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Brave New World (the book)


Heijoushin

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How are you gentlemen,

 

Have any of your read the classic Brave New World? I only read it for the first time last year, and thought it was brilliant. I know it’s really old, but I was wondering if any of you would be interested in discussing it?

 

For those who haven't read it:

Within this book, all citizens are genetically engineered and psychologically conditioned to be a perfect match for the work they will be assigned. There are 5 ranks (Alpha – Epsilon). Alphas are genetically superior in terms of looks, intelligence and physique. They’re generally the leaders, scientists and creative minds of the society. Betas seem to be more-or-less average joes. Gammas and Deltas are a little smaller physically, with low IQs. At the bottom are the Epsilons, who are semi-retarded, and given only the simplest, most menial jobs. (Oh yeah, Gamma – Epsilon are also produced in batches of identical clones) You might think this is a clear case of “nobility” reigning over the lower classes, but unlike in other novels, the lower classes never revolt, since they are engineered to be perfectly happy in their work. A lot of us are unhappy because we are in jobs which are not stimulating/not challenging enough or too challenging for us, but this system sort of removes this problem. Of course, in the book, there are a couple of unhappy characters (without unhappiness, there would be no plot), but they seem to be the eccentric ones, not the general rule.

 

Additionally, the family unit has been disbanded, with all children being raised by the state. As added bonuses, you get to retain your youthful appearance right up until the day of your death (People die around age 60 in this book. I can’t help but think that this number would have been higher if it was written more recently), there is lots of sex (society expects you to sleep with multiple people) and lots of drugs (if you’re feeling down, you just take your “medicine”). The down sides seem to be lots of compulsory communal activities, no family units, lots of consumerism, general brainwashing of the population, group mentality and lack of goals/competition/challenges.

 

Apparently this is supposed to be a “negative utopia”, but it sounds like a pretty good deal to me. If you’re an Alpha or Beta, you enjoy 60 years of pleasant promiscuity. If you’re gamma – epsilon, your life probably sucks a little, but you’re too stupid to notice.

 

Would you guys want to live in a Brave New World?

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Also, Mustapha Mond is a boss name.

 

...

 

Who wouldn't want to live in this Utopia?? Massive orgies, orderly behavior. Strict societal hierarchies? Who am I kidding? 

 

I've read it twice. Required reading in high school, and re-read it for pleasure again sometime in college. Impetus being my having read Neil Postman's brilliant, Amusing Ourselves to Death.

 

B-Rice borrowed my dog-eared paperback of BNW from me my third year and never returned it. I suppose it'd be weird to pop up after all these years and demand her to give it back.

Edited by Leferd

"Things are funny...are comedic, because they mix the real with the absurd." - Buzz Aldrin.

"P-O-T-A-T-O-E" - Dan Quayle

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Who wouldn't want to live in this Utopia?? Massive orgies, orderly behavior. Strict societal hierarchies? Who am I kidding? 

 

I've read it twice. Required reading in high school, and re-read it for pleasure again sometime in college. Impetus being my having read Neil Postman's brilliant, Amusing Ourselves to Death.

 

B-Rice borrowed my dog-eared paperback of BNW from me my third year and never returned it. I suppose it'd be weird to pop up after all these years and demand her to give it back.

 

lol, can't quite tell if your first sentence is sarcastic or sincere. It seems like a pretty sweet deal to me.

 

Like 1984 & Starship Troopers, it was also incredibly amusing to read a story about the future written so far in the past. And also about so many topics that would be considered sensitive today.

 

Ha, I'm glad we never did this in school, it might have killed the enjoyment for me! I'll check out this Amusing Ourselves to Death as well.

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Who wouldn't want to live in this Utopia?? Massive orgies, orderly behavior. Strict societal hierarchies? Who am I kidding? 

 

I've read it twice. Required reading in high school, and re-read it for pleasure again sometime in college. Impetus being my having read Neil Postman's brilliant, Amusing Ourselves to Death.

 

B-Rice borrowed my dog-eared paperback of BNW from me my third year and never returned it. I suppose it'd be weird to pop up after all these years and demand her to give it back.

 

 

lol, can't quite tell if your first sentence is sarcastic or sincere. It seems like a pretty sweet deal to me.

 

Like 1984 & Starship Troopers, it was also incredibly amusing to read a story about the future written so far in the past. And also about so many topics that would be considered sensitive today.

 

Ha, I'm glad we never did this in school, it might have killed the enjoyment for me! I'll check out this Amusing Ourselves to Death as well.

Amusing is a good, informative read. Over thirty years old, but still applicable to current society's travails.

"Things are funny...are comedic, because they mix the real with the absurd." - Buzz Aldrin.

"P-O-T-A-T-O-E" - Dan Quayle

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How are you gentlemen,

 

Have any of your read the classic Brave New World?

 

I am fine thank you.

 

Yes, i have read it.

