Why I think a fully voiced PoE:Deadfire is a mistake

[SonicMage117]

As far as strictly AAA, it seems Bioware classics are among the worst of the industry, (perhaps it's because that's when voice acting was just becoming a thing in the games industry?) And even Bioware's newest games are also still the worst of today's gaming. I'd say Capcom comes in close second with alot of their games.

 

Excluding my nostalgia factors though, here I see some amazing voice over work..

 

But I do agree with the video comments which state that that Elder Scrolls games has the worst lip syncing in the industry, as far as the good vs bad ratio, Oblivion and ESO have the greatest VO moments and the best writing and that probably has to do with the A budget hollywood actors they hired to voice the main characters. Whilist, I'm not sure who has the "worst" of worst in the series, Morrowind, Oblivion and Skyrim have some pretty equally bad moments but that is why I placed Oblivion higher than the other single player ES games.

 

There's nothing quite like hearing Patty Stewy's voice when you awake from the coffin of tamriel heights but Kate Beckinsale was a warm welcome in ESO. Now I'm curious of what the new voices in ESO New Morrowind will be like. I got my beta key, I should probably check it out.

[The Sharmat]

You N'wah.

 

Oblivion's voice work and writing is probably on the bottom of modern AAA RPGs, and that's really saying something on the latter.

Edited April 23, 2018 by The Sharmat

[SonicMage117]

Never said Oblivion is the best in the AAA industry or even good, but I'm just saying it's not the worst. I'm only saying that it's got the best high points of VO in the Elder Scrolls series, as I said before, not sure which has the most low point - I imagine all of them do equally since we can find any Elder Scroll game on "The worst voice acting" youtube videos.

[The Sharmat]

Absolute low point of AAA video game writing is probably something from Blizzard, although their voice actors do a decent enough job with the bad material. High point in terms of dialogue and voice work is the studio used for the English localization of Witcher 2/ Witcher 3.

[SonicMage117]

Exactly but I was only comparing Elder Scrolls games to each other, as their high points and low points as individuals

 

When I say Capcom bad VO I mean..

 

 

When I say Bioware...

 

 

I agree for Witcher 3 being the standard for the action rpg genre but as far as the industry as a whole, that may be debatable.

Edited April 23, 2018 by SonicMage117

[SonicMage117]

If I had to call out any one individual game to have the worst VO (or voice acting) in history I'd say Outcast is the one...

[illathid]

 

@Kharkarov

 

You should really stop referring to Persona 5 as an example of full VO. As I already explained, less half of it is voice acted and so it's really an example of partial VO, not full VO.

Didn't say it had full VO, I said the majority of it was.  Every scene that is important to the story (which is a crap ton of scenes) is fully voiced.  Additionally I am willing to bet Persona 5 has considerably more dialog in it than either Deadfire or Divinity Original Sin 2. 

 

It also has it's VO in two languages, and only by professional voice actors.  I am willing to bet Divinity and Deadfire both are English only, and have at least a couple "people from the company" doing VO.  So the odds are incredibly high that Persona 5 probably has a VO budget that dwarfs both Deadfire and Divinity Original Sin 2 regardless of it not being 100% VO.  Forget about the fact that at least 25% of the music in the game also has actual vocals in it by professional musicians.  I somehow doubt Deadfire or Divinity have more than 1 maybe 2 tracks with vocals, or maybe none, not sure.

 

In fact VO was probably the most expensive part of Persona 5's development budget, if it wasn't it was certainly in the top 3.  So I would say it is not a good game to use as an example of  "less VO is good".

 

As for budget, there is no doubt the budget of Divinity Original Sin 2 was much higher than Deadfire, the game was basically at beta level before they even started their fundraising campaign.  The kickstarter money was pure extra funds, and even if the funding had somehow flopped the game still would have released.  Just probably without full VO and a few other bells and whistles.

 

 

I had more to say but the forums ate it. I'd argue comparing P5 to deadfire in absolute terms like you are is misguided. It's more fair to look at it proportionally, and most of the P5 is unvoiced so it's really a partial VO game. 

[Karkarov]

I had more to say but the forums ate it. I'd argue comparing P5 to deadfire in absolute terms like you are is misguided. It's more fair to look at it proportionally, and most of the P5 is unvoiced so it's really a partial VO game.

I am not sure where you are seeing me compare it to Deadfire, I am not. 

 

I am merely stating that VO is pretty much a universally desired feature in RPG's if not in modern games in general.  Also, those who say VO is bad, or partial VO is better, are an extreme niche group that does not represent the majority people who buy video games, RPG's or otherwise.

 

If there is a comparison between the games I listed and Deadfire, it stopped at them all being RPG's and having a significant amount of VO.

 

By the way, I looked up videos to show just how much VO there is in Persona 5.  All "cutscenes" are fully voiced, and there is a guy who made the series covering all but two of the months, and the social links.    He did not cover November, December, or the ending. 

 

I added up the length of the videos, regardless of them not being complete.  It was 35.5 hours, and it isn't even the whole game, which would probably put the real total at around 40 hours.

