got into cipher CC and some dmg spells. ie soul shock, more whispers of treason, eyestrike and most recently mental binding.

 

 

I think it works pretty well. Unless im missing something completely here?

I have similar idea with my Beguiler/Generalist Hierophant CC-spammer. Beguiler replenishes focus at 5 + power level per hit with Deception powers on sneak attack qualifying enemies. So, if you use some AoE Deception spell (i.e. Mental Binding) on a bunch of afflicted targets (under effect of Chill Fog or somesuch), you often get back more focus than you spend, or, in case of more costly ones (i.e. Ringleader) get large discounts. Wizard + Cipher combination offers nice variety of afflictions, so you always have ways to cripple the enemy. And one successful attack with a firearm is usually all you need focus-wise (firearms are also very nice because no recovery). You do need to respec a lot due to new grimoires being available and due to some levels being very talent-intensive and others relatively empty.

Edited May 26, 2018 by Spleenless_Extortionist

[evilcat]

I like Cipher and I like Wizard, but does this multi-class actually work?

 

If you're casting wizard spells, you are not attacking, so you are not building up focus, but if you are attacking and building focus and casting cipher spells, where do the wizard spells come in?

 

What is the play pattern of this multi-class supposed to be? 

With some MC you can, but you shouldnt. Probably you will not like the result.

Cipher, even with draining whip, want martial dmg, spike dmg is even better. When you cast spells you dont get focus. If you want bunch of defensive spells you can MC with Trickster rogue (ilusion spells) or paladin (defensive passives and healing, also accuracy and dmg boost).

You may however play Wizard/Fighter, and use cone spells more generously than usual.

 

The idea of using Wizard CC to triger Beguiler is quite cool. Even better if you can use spells with dmg and some condition on it. There may be drawback, that you could cast double dmg in this time. Chanter with Long Night Drinking could be easier.

You could take Keen Mind and Phantom Foes as opener.

Edited May 26, 2018 by evilcat

[Lokithecat]

It could be an interesting solo style character, massive CC / Debuffs, fire off some random guns (something that hits + Jumps / has pellets / area damage) for quick focus, then charm the cripples to fight each other...  might have to be on a 'lower' difficulty so the spells stick.  

 

Otherwise, just using the Wiz for the defense buffs (which are incredible) only requires a few levels of wizard, for the basics. 

 

Druid / Cipher might be more interesting if you wanted the same sort of theme, and would have more options for playstyles, with a Shifter + Whip as an easy way to get Focus while still being able to use offensive and buff spells.  Actually now that I think of it, that might be interesting, with all the Lash elemental damage in Shifted form, the Whip effect would up the base (and the lash) by a decent amount.  Not certain Fury + Soul Blade would work, but every other combo should be fine.  Plus the Cipher spells feel kinda similar to a lot of the wiz stuff, so this might end up giving you more options spell wise also.