DPS Paladin

[Anaeme]

What is the best weapon type for a DPS paladin?

 

Is there a survivability problem using the 2-Handed instead of the Sword and Shield Style?

 

What is the best way to play the Paladin?

 

I play on PoTD and this would be my first paladin build.

 

 

I may be wrong but using daggers appears two 'wimpy' for a paladin

[KDubya]

I'm a fan of using big two handers for Paladins. The hardest enemies also have the largest DR so going for slower bigger hits is better than fast and weak.

 

 To me DR matters more than deflection but you can still get 100+ deflection with two hander Paladin of you have two of them in the party and they cast Reinforcing Exhortation on each other for a big +25 deflection buff. This also gets you two auras and four Lay on Hands.

 

I've got a PotD Kind Wayfarer Island Aumaua using Long-Feller Arquebus for a FoD alpha, then either Tidefall or Grey Sleeper. Good survivability, leads team in damage at level 13. Just got the Sacred Immolation on him and Pellagrinna and looking forward to double the burn. Stats are 18 Might, 10 dex, 10 con, 15 perception, 10 intellect and 15 resolve. Team is MC Paladin, Pellagrinna, Kana, Grieving Mother, Zahua and will drop Sagani for Devil. Heavy on the melee. Since most of the team is on the frontline the 10 intellect aura is plenty. Also means there are no real squishy team members that need to be protected. If I lose Sagani or Grieving Mother it doesn't change much, the big hard hitting heavy plate team of two paladins, a monk and a chanter will beat down most encounters.

[Boeroer]

I use two island aumaua pallys with quick switch at the moment. 2 Arquebus and 2 Arbalests for the FoD alpha strikes and then I switch to outworn buckler/little saviour + war hammers for a great +10 in all defenses effect because this shields stack. And it works great! 4 very fast, very high damage alpha strikes and then lots of tankyness while doing OK damage. If you have on-kill-effects that's also great because you can steal kills easily with the FoD shots and quick switch. But I think great swords like Tidefall or Hours of St. Rumbalt would also be nice. Defenses are high enough without shields most of the time. However after Sacred Immolation + Scion of Flame nothing else matters anyway.

 

I have to say that paladins changed from "Narp" to "Yarp" for me. Not only because of their Sacred Immolation, but also because that you can play them more offensively while still beging very sturdy and supporting your party big time while requiring nearly no micromanagement.

 

I also love the chanter now since I use his 2 short lvl-1-chants to boost all defenses (except deflection) and move speed and then use his huge aoe paralyze invocation. Also nearly no micro while adding up defense buffs with the pallies. The fights are slower now because I traded DPS for defense - but I nearly never get knocked out or CC'd to a point where I would be in danger of loosing the fight.

Edited October 27, 2015 by Boeroer

[Anaeme]

Thanks so much folks...you cant imagine how helpful this is

[AndreaColombo]

St. Ydwen's Redeemer also isn't bad on Paladins. The Divine Mark proc is quite dandy.

[Anaeme]

I Also built a wizard with the low Con (3) and resolve (3) that was suggested in another thread.

 

I do not know if that kind of glass cannon will be fun to play...they will have to cast spirit shield before every fight. Also if they need to draw Citzal lance...their arcane shield may not last long enough to finish a fight 

[Vicarius]

I Also built a wizard with the low Con (3) and resolve (3) that was suggested in another thread.

 

I do not know if that kind of glass cannon will be fun to play...they will have to cast spirit shield before every fight. Also if they need to draw Citzal lance...their arcane shield may not last long enough to finish a fight 

 

I don't like dumping con to 3 generally and certainly wouldn't do it on potd. You can probably get away with it but it's really not needed. I build my potd wizards (and priests) like this:

 

Wiz (arbalest and summoned pike)

M - 15

C - 10

D - 15

P - 15

I  - 18

R - 5 (2 or 3 this if you wish, I think 5 looks better)

 

 

My current potd run I use 2 Paladins and it's working great. One as party leader and another as tanky-dps/support. Zealous focus and zealous endurance. Reinforcing exhortation when needed which isn't often. No need for defensive talents except maybe beefing up saving throws later in the game, though im not convinced it makes much of a difference on potd unless you spent two talents on a single defense type. Remember that you can't cast exhortations on self, which is senseless imo. It fits a selfless theme but makes no logical sense to me and limits the class. Draining 2 handers are nice as well. Moon godlike + draining 2 hander + faith and conviction is very survivable (if your worried) and good dps with offensive talents. 