 

Please just think about that, and the fact that all VO is in two languages, before you claim it doesn't have much VO in it again.  It has VO coming out it's rear.

Edited April 24, 2018 by Karkarov

[SonicMage117]

I try not to think that members here represent the Pillars fan-base as a whole because it's mainly the same 30 members or so who comment in each section of the forum. While one can argue "If they're a real fan, they'd be here" but that's never been the case in reality, most fans will never get on this forum (even to look) and most backers - even the most elite, will never get on here either. I'm just stating the logic reasoning here...

 

What is my point? Hopefully nobody gets offended bit in other words, I, myself cannot say I represent a larger base and I also cannot take anyone here seriously who says "Crpg fanbase favors more text and/or partial voice overs" Okay well, it's as I already explained, there are many many more Crpg players (new generation of fans) today than there ever were in the 90's/00's. So that obviously tips the scale to full VO favor for the fanbase of full VO.

 

All that aside, the reason I prefer full VO in any case is because these old eyes have seen many things and could rest a bit. Thus, such things as voice acting can be pleasant, even if mediocre at best, we'll all settle for that and embrace it. Besides, this is Obsidian, so..... We'll see if the game's better than the first when it comes out and how many will even mention the VO in their reviews and how it changes the game

[urosdot]

You people are never happy!!!! If it rains you want sun when you get sun its to hot... If you get strength you want might... 

NEVER ENDING STORY... they should make a game off this...

 

Fact, full voice-over sells games...

its 2018 after all

The old classics are old for a reason... 

Why dont you just turn voice off?.. That doesnt help?

Go take a 10 - 20 km run and after you will love that voice over...

[The Sharmat]

A lot of the displeasure comes from a conception that the time and money could better be spent elsewhere. Personally unless voice work has near zero or less value to you I doubt it really could have been given the realities of game development, but there you have it.

[Skazz]

Go take a 10 - 20 km run and after you will love that voice over...

 

How? Why? Also, what?

 

I...don't get it. 

[Tanjaxxx]

 

Go take a 10 - 20 km run and after you will love that voice over...

 

How? Why? Also, what?

 

I...don't get it. 

 

 

I guess, to 'get' this, we have to run...no thanks. 

[JerekKruger]

How? Why? Also, what?

 

I...don't get it. 

 

My best guess is when you're really tired you don't want to read.

[illathid]

 

I had more to say but the forums ate it. I'd argue comparing P5 to deadfire in absolute terms like you are is misguided. It's more fair to look at it proportionally, and most of the P5 is unvoiced so it's really a partial VO game.

I am not sure where you are seeing me compare it to Deadfire, I am not. 

 

I am merely stating that VO is pretty much a universally desired feature in RPG's if not in modern games in general.  Also, those who say VO is bad, or partial VO is better, are an extreme niche group that does not represent the majority people who buy video games, RPG's or otherwise.

 

If there is a comparison between the games I listed and Deadfire, it stopped at them all being RPG's and having a significant amount of VO.

 

By the way, I looked up videos to show just how much VO there is in Persona 5.  All "cutscenes" are fully voiced, and there is a guy who made the series covering all but two of the months, and the social links.    He did not cover November, December, or the ending. 

 

I added up the length of the videos, regardless of them not being complete.  It was 35.5 hours, and it isn't even the whole game, which would probably put the real total at around 40 hours.

 

Please just think about that, and the fact that all VO is in two languages, before you claim it doesn't have much VO in it again.  It has VO coming out it's rear.

 

 

Yes, There's likely 40 hours of VO work in P5. But there's just as much unvoiced conversations/content, if not more. So yes, there's a huge amount of voice work in P5, the budget for it is probably more than the entire budget for Deadfire. But it is still a partial VO game. However, no one complained that it was only partially voiced. Using it as an example of a fully voiced game is disingenuous. 

[Tanjaxxx]

If I had to call out any one individual game to have the worst VO (or voice acting) in history I'd say Outcast is the one...

 

Wow....but considering the script, I'd say the 'voice actors' did a pretty good job. XD

[MrH]

Being fully voiced is the thing I'm looking forward to the most, the lack of it really hurt the first game IMO.

[Yosharian]

I'm a few hours into Persona 5 and the English voice acting is incredible so far.  I usually can't stand English VO in JRPGs.

[Skazz]

I'm a few hours into Persona 5 and the English voice acting is incredible so far. I usually can't stand English VO in JRPGs.

Funny thing is, P5 shares multiple voice actors with Pillars. Sojiro is Zahua, Yusuke is Eder/Aloth...

 

It’s even better if you’ve played Tyranny. The protagonist is voiced by the Voices (duh) of Nerat of all people.

Edited April 26, 2018 by Skazz

[Starwars]

Haven't played Persona but The Voices of Nerat was one of the worst performances in Tyranny I think. And a good example of what I feel a a bad performance/badly direceted performance can do, actually undermine what is otherwise a cool character.

[Bionick]

All dialogue in the game is voiced.

 

I am in Neketaka, doing quests. After every cleared dungeon and finished quest, I go and offload the loot to the same few shopkeeps in the market district.

 

Every time I want to sell loot, I will have to hear the same "Good business to you, mahuamana!" line, over and over again. Because the game is fully voiced.

