My personal challenge - help please?

[Masterteo89]

As the title says.

 

After i cleared the game on PotD with full party of 6 allyes, i wanted to try something else.

 

So i said : why not making a party of only 4 custom character, unbalanced and with Hard (no PotD, because it's an unbalanced party) ?

 

 

 

So i made my godlike party. 4 godlike girls ( NO SCROLLS as a rule of my personal challenge) :

 

1- main pg, a fire godlike barbarian with 18 STR and 19 COS.     (tank)

 

2- a fire godlike druid with 18 perception and 20 INT.       ( accurate and strong with spells)

 

3- a moon godlike ranger with lion companion , 20 DEX and 18 Perception        ( very accurate and fast )

 

4- a nature godlike ranger with lion companion ,  19 Perception and 20 INT  ( very accurate and intelligent, but way slower than the other ranger)

 

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So, a party that first of all is weak in the front line, with only a barbarian and 2 lions.

 

Second point, 3 of 4 members of this party have low hp, on hard difficulty it could make things hard.

 

Third point, no one can raise dead allyes, because i'm not going to let them read scrolls. Meaning the Druid should act as my party healer AND magic damage dealer.

 

Fourth point , Druid normally should deal damage, but mine has to became also the only healer of the party.

 

Fifth point, no one can buff my allyes. I won't use scrolls and i have no clerics.

 

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In short, it will be so easy to mess things up...

 

Any suggestions about what i should do to make this party beat the main game? ( no WM)

 

I have some ideas, but i'll like to hear the suggestion of you veterans of the game.

Edited July 31, 2016 by Masterteo89

[Loren Tyr]

Actually, in terms of tankiness you should have no problem with your barbarian. I've been running a Barbarian tank in Hard recently myself, with a very strong focus on high CON and DR. He has base 19 CON (and 18 MIG), with Binding Rope and double Whispers of Yenwood for 25 CON, easily pushed to 30 or even higher with some chicken and resting bonuses. He's currently level 11, and with an additional +2 CON at the moment he has 385 Endurance and 2309 Health. I also have him in Exceptional Plate, which gives a base DR of 18 (with Crucible Knight talent), and against slash/pierce/crush he is 26/26/24 (with Thick-skinned and Crush-proofing). As needed, add Bulwark of the Elements potions. I also have Veteran's Recovery and Shod-In-Faith, though that starts to feel a bit redundant at this stage.

 

Anyway, he gets hit all the time (only 44 Deflection, not going to waste slots on Deflection items), but that hardly makes a dent and mostly results enemies getting Stuck due to the Binding Rope. Also, the low deflection means many enemies are likely to keep attacking him rather than squishier backliners. He's also essentially invulnerable to Fortitude attacks, at 131 Fortitude at the moment (with Bear's Fortitude; not counting Body Control and Towering Physique, or +16 more from Frenzy), so you can basically just walk into combat without worrying overly much about what the enemy is trying to do to you; just have them crowd around and grind them into paste with Carnage. Plate Armour and 8 DEX doesn't make for a very fast attacker even with dual-wielding, but when you're nigh invulnerable (and Aloth keeps on lobbing in Rolling Flames) you don't really need to be. 

 

So yeah, with a high CON / heavy armour Barbarian tank your frontline should be fine (and you won't need much reviving or healing). The only real weak point are Confusion, Charming and Domination effects (though they often are), so you could opt to invest more talent like Bull's Will and Mental Fortress for extra will defense, and items with bonuses against those kinds of attack (or +10 spell defense). With Snow Cap you'd be reasonably protected there as well.

[Masterteo89]

UPDATE

 

Just to make things a bit more harder... my rangers will be naked.

 

No armour means faster attack speed, but it also makes then 2 glass cannons.

[Boeroer]

Why not put on clothing? Looks less stupid and has the same stats (as long as you don't enchant it).

[Masterteo89]

Why not put on clothing? Looks less stupid and has the same stats (as long as you don't enchant it).

 

you know, you are right.

 

 

On a side note, what weapon should i put on my 2 rangers ?

 

I was thinking of war bows, but i don't know. I would like to give them unique bows. Not guns, bows. What bows should i find and where to find them?

 

Plus, i'm not used to do ranger class : in what kind of skills should i focus ? Improvement of my rangers or improvement on my animal campanions?

[Climhazzard]

Try this http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/85513-class-build-storm-plague-caller/  

 

Since you're using 2 rangers one can do storm and the other plague, it'll be devastating. 

[Boeroer]

Two rangers and their bows. There are few topics/questions that are that clear for me.

 

100% Persistence + Stormcaller. There are no better weapons for two bow rangers. Seriously. War bows can't compete with those.

 

One big advantage is that you can get both quite early if you want. The parts of Stormcaller can be obtained via scouting/sneaking - no combat necessary.