[Ksajal]

You can also build your paladin dual wielding fast one-handers. Each attack has two phases, the actual attack animation and the recovery time. Armor affects the recovery time, and fast one-handers have the lowest recovery time, so plate armor affects them the least. For fast one-handers you could go with Sword of Daenysis (bought from Ondra's Gift) and Mosquito (from Dyrford Village), both can be bought after you finish the quest from Caed Nua. Another very good one-handed weapon is Spelltongue, you can find it during the expansion. Offensive combo would be Spelltongue + Daenysis, defensive Spelltongue + Mosquito (that's what I'm using on my rogue). All three are rapiers, by the way.

 

On the subject on dual wielding, you can also go with average speed weapons, like dual sabres (sabres are one handed weapons with 2handed weapon damage), Resolution and Bittercut are very, very, very good weapons and you can get them about level 7. Another option for average speed weapons is dual battleaxes, We Toki and Edge of Reason, because We Toki prones on crit, but you can only get it pretty late in the game (depends if you rush it or not). And you can also go with Cladhaliath (spear) because you forge it yourself and Hearth Harvest, which is a very decent hatchet, both can be had in the mid game, about level 7. Hearth Harvest as soon as you do the Caed Nua quest.

 

As for 2Handed weapons... my favorite is The Hours of St Rumbalt (greatsword) because it has very good damage, two damage types and can prone on hit. On top of that, you can buy it from Dyrford as soon as you leave Caed Nua. Estocs are also very good, Drake's Bell comes to mind as relatively easy to get (it's from the first bounty quest) and insane damage reduction. And towards the end game you can get another very, very good estoc.

 

As for min-maxing... I don't like it. You can do just fine as a DPS paladin by having 18 might (for healing/damage), 15 int (or maybe less, depending how many characters you want to affect with our aura) and the rest into perception.

[brindle88]

The problem with a dps paladin is that you generally can't min max your stats effectively enough to be able to punch through the damage reduction of enemies (which is about 12 on average) because for a paladin to work you need high intelligence and high resolve.

 

Due to the this, if you are using a 1 handed weapon with a Sheild with low, might, dex, perc you will probably hit your opponents quite slowly and inaccurately for very low damage, probably about around 15 damage every hit.............a complete waste of time.

 

So if you want to punch through the damage reduction you will have to use the 2 handed weapons, and even this will not be very effective as you will still have the low stats as described above.

 

Now compare this to a fighter with a two handed weapon with maxed, might, dex, perception and armoured grace.

 

There is no such thing as a dps paladin, but having said that I have really enjoyed playing them due to the versatility with there strong points ( which does not include doing damage).

 

They genuinely are quite an interesting and fun class to play.

[AndreaColombo]

Why must a Paladin have high Resolve? They can easily do without if you're building for DPS instead of defense.

[Mocker22]

I found a 2her pally to be plenty tanky. Faith and Conviction is awesome for making up the difference. Definitely go for Weapon Focus Soldier. Tall Grass, soulbound greatsword, etc. all rock. Also the Forgemaster Gloves for firebrand work great at alow levels. 

 

I personally prefer my tanks to be able to deal some dmg so this works very well. I also found a dps oriented monk in good plate armor to be a great tank.

[Vicarius]

Why must a Paladin have high Resolve? They can easily do without if you're building for DPS instead of defense.

 

You're exactly right. Faith and Conviction saves the day. Having another Pally with reinforcing exhortation makes it even better. You don't even need might because 2 handers and offensive talents will do plenty of damage against high DR. My dps off tank pally uses these stats:

 

Moon Godlike - Blade of Endless paths or Tidefall + Firebrand gloves, (currently using superb unique light armor)

M - 10

C - 10

D - 18

P - 15 (you could 18 this with interrupting blows)

I  - 15

R - 10

 

Offensive Talents:

Weapon focus

Two handed style

Apprentice sneak attacks

Sworn enemy

Savage attacks

[brindle88]

Why must a Paladin have high Resolve? They can easily do without if you're building for DPS instead of defense.

