question about dots and hots

[Madscientist]

Thanks again

 

Some questions from before that are not answered yet:

- Do dots cause interrupt? If yes, only initial hit or each tick?

- Do unique weapon effects that apply a status effect on hit (like marked, desoriented, . . . ) use a hit roll? If yes, against what defense? (not related to dots, but I got the question anyway)

 

The mage spells do not do what the description says? I never used them because it made no sense to use a buff that lasts until you are hit. (Ok, I did it in the IE games for spells like stoneskin or some magic protection. But those spells protected you from the next hit completely, not just from 8 damage.)

 

off topic:

The good new is that I am in the beta of PoE2.

I have the alpha of D:OS2 and while I was playing about 75% of the posts in the bug thread came from me. I was only playing the game in easy difficulty, no looking at the code, just playing around with some abilities. Larian games are fun but completely unbalanced, which can produce great fun. Teleport all enemies in the same pool of water and bomb them with AoE lightning.

[sibakruom]

How duration is calculated?

- total_duration = base_duration * (1 + intellect_coef) * hit_quality_modifier

- hit_quality_modifier = 0.5 (graze)

- hit_quality_modifier = 0.5 (hit)

- hit_quality_modifier = 1.5 (crit)

 

Is this how it actually works in-game or just a typo? I would have expected the duration modifier for a hit to be 1.0 rather than 0.5.

 

 

Fun facts:

- although on first sight it might appear that hit quality does affect only total_damage but not the dps; for non-raw DoTs it's not completely true, because of ticks dealing lower damage, and thus more being blocked by DR. E.g. a character with 10 might and 10 int casts a Shining Beacon:

 .- hit  :  80.00 damage over  9.00s | 8.888 pre-DR dps | 4 ticks of 20

 .- graze:  53.33 damage over  6.00s | 8.888 pre-DR dps | 3 ticks of 17.77 damage

 .- crit : 120.00 damage over 13.50s | 8.888 pre-DR dps | 5 ticks of 21.81 damage plus 1 tick of 10.9

 

This example on the other hand seems to imply a duration modifier of 1.0 for a hit and of 0.67 for a graze (as well as a 0.67 damage modifier for a graze).

Edited February 28, 2017 by sibakruom

[MaxQuest]

Some questions from before that are not answered yet:

- Do dots cause interrupt? If yes, only initial hit or each tick?

- Do unique weapon effects that apply a status effect on hit (like marked, desoriented, . . . ) use a hit roll? If yes, against what defense? (not related to dots, but I got the question anyway)

1. DoTs do cause an interrupt. They do it on initial hit.

2. Hmm, don't remember testing those. Iirc, marking and disorienting don't have a separate roll and are auto-applied if you landed a hit with your weapon. While overbearing and stunning make a roll vs fortitude (and that prone/stun effect can also miss/graze/hit/crit). Firebug proc also makes an attack roll (but vs deflection).

 

The mage spells do not do what the description says? I never used them because it made no sense to use a buff that lasts until you are hit.

Afaik Ironskin, Mirrored Image and Wizard's Double are not dispelled immediately on being hit; rather their protection is diminished by 10% of base value or something like that. Tbh, I haven't casted them at all yet. Edited February 28, 2017 by MaxQuest

[MaxQuest]

Edit: hrr, double-post.
 

Is this how it actually works in-game or just a typo? I would have expected the duration modifier for a hit to be 1.0 rather than 0.5.

Thanks for noticing. That's just a typo. It is 1.0
 

This example on the other hand seems to imply a duration modifier of 1.0 for a hit and of 0.67 for a graze (as well as a 0.67 damage modifier for a graze).

For some reason I have divided the value by 1.5 (hence 0.67). I will re-check that later (at home).

Edit: found one of my older posts. It should be a 0.5 multiplicative malus. Updating that post, so it becomes:

 

 .- hit  :  80.00 damage over  9.00s | 8.888 pre-DR dps | 4 ticks of 20
 .- graze:  40.00 damage over  4.50s | 8.888 pre-DR dps | 2 ticks of 16.00 damage plus 1 tick of 8
 .- crit : 120.00 damage over 13.50s | 8.888 pre-DR dps | 5 ticks of 21.81 damage plus 1 tick of 10.9

 

Edited February 28, 2017 by MaxQuest

[Madscientist]

 

- Do unique weapon effects that apply a status effect on hit (like marked, desoriented, . . . ) use a hit roll? If yes, against what defense? (not related to dots, but I got the question anyway)

2. Hmm, don't remember testing those. Iirc, marking and disorienting don't have a separate roll and are auto-applied if you landed a hit with your weapon. While overbearing and stunning make a roll vs fortitude (and that prone/stun effect can also miss/graze/hit/crit). Firebug proc also makes an attack roll (but vs deflection).

