One thing that needs to change

[firkraag888]

The differences in deflection/ accuracey in the classes aat character creation have a significant impact at the start of the game and the lower levels but as you level up more they begin to become almost irrelevant.

 

For example the difference in deflection between a rogue and a fighter is 15. At lower levels this is a huge boost to deflection for a fighter and a hinderance for a rogue.

 

But as you reach the higher levels and a fighter has around 100 deflection and a rogue 85 this doesn't matter as much.

 

Same with accuracey.

Edited March 26, 2017 by firkraag888

[BrotherFerg]

My 12th level rogue has a deflection of 48 and a primary accuracy of 89 and secondary accuracy of 85

My 12th level fighter has a deflection of 110 and 67 accuracy

 

 

 

Edited March 26, 2017 by BrotherFerg

[firkraag888]

shield.......im looking at you.

 

disregard above post poster hasn't understood the OP.

[BrotherFerg]

My fighter has double the deflection as my rogue. That's pretty big. Maybe someone wants to tinker with a tankish rogue, because deflection is balanced it's a viable option.

Edited March 26, 2017 by BrotherFerg

[hilfazer]

15 accuracy vs 15 deflection= 15% chance to miss, 35% chance to graze, 50% chance to hit

15 accuracy vs 30 deflection= 30% chance to miss, 35% chance to graze, 35% chance to hit

 

vs

 

85 accuracy vs 85 deflection= 15% chance to miss, 35% chance to graze, 50% chance to hit

85 accuracy vs 100 deflection= 30% chance to miss, 35% chance to graze, 35% chance to hit

 

hmm... same.

 

Some classes can get more accuracy than others with abilities/talents, some others - more deflection. The difference is actually bigger at higher levels.

[firkraag888]

My fighter has double the deflection as my rogue. That's pretty big. Maybe someone wants to tinker with a tankish rogue, because deflection is balanced it's a viable option.

dude seriously.

 

You can build a rogue to have within 15 deflection of a fighter if you want. you have just taken certain talents and given higher deflection bonus items to your fighter.

 

Don't select reckless assault..........give your rogue a shield...............

 

jezusss

[BrotherFerg]

 

My fighter has double the deflection as my rogue. That's pretty big. Maybe someone wants to tinker with a tankish rogue, because deflection is balanced it's a viable option.

 

dude seriously.

 

You can build a rogue to have within 15 deflection of a fighter if you want. you have just taken certain talents and given higher deflection bonus items to your fighter.

 

Don't select reckless assault..........give your rogue a shield...............

 

jezusss

K

[rheingold]

Yeah, try as I might I simply can't get a rogues deflection and defenses remotely close to a chanter/fighter/paladin. It's no competition. The difference jumps as you get higher levels.

Partly because of abilities/talents, but also partly because of the role in a party. Ie you would never have a rogue tank, so even giving a rogue a shield can be seen as a major compromise. Whereas a chanter having a shield does not impact on its effectiveness in the slightest. This gets worse when you start adding in various talents and abilities. A chanter is also not hindered in anyway from taking all the defensive talents whereas a rogue generally ends up taking other abilities.

You can comfortably get a tankish class up to 130 deflection, whereas you would really struggle to get a rogue to 85. And that's with taking some defensive abilities and very likely high resolve. You can add a shield, but a rogues entire premise is about damage, and even then you'd probably only get to 100 or so. This doesn't take into account the other defenses where the difference is as big.

 

I'd also say that the difference between 120/130 deflection and 85/100 is a massive jump. One can tank while the other one just dies...

I think multi classing is going to benefit the weaker classes like rogues though, so I expect there will be a change if in poe2 if only because of that.

 

But yes, you can't exclude abilities and equipment because that indicates the role the character is taking up.

[Katarack21]

If you're using items to to do it, then it's not the build or the class. It's the items.

[Ninjamestari]

Deflection and Accuracy don't act as simple modifiers, it doesn't matter if you have "double" the deflection compared to something, what matters is the actual difference between values. The effect of a 5 point difference in accuracy is exactly the same at 15 vs 20 as it is at 115 vs 120. How they work is just math, and I'd advice against forming opinions until you understand the specifics of the system.

 

EDIT: so in other words, no this doesn't need to chance. The system is fine as is. What needs to change is the paladins having so much lower values than fighters ^^

Edited March 26, 2017 by Ninjamestari

[rheingold]

If you're using items to to do it, then it's not the build or the class. It's the items.

Not strictly true, unless you have a naked rogue. This doesn't happen in a vacuum, items, shields are relevant. Maybe special items, uniques shouldn't be taken into account. But when the devs designed the system they surely had the bigger picture in mind. The only real problem though, is some of the classes still need some minor tweaks. Rogues, for instance need their deflection and endurance/health upped a bit. Not because it doesn't matter.... but because it does especially at higher levels. They are a melee class after all.

[Katarack21]

 

If you're using items to to do it, then it's not the build or the class. It's the items.

Not strictly true, unless you have a naked rogue. This doesn't happen in a vacuum, items, shields are relevant. Maybe special items, uniques shouldn't be taken into account. But when the devs designed the system they surely had the bigger picture in mind. The only real problem though, is some of the classes still need some minor tweaks. Rogues, for instance need their deflection and endurance/health upped a bit. Not because it doesn't matter.... but because it does especially at higher levels. They are a melee class after all.

 

Yes, true. Items and equipment are pitch hitters. You can switch them out as-needed--for more accuracy, more deflection, more DR piercing, etc. Of course you can redo your build, too, but that's more involved and more of a total redo. Stats from your equipment and items are generally included in build guides because such is needed to achieve maximum efficiency, but their no more an aspect of the actual "class build" than food, potions, or spell buffs. That shield will only be providing that additional deflection as-needed, exactly like the potion or the rest bonus, not permanently like the talents skills and abilities. If you want to, that shield can be given to somebody else and you won't be getting that bonus at all. The benefit, drawbacks, and problems are all in the shield--not in the actual way you designed your character, not in the way you built your character. Your character may not be at maximum efficiency without it, but again--same is true of potions, etc.

 

Now, your character may be built to require *A* shield--but that specific badass unique shield that's making your deflection that high? Nope. If you're using "bonus items" to achieve a specific disparity between classes stats, then it's the items that are the problem, not the classes.

Edited March 26, 2017 by Katarack21