Killing Eothas speculation.

[tinysalamander]

Though to reiterate, I wouldn't want a confrontation with Eothas to be a simple matter of walking up to him and hacking away at his adra ankles until he tips over: a lot should go into setting the stage for an in-game battle and stacking the odds in your favor enough for the prospect of fighting Eothas, however weakened he may be at this point, to be less than totally insane. Further, the preparation for such an event might quite reasonably require the Watcher to kill, enslave, or imprison both Xoti and/or Eder if either of them has been recruited (though perhaps not, depending on character development opportunities that may be available for them).

 

Well, https://imgur.com/a/rjQ8x (PoE1 ending spoilers, obviously).

 

I wouldn't want the choice of killing Eothas to necessarily be limited to 'evil' characters, but taking steps to do so should force a Watcher to consider how far they're willing to go for revenge (or justice, if this is about punishing Eothas for thousands of other souls he consumed when he awakened under your keep) and it's also hard to ignore the likelihood/inevitability of conflict between faithful Eothasian companions and a Watcher who has persistently demonstrated that they are set on killing the god that these companions worship.

 

Which assumes I am

as a priestess of Eothas

not planning a great deicide for the reason of thou shalt have no gods. Although if he is a somewhat of a good guy after all starting with him might be problematic as I’d remove the force that stands in the way of divine maniacs (besides the usual fact that killing a good guy is problematic). Removing them from positions of power without killing might be an option as well, but I’m not sure how it should be done. Or maybe some killed, some removed from power.

[blotter]

Absolutely. Given what I know about the game's main story and its implications (wasn't there something about the revelations being a threat to kith and gods alike?), it may be that the whole confrontation with Eothas might lead to destroying the pantheon. Or it may put you in the shoes of Thaos, with a new spin on his role and views: Maybe the gods are needed to make the world more bearable, as was the original plan?

 

Yeah, it would be interesting if the game's developments could potentially serve to challenge the Watcher's perspective on Thaos' choices as they learn more of the secrets of the world/the gods. Tinysalamander touches upon the fact that this has been addressed to a limited extent where companions and their issues regarding are concerned, but there's definitely room for further development.

 

Also in relation to the end game, I wonder how often the Watcher will have opportunities during the sequel to try to convince others of what they learned within Sun in Shadow.

 

Well, https://imgur.com/a/rjQ8x (PoE1 ending spoilers, obviously).

 

Good point. In most of my games, I do tend to steer Eder away from devotion to the gods, but I didn't really think about the implications of doing so as they pertain to Deadfire. Based on the examples that developers have provided about companion relationships and how Eder works within that context, it does sound like being pro-Eothas is still one of his centrally defining characteristics, but end game states from Pillars 1 may well influence how open he might be to opposing viewpoints.

 

While we're at it, one of the earliest updates had this to say about Xoti's perspective on Eothas:

 

She is intrigued by the rumors of Eothas' manifestation, but she fears what that will mean for her fellow expatriates, many of whom followed his previous incarnation into war and defeat.

 

Her conflicted views on his return might be sufficient to remove any requirement to defend Eothas to the death, or even to leave the party depending on how you deal with her and/or things develop throughout the game.

 

Which assumes I am

as a priestess of Eothas

not planning a great deicide for the reason of thou shalt have no gods. Although if he is a somewhat of a good guy after all starting with him might be problematic as I’d remove the force that stands in the way of divine maniacs (besides the usual fact that killing a good guy is problematic). Removing them from positions of power without killing might be an option as well, but I’m not sure how it should be done. Or maybe some killed, some removed from power.

 

It's less that I assumed anything about your priestess of Eothas (and I'm not sure why you'd bother to spoiler that) and more that, in my preceding discussion of options focused on killing Eothas, I hadn't considered how that would play out for Eothasian Watchers at all. But sure, I've no doubt players can find reasons for potentially wanting Eothas dead despite still technically being priests of his faith. I'd hope that the game reacts to that, even if I personally have no intention of playing an Eothasian Watcher any time soon.

 

That said, I suspect that Tagaziel's right in that the game is unlikely to portray a deicidal route as being particularly reasonable; at the very least, I'd be surprised if the game didn't devote a significant amount of time to considering the potentially disastrous consequences of killing Eothas.

[FlintlockJazz]

 

One thing to remember is that we're talking about a god, not your average Admeth from Whogivesa****ford, Nowherewood. The Godhammer, a purpose-built god-killing bomb failed to kill him, so I doubt a straight-up fight is in the cards.

He's not exactly a god, I'm pretty sure in the story they delve into that in the last missions, that thaos's people tried looking for the gods and couldn't find them anywhere they looked or went using animancy, and other technological advances. So they made them selves "gods" in order to prevent wide out rage and chaos that if there where no gods intern there are no consequences to what a person does.

 

We know the gods are created, doesn't really stop them being gods despite what Iovara said.  The first greek gods were created by the Titans, and others were born of god-human pairings (Zeus in particular, the horny bastard), while other religions had humans ascending to godhood.  It was more the origins of the gods that was the secret, and whether them being created made them unworthy of worship or not.

[algroth]

 

 

One thing to remember is that we're talking about a god, not your average Admeth from Whogivesa****ford, Nowherewood. The Godhammer, a purpose-built god-killing bomb failed to kill him, so I doubt a straight-up fight is in the cards.

He's not exactly a god, I'm pretty sure in the story they delve into that in the last missions, that thaos's people tried looking for the gods and couldn't find them anywhere they looked or went using animancy, and other technological advances. So they made them selves "gods" in order to prevent wide out rage and chaos that if there where no gods intern there are no consequences to what a person does.

 

We know the gods are created, doesn't really stop them being gods despite what Iovara said.  The first greek gods were created by the Titans, and others were born of god-human pairings (Zeus in particular, the horny bastard), while other religions had humans ascending to godhood.  It was more the origins of the gods that was the secret, and whether them being created made them unworthy of worship or not.

 

I think the intention behind each case is quite different, however. All of the above is true but to the best of my awareness none of them were made with the express intention to deceive, as have the gods created by the Engwithans. Iovara states that the Engwithans had found by some means that there were no gods, and in trying to prevent chaos they created 'real' gods that would fill that void and thus support a particular set of beliefs and pantheon. Thus in this setting I do think the fact they were created goes against their claim to real godhood.

Edited January 8, 2018 by algroth

[tinysalamander]

Gods and titans can (try to) claim some sort of divine right, they exist because the nature of their reality says so. Human creations cannot. They are simply sufficiently advanced AIs. Even if the practical difference is almost non-existant for most people.