 

 

 

 

Prone and stunn are "normal" status effects and it is clear what they do and against what they roll. They appear in the in game encyclopedia and can be produced by lots of spells, items and abilities.

 

Marked, disoriented, and maybe some more are unique effects that only exist on a few weapons.

[MaxQuest]

Prone and stunn are "normal" status effects and it is clear what they do and against what they roll. They appear in the in game encyclopedia and can be produced by lots of spells, items and abilities.

I wouldn't say that it is a priori clear. For example there are stunning spells that roll vs Fortitude (Relentless Storm,

Overwhelming Wave) and also spells that roll vs Will (Silent Scream, Dimensional Shift).

 

But yeah, stunning and overbearing indeed do roll vs Fortitude only. Here are the results of a few quick tests:

Desiccating (Captain Viccilos Anger)(on hit) : roll vs Fort | duration: 0 on miss; 3.0s on graze; 6.0s on hit; 9.0s on crit
Disorienting (The Vile Loners Lance)(on hit) : auto-applied | duration: constant 5.0s
Interfering (Lost Thayns Reach)(on hit)      : auto-applied | duration: 5.0s on hit; 7.5s on crit
Overbearing (We-Toki)(on crit)               : roll vs Fort | duration: 0 on miss; 1.5s on graze; 3.0s on hit; 4.5s on crit
Persecuting (St. Wygelts Cudgel)(on hit)     : auto-applied | duration: constant 6.0s
Stunning (Starcaller)(on crit)               : roll vs Fort | duration: 0 on miss; 1.0s on graze; 2.0s on hit; 3.0s on crit
Stunning (Godansthunyr)(on crit)             : roll vs Fort | duration: 0 on miss; 1.0s on graze; 2.0s on hit; 3.0s on crit
Wounding (Drawn in Spring)                   : auto-applied

Property meanings:

 

Desiccating: inflicts minor fatigue (-10% max. endurance, -10 accuracy)

Disorienting: inflicts -5 all defenses

Interfering: inflicts -5 accuracy

Persecuting: drains 5 resolve from the target and you gain +5 Deflection

Overbearing: chance to prone

Stunning: chance to stun

Wounding: +25% raw damage inflicted over time

 

P.S. All durations scale with Int.

P.P.S. Marking and coordinating, do not make a roll, and also do not apply a visible status effect.

Edited March 1, 2017 by MaxQuest

[Madscientist]

OK, this means:

- The combat log for dots is wrong most of the time.

- Dots and lashes can be completely eaten by DR (25% of normal DR, no min damage)

- There is no obvious rule about which dot stacks with itself or not

- There seems to be no obvious rule which additional effects require a roll and which not.

 

Looks like there is some work to do for PoE2.

I will wait for the the beta before I start with suggestions. As far as I know the penetration vs armor system will change a lot.

[MaxQuest]

Is there  any single thread in the PoE 2 subforum that collects all the wierd errata like this that should really be corrected in PoE 2?

I'm thinking things like this, the absurdly overcomplicated attack speed calculations, the problem with shield bash lowering DPS, etc?

Created such a thread here.

[Infantry]

All lashes are done against 25% DR, so a paladin with FoD, Intense Flames and burning lash will do 100% burn damage against 75%DR (because there are 3 lashes). If you add also Scion of Flame it will become 120% burn damage vs 75% DR.

 

PS. Enduring Flames seems to have now a fixed duration and its damage isn't affected by INT anymore. It deals 50% burn damage against 100%DR (because there are a fixed 4 ticks) but each tick is affected by MIG and someone with 30MIG will do 80% burn damage overall instead. A paladin could end adding 200% burn damage against 175% DR which means you can one shot many enemies with an arquebus or Firebrand.

 

Kaylon, where are you seeing Enduring Flames with a fixed duration?  On PoE 3.07, Enduring Flames duration goes well-above the advertised 10 seconds on my 15-Intelligence Paladin.  Are you suggesting that there are four fixed ticks regardless of "duration" (e.g., 4 ticks over 16 seconds)?  This still means the same damage is being done over a longer period of time, which is not compelling.  Also, does Enduring Flames stack?  In my experience, the Enduring Flames from one FoD is replaced (visually, at least) by the next FoD.  It is underwhelming if it does not stack, particularly when the Paladin is focused on a single target and has two charges of FoD.