"Some men see things as they are and say why?"
"I dream things that never were and say why not?"
- George Bernard Shaw

"Hope in reality is the worst of all evils because it prolongs the torments of man."
- Friedrich Nietzsche

 

"The amount of energy necessary to refute bull**** is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it."

- Some guy 

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Oh that :) I guess I am still wondering which is worse

 

1) People failing to understand why BNW is dystopic society, or

2) People understand that it is a dystopia but want it anyway

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"Some men see things as they are and say why?"
"I dream things that never were and say why not?"
- George Bernard Shaw

"Hope in reality is the worst of all evils because it prolongs the torments of man."
- Friedrich Nietzsche

 

"The amount of energy necessary to refute bull**** is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it."

- Some guy 

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Huxley is an interesting author. Brave New World seem to ask if we can accept the complete loss of peronal freedom, if we're just presented with enough distractions. It's brilliant, precisely because he refrains from heavyhanded moral judgements, making all but a handfull of charcters content- if not outright happy. Thus questioning if the pursuit of happiness, in and on itself, is really such a noble goal, without a higher moral imperative.

 

Have you read 'Ape and Essence' or 'Island'? - thematically similar if a bit more Philip K'ish, as it was after his mescaline trips.

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Fortune favors the bald.

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Oh that :) I guess I am still wondering which is worse

 

1) People failing to understand why BNW is dystopic society, or

2) People understand that it is a dystopia but want it anyway

 

I'm a number 2 of course. You're welcome to expand on why I'm being so foolish :)

 

Huxley is an interesting author. Brave New World seem to ask if we can accept the complete loss of peronal freedom, if we're just presented with enough distractions. It's brilliant, precisely because he refrains from heavyhanded moral judgements, making all but a handfull of charcters content- if not outright happy. Thus questioning if the pursuit of happiness, in and on itself, is really such a noble goal, without a higher moral imperative.

 

Have you read 'Ape and Essence' or 'Island'? - thematically similar if a bit more Philip K'ish, as it was after his mescaline trips.

 

He is indeed. And he must have had an amazing mind to come up with that book in 1932.

 

I haven't read those, I'll give 'em a try!

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Apparently this is supposed to be a “negative utopia”, but it sounds like a pretty good deal to me. If you’re an Alpha or Beta, you enjoy 60 years of pleasant promiscuity. If you’re gamma – epsilon, your life probably sucks a little, but you’re too stupid to notice.

 

is not actual 'posed to be a "negative utopia."  you are very much intended to see the allure o' an ordered society which is successful at satisfying the wants o' the populace.  keep in mind the book were written during the great depression, so the appeal o' a world state o' near universal peace and happiness woulda' had even greater allure.  one reason bnw has continued relevance is 'cause it ain't offering a cartoony dystopia with obvious good v. bad.

 

HA! Good Fun!

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"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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one reason bnw has continued relevance is 'cause it ain't offering a cartoony dystopia with obvious good v. bad.

 

*cough* 1984 *cough*

 

we would gladly make blood sacrifice to raven and shiva that we never need read another compare/contrast o' 1984 and bnw.  however, we will observe (opine) how "orwellian" has always been hyperbolic, thus diminishing its actual value.  sweaty-toothed revolutionaries see every State action which infringes 'pon liberty as orwellian.  States can safely wear down personal freedoms w/o ever actual approaching genuine orwellian.  1984 is comforting to all.  is no surprise 1984 is on required reading lists in many western nations. 

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

ps am not saying we dislike 1984.

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"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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we would gladly make blood sacrifice to raven and shiva that we never need read another compare/contrast o' 1984 and bnw.  

 

Hah, yeah - What I do like about them however, and what I think is one of the reason they are so prevalent (and used / or misused) is because they are so easy to grasp and read.. while at the same time being concise. A rare feat that many modern authors could learn from.

Fortune favors the bald.

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  • 2 weeks later...

If you like Brave New World, you might like Karin Boye Kallocain.

Civilization, in fact, grows more and more maudlin and hysterical; especially under democracy it tends to degenerate into a mere combat of crazes; the whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, most of them imaginary. - H.L. Mencken

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Would you guys want to live in a Brave New World?[/font]

We already do.

"To be fair, if I was married to Milla Jovovich, I would also be happy just making movies that show off her butt." - Hurlsnot

"I originally just wanted to ignore this, but I can't sleep, so why not." - majestic

"I murdered my entire family as well as the police and priests investigating me for murdering my entire family in the name of Satan. Good times." - Bartimaeus

"I will undoubtedly cave and buy this since Nintendo has me by the balls with Shin Megami Tensei V." - Keyrock

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If you like Brave New World, you might like Karin Boye Kallocain.

 

Thanks, will check it out!

 

 

Would you guys want to live in a Brave New World?[/font]

We already do.

 

 

Really!? Why am I missing out on all the free sex then!? ;( You're going to tell me that I was born a Gamma because I'm short, right?

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