There are 3 answers to this question

 

1. Why on earth would you build a paladin with low resolve? He is front line, he is melee, he is your tank. You will just be wasting ability points on other attributes that will not enhance the paladins strengths. You will build a weak paladin (especially on POTD)

 

2. A dps fighter will wipe the floor with a paladin, they can dump int and they have access to abilities to choose from at level up greatly increase dps. Alll melee classes will out dps a paladin. If you wanted a dps tank build a fighter

 

3. So the paladins strengths are tanking and buffs, you should build to enhance these qualities.

[Vicarius]

 

Why must a Paladin have high Resolve? They can easily do without if you're building for DPS instead of defense.

There are 3 answers to this question

 

1. Why on earth would you build a paladin with low resolve? He is front line, he is melee, he is your tank. You will just be wasting ability points on other attributes that will not enhance the paladins strengths. You will build a weak paladin (especially on POTD)

 

2. A dps fighter will wipe the floor with a paladin, they can dump int and they have access to abilities to choose from at level up greatly increase dps. Alll melee classes will out dps a paladin. If you wanted a dps tank build a fighter

 

3. So the paladins strengths are tanking and buffs, you should build to enhance these qualities.

 

 

Faith and conviction defeats the need for max resolve allowing dps stats. Unless you're building a pure tank there is no need.

 

Sworn enemy (20% damage and 15 acc) negates the advantage of specialization and mastery. Sure it's only 3 uses and single target but that's enough for the important fights each rest. Critical focus and confident aim probably cancel each other out. Zealous auras add something as well. 

 

Throw in the other abilities and it's just flavor. For me, exhortations and lay on hands are very specific tactical skills which add a lot of utility to the Paladin. Fighter skills just arent as interesting to me.

[brindle88]

 

 

Why must a Paladin have high Resolve? They can easily do without if you're building for DPS instead of defense.

 

There are 3 answers to this question

1. Why on earth would you build a paladin with low resolve? He is front line, he is melee, he is your tank. You will just be wasting ability points on other attributes that will not enhance the paladins strengths. You will build a weak paladin (especially on POTD)

2. A dps fighter will wipe the floor with a paladin, they can dump int and they have access to abilities to choose from at level up greatly increase dps. Alll melee classes will out dps a paladin. If you wanted a dps tank build a fighter

3. So the paladins strengths are tanking and buffs, you should build to enhance these qualities.

 

Faith and conviction defeats the need for max resolve allowing dps stats. Unless you're building a pure tank there is no need.

 

Sworn enemy (20% damage and 15 acc) negates the advantage of specialization and mastery. Sure it's only 3 uses and single target but that's enough for the important fights each rest. Critical focus and confident aim probably cancel each other out. Zealous auras add something as well. 

 

Throw in the other abilities and it's just flavor. For me, exhortations and lay on hands are very specific tactical skills which add a lot of utility to the Paladin. Fighter skills just arent as interesting to me.

Yes but the opportunity cost of selecting all these talents on a paladin that enhances deflection and dps is the cost of not being able to select the talents that they where built for. Paladins have a huge range of buffs, debufffs to choose from and foregoing them to attempt to create a second rate fighter is not effective.

[KDubya]

 

Why must a Paladin have high Resolve? They can easily do without if you're building for DPS instead of defense.

There are 3 answers to this question

 

1. Why on earth would you build a paladin with low resolve? He is front line, he is melee, he is your tank. You will just be wasting ability points on other attributes that will not enhance the paladins strengths. You will build a weak paladin (especially on POTD)

 

2. A dps fighter will wipe the floor with a paladin, they can dump int and they have access to abilities to choose from at level up greatly increase dps. Alll melee classes will out dps a paladin. If you wanted a dps tank build a fighter

 

3. So the paladins strengths are tanking and buffs, you should build to enhance these qualities.

 

 

 

Fighters are pretty much trash, bad abilities and do nothing to help the team.

 

Your DPS fighter will probably have something like this:

Might 18

Con 10

Dex 15

Per 15

Int 3

Res 17 - to balance out the low will from dumped intellect

 Talents - Weapon spec, focus, mastery, confident aim, vigorous defense, armored grace, sundering blow, two handed style, savage attack, and vulnerable attack.

 

Damage will be +24% Might, +15% spec, +10% mastery, +20% savage attack +13.5% Confident aim (+20 minimum, plus the graze to hit roughly equal to 13.5%), +15% two handed style = +97.5% with +15 -20 +16  = +11% speed increase

 

Defenses will be +8 Fortitude, +10 Reflex, and +0 Will, +7 deflection. All increased by +20 for like 10 seconds when Vigorous defense is activated.