 

Persistence is the ranged weapon with the highest DPS because of it's wounding which works as a raw lash and gets calculated before DR - so this weapon is even good against high DR foes. It also triggers Predator's Sense.

 

Stormcaller's Returning Storm gets triggered every third shot with Twinned Arrows and Driving Flight. It's base damage also works with Heart of the Storm and has a DR bypass of 11 if you use Penetrating Shot.

With Stormcaller you can even use Weapon Focus Adventurer first and use war bows until you get Stormcaller (has universal weapon focus).

 

I think most people here will agree that those are the best weapons for rangers.

 

Edit: Twin Sting is nice as an addition but comes really late. It's also not bad for a cipher, because you can shoot two times without reloading.

Edited July 31, 2016 by Boeroer

[Masterteo89]

Try this http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/85513-class-build-storm-plague-caller/

 

Since you're using 2 rangers one can do storm and the other plague, it'll be devastating. 

 

Interesting, i have to say. Don't know those items because i never do WM, but this time i will do WM1 and 2.

 

I have a feeling that i'll need WM items if i want to beat Talos with my unbalanced party.

[Masterteo89]

Two rangers and their bows. There are few topics/questions that are that clear for me.

 

100% Persistence + Stormcaller. There are no better weapons for two bow rangers. Seriously. War bows can't compete with those.

 

One big advantage is that you can get both quite early if you want. The parts of Stormcaller can be obtained via scouting/sneaking - no combat necessary.

 

Persistence is the ranged weapon with the highest DPS because of it's wounding which works as a raw lash and gets calculated before DR - so this weapon is even good against high DR foes. It also triggers Predator's Sense.

 

Stormcaller's Returning Storm gets triggered every third shot with Twinned Arrows and Driving Flight. It's base damage also works with Heart of the Storm and has a DR bypass of 11 if you use Penetrating Shot.

With Stormcaller you can even use Weapon Focus Adventurer first and use war bows until you get Stormcaller (has universal weapon focus).

 

I think most people here will agree that those are the best weapons for rangers.

 

Edit: Twin Sting is nice as an addition but comes really late. It's also not bad for a cipher, because you can shoot two times without reloading.

 

So i should give Persistence to one ranger and stormcaller to the other?

 

2 questions then :

 

1- Where do i find both bows ?

 

2- What kind of skills, talents, should i do ?

[Boeroer]

Yes, one ranger with Persistence, the other with Stormcaller.

 

1.:

Persistence: lvl 4 Endless Paths, southwest of the map on a dead body.

Stormcaller: WM, Russetwood. After entering the Russetwood map, sneak southwest until you find a wounded wolf. Get the silver arrow that sticks in his flank. You can heal the wolf with enough survival or special spells like charm beast or just put him out of his misery. Then go to Durgan's Battery map and sneak to the northeast of the battery and climb up the watchtower  (the battery lies in the norhwest of the map, the watchtower lies east of it). On th top of the watchtower you will find the bow. Arrow and bow will automatically merge and form Stormcaller. You can then bind it you your ranger and start to upgrade it (shouldn't take too long - it's already exceptional and does -6 shock DR on hit). As I said with this ranger you can use war bows first because Stormcaller works with any weapon focus. The 20 INT on your second ranger is maybe better for Stormcaller than for Persistence. The -6 shock DR debuff will last longer. I would also take Binding Roots with that ranger because those will last for a very long time with 20 INT.

The shock DR debuff of Stormcaller will help your druid enormously if he uses shock spells (which he should). Relentless and Returning Storm are a great tandem and will stunlock most enemies in range while doing good damage.

 

2.: Both bows work fine with Twinned Arrows, Stunning Shots & Driving Flight. The rest is plain old ranged skilling. Marksman, Penetrating Shot, such things. Swift Aim doesn't work with Twinned Arrows so you could think about taking Outlander's Frenzy for more damage and attack speed. I would always take Merciless, Vicious and Resilient Companion plus Predator's Sense. I would take wolf and Stag companion, never the lion - and never two of the same because you'll confuse them all the time. Wolf is the best single target dps animal companion (he is running faster, hits faster than a bear or a lion and has 2 more base damage which means all the damage mods from merciless/vicious companion and predator's sense work even better). The stag has a 40sec carnage attack mode which it can be triggered 1/encounter. Your druid can do DoT AoE spells (Plague of Insects for example) which will trigger Predator's Sense for all the carnage targets - very powerful! The lion's roar only causes frighten (not terrify) which is quite lame and also misses a lot. The duration and AoE is also bad (the duration and AoE is determined by the pet's INT - and as you might guess a lion's INT isn't too high...). Wolf and Stag are better. The bear is not bad for a bit of tanking, but he hits very slowly. 

Edited July 31, 2016 by Boeroer

[Masterteo89]

Yes, one ranger with Persistence, the other with Stormcaller.