 

All dialogue in the game is voiced.

 

I am walking around the city central square, or in front of the queen's palace. I hear the same beggar, the same cheese vendor, or whatever, spouting the same "Spare a coin!"/"Buy delicious clams!". As I am going to sleep, after having played up to 3AM, I will still hear these voices in my head. Because the game is fully voiced.

 

All dialogue in the game is voiced.

 

I am walking around any settlement in the game, doesn't matter which. Random people are going about their randomly triggering exchanges - "Do you think the weather is improving" - "No, but I heard rumours that the mayor has changed his underpants last week". These conversations are looping every other minute. I keep hearing them every time I pass by those random dudes. After a while, I start avoiding certain streets and NPCs in the area, because I'm sick of death of their repetitive conversations. A feature that was fun in the beginning is now tiresome to hear. Because the game is fully voiced.

 

All dialogue in the game is voiced. Have you started ignoring these last two sentences yet? Why? Reread them again! It's so much fun!

 

I am walking around town. The aforementioned NPCs dialogues kick in. I am hearing them for the Nth time. But suddenly, one of my companions starts his/her own conversation with another one of my companions! Wow, that's gonna be something fun, I want to hear it, shut up annoying NPC dudes! I try to run away into a side street, but oh no, I missed it! Because the game is fully voiced.

 

10/10

 

I really don't see why hearing the same bit of background banter several times is any more annoying than reading the same bit of background banter several times. It is physically impossible to choose to not read something that is put before you (assuming that it is in a language you understand, of course). Once you read it, you essentially are hearing it your head. There is no functional distinction between the voiced banter and the read banter in this regard, unless the voice acting is particularly bad, of course. The ironic thing is that your post actually inadvertently attempts to demonstrate this very principle by you repeatedly typing the same phrase over and over again, completely demolishing your argument. You have only proven, if anything, that repetition is annoying, not voiced repetition. 

[Skazz]

I really don't see why hearing the same bit of background banter several times is any more annoying than reading the same bit of background banter several times. It is physically impossible to choose to not read something that is put before you (assuming that it is in a language you understand, of course). Once you read it, you essentially are hearing it your head. There is no functional distinction between the voiced banter and the read banter in this regard, unless the voice acting is particularly bad, of course. The ironic thing is that your post actually inadvertently attempts to demonstrate this very principle by you repeatedly typing the same phrase over and over again, completely demolishing your argument. You have only proven, if anything, that repetition is annoying, not voiced repetition.

 

I mean, you're probably right, but there's definitely something about repeating sound bytes that makes you gellarde! Well done. A formidable fortress in the old style. We don't build them like this anymore, you know. Not by the sea. Too vulnerable to cannons.

[Karkarov]

 

I'm a few hours into Persona 5 and the English voice acting is incredible so far. I usually can't stand English VO in JRPGs.

Funny thing is, P5 shares multiple voice actors with Pillars. Sojiro is Zahua, Yusuke is Eder/Aloth...

 

It’s even better if you’ve played Tyranny. The protagonist is voiced by the Voices (duh) of Nerat of all people.

Well you do get a lot of persona's, makes sense when you think about it.  Nerat is probably just a persona user with the wild card powers who went batpoop crazy.

 

All seriousness though, Persona 5 has fantastic voice acting, and is one of the best RPG's in years if you ask me.

[Skazz]

 

 

I'm a few hours into Persona 5 and the English voice acting is incredible so far. I usually can't stand English VO in JRPGs.

Funny thing is, P5 shares multiple voice actors with Pillars. Sojiro is Zahua, Yusuke is Eder/Aloth...

 

It’s even better if you’ve played Tyranny. The protagonist is voiced by the Voices (duh) of Nerat of all people.

Well you do get a lot of persona's, makes sense when you think about it.  Nerat is probably just a persona user with the wild card powers who went batpoop crazy.

 

All seriousness though, Persona 5 has fantastic voice acting, and is one of the best RPG's in years if you ask me.

 

 

Or, think about it like this: Persona's Joker is also a fantasy version of the Joker.

 

And I completely agree with you, Persona 5 is a delightful game.

Edited April 29, 2018 by Skazz

[The Sharmat]

 

I really don't see why hearing the same bit of background banter several times is any more annoying than reading the same bit of background banter several times. It is physically impossible to choose to not read something that is put before you (assuming that it is in a language you understand, of course). Once you read it, you essentially are hearing it your head. There is no functional distinction between the voiced banter and the read banter in this regard, unless the voice acting is particularly bad, of course. The ironic thing is that your post actually inadvertently attempts to demonstrate this very principle by you repeatedly typing the same phrase over and over again, completely demolishing your argument. You have only proven, if anything, that repetition is annoying, not voiced repetition.

 

I mean, you're probably right, but there's definitely something about repeating sound bytes that makes you gellarde! Well done. A formidable fortress in the old style. We don't build them like this anymore, you know. Not by the sea. Too vulnerable to cannons.

 

The difference between examples is you can't hit a button to make Pallegina shut up but you can click past the text almost as soon as it pops up.