 

A Paladin (using my PotD Kind Wayfarer)

 

Might 18

Con 10

Dex 10

Per 15

Int 10

Res  15

 

Talents - weapon focus, savage attack, vulnerable attack, flames of devotion, Lay on Hands, accuracy aura, sacred immolation, liberating exhortation, reinforcing exhortation, strange mercies, deep faith, scion of flames, two handed style.

 

Damage will be +24% might, +15% two handed style, +20% savage attack = +59% damage at -20% speed plus the AoE burn from Sacred Immolation

 

defenses will be +35 Fortitude (+8 +27), +37 Reflex (+10 +27), +32 Will (+5 +27), +18 (+5 +13) deflection

 

team benefits of accuracy aura, lay on hands, liberating and reinforcing exhortations and AoE heal from Sacred Immolation

 

 

The Fighter swings 31% faster and 38.5% harder against one target. Unit damage would be 1.11*1.97 = 2.19

 

Paladin would be 0.8*1.59 = 1.272 weapon + 1.44 (scion of flames and Might) Sacred Immolation for 2.71. Each additional target would further the gap.

 

With Sacred Immolation (base damage same as two handed weapon) the Paladin will out damage against just one enemy, and be much more defensive and help the team.

 

No reason to even bother comparing a Monk to a Fighter, they are not even in the same league. If there were PvP Monks would be banned. A single summoned Twin could give a Fighter a hard fight, two would woop his ass, two plus the Monk himself could hold the Fighter down and sodomize him

[brindle88]

 

 

Why must a Paladin have high Resolve? They can easily do without if you're building for DPS instead of defense.

 

There are 3 answers to this question

1. Why on earth would you build a paladin with low resolve? He is front line, he is melee, he is your tank. You will just be wasting ability points on other attributes that will not enhance the paladins strengths. You will build a weak paladin (especially on POTD)

2. A dps fighter will wipe the floor with a paladin, they can dump int and they have access to abilities to choose from at level up greatly increase dps. Alll melee classes will out dps a paladin. If you wanted a dps tank build a fighter

3. So the paladins strengths are tanking and buffs, you should build to enhance these qualities.

 

 

Fighters are pretty much trash, bad abilities and do nothing to help the team.

 

Your DPS fighter will probably have something like this:

Might 18

Con 10

Dex 15

Per 15

Int 3

Res 17 - to balance out the low will from dumped intellect

 Talents - Weapon spec, focus, mastery, confident aim, vigorous defense, armored grace, sundering blow, two handed style, savage attack, and vulnerable attack.

 

Damage will be +24% Might, +15% spec, +10% mastery, +20% savage attack +13.5% Confident aim (+20 minimum, plus the graze to hit roughly equal to 13.5%), +15% two handed style = +97.5% with +15 -20 +16  = +11% speed increase

 

Defenses will be +8 Fortitude, +10 Reflex, and +0 Will, +7 deflection. All increased by +20 for like 10 seconds when Vigorous defense is activated.

 

A Paladin (using my PotD Kind Wayfarer)

 

Might 18

Con 10

Dex 10

Per 15

Int 10

Res  15

 

Talents - weapon focus, savage attack, vulnerable attack, flames of devotion, Lay on Hands, accuracy aura, sacred immolation, liberating exhortation, reinforcing exhortation, strange mercies, deep faith, scion of flames, two handed style.

 

Damage will be +24% might, +15% two handed style, +20% savage attack = +59% damage at -20% speed plus the AoE burn from Sacred Immolation

 

defenses will be +35 Fortitude (+8 +27), +37 Reflex (+10 +27), +32 Will (+5 +27), +18 (+5 +13) deflection

 

team benefits of accuracy aura, lay on hands, liberating and reinforcing exhortations and AoE heal from Sacred Immolation

 

 

The Fighter swings 31% faster and 38.5% harder against one target. Unit damage would be 1.11*1.97 = 2.19

 

Paladin would be 0.8*1.59 = 1.272 weapon + 1.44 (scion of flames and Might) Sacred Immolation for 2.71. Each additional target would further the gap.

 

With Sacred Immolation (base damage same as two handed weapon) the Paladin will out damage against just one enemy, and be much more defensive and help the team.