 

1.:

Persistence: lvl 4 Endless Paths, southwest of the map on a dead body.

Stormcaller: WM, Russetwood. After entering the Russetwood map, sneak southwest until you find a wounded wolf. Get the silver arrow that sticks in his flank. You can heal the wolf with enough survival or special spells like charm beast or just put him out of his misery. Then go to Durgan's Battery map and sneak to the northeast of the battery and climb up the watchtower  (the battery lies in the norhwest of the map, the watchtower lies east of it). On th top of the watchtower you will find the bow. Arrow and bow will automatically merge and form Stormcaller. You can then bind it you your ranger and start to upgrade it (shouldn't take too long - it's already exceptional and does -6 shock DR on hit). As I said with this ranger you can use war bows first because Stormcaller works with any weapon focus. The 20 INT on your second ranger is maybe better for Stormcaller than for Persistence. The -6 shock DR debuff will last longer. I would also take Binding Roots with that ranger because those will last for a very long time with 20 INT.

The shock DR debuff of Stormcaller will help your druid enormously if he uses shock spells (which he should). Relentless and Returning Storm are a great tandem and will stunlock most enemies in range while doing good damage.

 

2.: Both bows work fine with Twinned Arrows, Stunning Shots & Driving Flight. The rest is plain old ranged skilling. Marksman, Penetrating Shot, such things. Swift Aim doesn't work with Twinned Arrows so you could think about taking Outlander's Frenzy for more damage and attack speed. I would always take Merciless, Vicious and Resilient Companion plus Predator's Sense. I would take wolf and Stag companion, never the lion - and never two of the same because you'll confuse them all the time. Wolf is the best single target dps animal companion (he is running faster, hits faster than a bear or a lion and has 2 more base damage which means all the damage mods from merciless/vicious companion and predator's sense work even better). The stag has a 40sec carnage attack mode which it can be triggered 1/encounter. Your druid can do DoT AoE spells (Plague of Insects for example) which will trigger Predator's Sense for all the carnage targets - very powerful! The lion's roar only causes frighten (not terrify) which is quite lame and also misses a lot. The duration and AoE is also bad (the duration and AoE is determined by the pet's INT - and as you might guess a lion's INT isn't too high...). Wolf and Stag are better. The bear is not bad for a bit of tanking, but he hits very slowly. 

 

Thank you for your help and advices, i can't wait to try these bows.

 

About skills and companions, i already have Swift Aim and lion companions, so in this matter i can't turn back, i fear.

[Boeroer]

Well you can retrain.

[Masterteo89]

Well you can retrain.

 

If i retrain i can change animal companions ?

 

I don't know how was i able to beat the game on PoTD , considering how many things i still don't know.

[Boeroer]

Yes, with a hireling you can choose another pet when retraining - but not with Sagani.

And you can use Swift Aim and then retrain at lvl 13 when you get Twinned Arrows. Before that Swift Aim is totally fine for Stormcaller. Another way is to use Outlander's Frenzy plus Vicious Aim. This will result in +5% (+25%,-20%) speed and a lot more damage per hit because you get +32% damage (+4 MIG, +20% Vicious Aim) and also +20 ACC which leads to a lot more crits. Outlander's Frenzy and Swift Aim don't stack by the way. 

 

Just out of curiosity you could even try to use Vicious Aim (more crits = more wounding damage) with Persistence and Swift Aim (more hits = more procs of Returning Storm) with Stormcaller and compare the dps. Should be interesting. At lvl 13 you should use Twinned Arrows instead because it's clearly superior. 

 

Using Outlander's Frenzy can result in a shortage of talent points when it comes to the talents that you want to take for the animal companion. As I said I recommend at least Merciless & Vicious & Resilient Companion as well as Predator's Sense (but that's an ability). When all those are active (easily with Stunning Shots or Binding Roots, combined with Persistence or Wounding Shot) the pet's damage is very, very high per hit. Even higher for a wolf (single target) or stag (AoE damage).

If you take the Takedown ability for your pet (it's not that bad anymore, in fact it's quite cool) and later Brutal Takedown (talent - adds crush damage which stacks with the normal, already sky high damage of the hit) then the pet becomes even more impressive. But then you will see that you run out of talant points for your shooting. Maybe that you'd have to skip marksman or Pen. Shot then. I focused my persistence based ranger on pet's damage, so I took all the pet's goodies and skipped Marksman and Outlander's Frenzy. I used Persistence as a "wounding marker" for my pet mainly. But of couse it still does great damage. With Stormaller it was the other way round: I wanted to proc Returning Storm as much as possible and keep up the -6 shock DR for my teammates. Just to have a bit of diversity in the two rangers' playstyle.

This is not necessarily the best way to do it, but It worked out well and was fun. 

Edited August 1, 2016 by Boeroer