 

No reason to even bother comparing a Monk to a Fighter, they are not even in the same league. If there were PvP Monks would be banned. A single summoned Twin could give a Fighter a hard fight, two would woop his ass, two plus the Monk himself could hold the Fighter down and sodomize him

That's quite an analysis.

 

I would not build a fighter like that, I would not pick vigorous defence, sundering blow or vulnerable attack ( why the hell would you pick this when you already will punch through damage reduction). So that leaves a big heap of other talents available to increase dps and deflection.Perception should Be maxed con should be lowered.

 

On your paladin:

 

- you have low intelligence, you have nerfed all your abilities. Intelligence needs to be minimum of 16. You will need to take these points from might, therefore you may as well not even put any points into might as an extra 2 will not be relevant.

- your accuracy aura will be so small it will only affect your paladin, so it's not really an aura.

- out of all your talent selections you have picked for the paladin, you have selected 5 that a fighter can pick anyway.

- the exhortations are useless, they do not work on charm, confused stunned.

- that flaming sword talent is only for use twice.

- sacred immolation is only available at the very end of the game

[brindle88]

 

 

 

Why must a Paladin have high Resolve? They can easily do without if you're building for DPS instead of defense.

There are 3 answers to this question

1. Why on earth would you build a paladin with low resolve? He is front line, he is melee, he is your tank. You will just be wasting ability points on other attributes that will not enhance the paladins strengths. You will build a weak paladin (especially on POTD)

2. A dps fighter will wipe the floor with a paladin, they can dump int and they have access to abilities to choose from at level up greatly increase dps. Alll melee classes will out dps a paladin. If you wanted a dps tank build a fighter

3. So the paladins strengths are tanking and buffs, you should build to enhance these qualities.

 

 

Fighters are pretty much trash, bad abilities and do nothing to help the team.

 

Your DPS fighter will probably have something like this:

Might 18

Con 10

Dex 15

Per 15

Int 3

Res 17 - to balance out the low will from dumped intellect

 Talents - Weapon spec, focus, mastery, confident aim, vigorous defense, armored grace, sundering blow, two handed style, savage attack, and vulnerable attack.

 

Damage will be +24% Might, +15% spec, +10% mastery, +20% savage attack +13.5% Confident aim (+20 minimum, plus the graze to hit roughly equal to 13.5%), +15% two handed style = +97.5% with +15 -20 +16  = +11% speed increase

 

Defenses will be +8 Fortitude, +10 Reflex, and +0 Will, +7 deflection. All increased by +20 for like 10 seconds when Vigorous defense is activated.

 

A Paladin (using my PotD Kind Wayfarer)

 

Might 18

Con 10

Dex 10

Per 15

Int 10

Res  15

 

Talents - weapon focus, savage attack, vulnerable attack, flames of devotion, Lay on Hands, accuracy aura, sacred immolation, liberating exhortation, reinforcing exhortation, strange mercies, deep faith, scion of flames, two handed style.

 

Damage will be +24% might, +15% two handed style, +20% savage attack = +59% damage at -20% speed plus the AoE burn from Sacred Immolation

 

defenses will be +35 Fortitude (+8 +27), +37 Reflex (+10 +27), +32 Will (+5 +27), +18 (+5 +13) deflection

 

team benefits of accuracy aura, lay on hands, liberating and reinforcing exhortations and AoE heal from Sacred Immolation

 

 

The Fighter swings 31% faster and 38.5% harder against one target. Unit damage would be 1.11*1.97 = 2.19

 

Paladin would be 0.8*1.59 = 1.272 weapon + 1.44 (scion of flames and Might) Sacred Immolation for 2.71. Each additional target would further the gap.

 

With Sacred Immolation (base damage same as two handed weapon) the Paladin will out damage against just one enemy, and be much more defensive and help the team.

 

No reason to even bother comparing a Monk to a Fighter, they are not even in the same league. If there were PvP Monks would be banned. A single summoned Twin could give a Fighter a hard fight, two would woop his ass, two plus the Monk himself could hold the Fighter down and sodomize him

That's quite an analysis.

I would not build a fighter like that, I would not pick vigorous defence, sundering blow or vulnerable attack ( why the hell would you pick this when you already will punch through damage reduction). So that leaves a big heap of other talents available to increase dps and deflection.Perception should Be maxed con should be lowered.

On your paladin:

- you have low intelligence, you have nerfed all your abilities. Intelligence needs to be minimum of 16. You will need to take these points from might, therefore you may as well not even put any points into might as an extra 2 will not be relevant.

- your accuracy aura will be so small it will only affect your paladin, so it's not really an aura.

- out of all your talent selections you have picked for the paladin, you have selected 5 that a fighter can pick anyway.

- the exhortations are useless, they do not work on charm, confused stunned.

- that flaming sword talent is only for use twice.

- sacred immolation is only available at the very end of the game

If the exhortations worked properly eg they really did act as a dispel magic and remove charm and paralysed related affects paladins would actually work. They care currently a second rate fighter/ priest.

 

But still fun to play like is said, but Definately not a power build

[KDubya]

With a 10 intellect my aura covers the entire frontline melee which is most of my team, which is all I need. Definitely not worthless. The heals are all affected by Might as well as intellect so the duration is lower but they are stronger.

 

I did not include any damage analysis from FoD since it is only for two attacks, it is nice for those two attacks though.

 

Vulnerable attack does more damage per second once the enemy DR is above five, test it out yourself. It is a set and forget ability.

 

What talents are you taking that increase your damage beyond the ones I used for the Fighter? What is your Fighter build?

 

How well does your low con, low deflection, low defenses work out for you on PotD?

 

Prior to Sacred immolation a Fighter will out damage a Paladin, while a Paladin will have much higher defenses and deflection. Also the benefit to a team is much greater with a Paladin.

 

 

 

If all you want is a single target damager that has some survivability you'd be better with a tanky Rogue rather than an offensive Fighter.

 

Tanky Rogue

Might 13

Con 10

Dex 18

Per 15

Int 4 - minimum with food and a +2 item to keep a target permanently prone with We toki

Res 18

 

Talent weapon and shield, savage attack, deep wounds, reckless assault, the two hit>crits, Evasion, vulnerable attack, superior deflection, lesser reckless penalty, deathblows

 

Damage = +9% might, +20% savage, +20% reckless = +49% w/o sneak, +99% w/sneak, +149% w/deathblows all with +20% hit>crit

 

defenses with large shield - +3 Fortitude, + 35  Reflex (+13 + 6 + 16), +2 Will, +  32 deflection (+8 -8 +6 + 5 +5 +16)

 

The tanky Rogue can handle all the mechanics and is durable enough to flank to set up its own sneak attacks w/o needing to babysit. With a little help from the team it can frequently get deathblows.

[brindle88]

With a 10 intellect my aura covers the entire frontline melee which is most of my team, which is all I need. Definitely not worthless. The heals are all affected by Might as well as intellect so the duration is lower but they are stronger.

 

I did not include any damage analysis from FoD since it is only for two attacks, it is nice for those two attacks though.

 

Vulnerable attack does more damage per second once the enemy DR is above five, test it out yourself. It is a set and forget ability.

 

What talents are you taking that increase your damage beyond the ones I used for the Fighter? What is your Fighter build?

 

How well does your low con, low deflection, low defenses work out for you on PotD?

 

Prior to Sacred immolation a Fighter will out damage a Paladin, while a Paladin will have much higher defenses and deflection. Also the benefit to a team is much greater with a Paladin.

 

 

 

If all you want is a single target damager that has some survivability you'd be better with a tanky Rogue rather than an offensive Fighter.

 

Tanky Rogue

Might 13

Con 10

Dex 18

Per 15

Int 4 - minimum with food and a +2 item to keep a target permanently prone with We toki

Res 18

 

Talent weapon and shield, savage attack, deep wounds, reckless assault, the two hit>crits, Evasion, vulnerable attack, superior deflection, lesser reckless penalty, deathblows

 

Damage = +9% might, +20% savage, +20% reckless = +49% w/o sneak, +99% w/sneak, +149% w/deathblows all with +20% hit>crit

 

defenses with large shield - +3 Fortitude, + 35  Reflex (+13 + 6 + 16), +2 Will, +  32 deflection (+8 -8 +6 + 5 +5 +16)

 

The tanky Rogue can handle all the mechanics and is durable enough to flank to set up its own sneak attacks w/o needing to babysit. With a little help from the team it can frequently get deathblows.

I didn't seem to have any issues with survivability on any classes on path of the dammed. My rules where that I used 2 tanks and maxed there resolve and the never lowered constitution below 8 for ANY class including my tanks, casters, rogues ect. I dumped resolve for spell casters and rangers.

 

My tanks never had shields, I used 2 fighters one specialised in greatsword, the other estoc. I did this to punch through damage reduction. All stats where maxed to increase dps with the fighters (after pumping resolve) and all talents selected upon level up where aimed to increase dps. I tried doing this with paladins but it is not correct to say they can get anywhere near the dps of a fighter. I also strongly disagree that you can have a low intelligence for a paladin to work properly.

 

Your auro would Definatley not cover your entire melee party with 10 intelligence, you can increase it by up to 50% by increasing int? you would have to have both your tanks right next to each other for this to work! that is bad positioning! you would get flanked and your casters will be killed.

 

At the end of the day the game is not really that challenging even on POTD. If you have a cipher and once you get amplified wave you basically beat the game as soon as you get it anyway.

[brindle88]

With a 10 intellect my aura covers the entire frontline melee which is most of my team, which is all I need. Definitely not worthless. The heals are all affected by Might as well as intellect so the duration is lower but they are stronger.

 

I did not include any damage analysis from FoD since it is only for two attacks, it is nice for those two attacks though.

 

Vulnerable attack does more damage per second once the enemy DR is above five, test it out yourself. It is a set and forget ability.

 

What talents are you taking that increase your damage beyond the ones I used for the Fighter? What is your Fighter build?

 

How well does your low con, low deflection, low defenses work out for you on PotD?

 

Prior to Sacred immolation a Fighter will out damage a Paladin, while a Paladin will have much higher defenses and deflection. Also the benefit to a team is much greater with a Paladin.

 

 

 

If all you want is a single target damager that has some survivability you'd be better with a tanky Rogue rather than an offensive Fighter.

 

Tanky Rogue

Might 13

Con 10

Dex 18

Per 15

Int 4 - minimum with food and a +2 item to keep a target permanently prone with We toki

Res 18

 

Talent weapon and shield, savage attack, deep wounds, reckless assault, the two hit>crits, Evasion, vulnerable attack, superior deflection, lesser reckless penalty, deathblows

 

Damage = +9% might, +20% savage, +20% reckless = +49% w/o sneak, +99% w/sneak, +149% w/deathblows all with +20% hit>crit

 

defenses with large shield - +3 Fortitude, + 35  Reflex (+13 + 6 + 16), +2 Will, +  32 deflection (+8 -8 +6 + 5 +5 +16)

 

The tanky Rogue can handle all the mechanics and is durable enough to flank to set up its own sneak attacks w/o needing to babysit. With a little help from the team it can frequently get deathblows.

And rogues are a completely different issue, again you would never build a tanky rogue, you would be wasting the rogues strong points just like you have wasted the paladins strong points by trying to build a dps paladin that it is inferior to both rogues and fighters

[KDubya]

With a base 10 intellect the aura covers 4 meters which is plenty big enough to cover all the melee on the team. With your "minimum 16 intellect" you'd have 5.44 meters. Its bigger but I have 6 stat points that I placed in Might to have +18% damage and heals.

 

Tanky Rogues are great. maybe your squishy Rogue can do more damage but when you get KO'd your not doing much. A tanky Rogue will out damage a DPS Fighter AND have better defenses.

 

 

Back to DPS Paladins -

1.) Base intellect (10) gets you a 4 meter aura that is enough to cover your entire melee frontline

 

2.) Faith and Conviction gets you huge bonuses to your defense and deflection. This lets you shrug off many enemy CC attacks and lets you skip a shield and use big two handers without sacrificing your deflection.

 

3.) A high Might score will increase all your heals, weapon damage and Sacred Immolation. So you can still serve the group with big LoH heals.

 

4.) Doing bigger damage with weapons will discourage enemies from dis-engaging you, thus letting you 'tank' the enemy better.

 

5.) Flame of Devotion alpha strike with a high might and an arquebus does a lot of damage with a huge accuracy.

 

6.) Sacred Immolation is a great ability that lasts pretty much the whole battle, is centered on you and follows you around, does good damage to all enemies around you and heals your team. Having a high Might score will greatly enhance this, as will Scion of Flames. It even keeps working when you are paralyzed. Once you get this the Paladin is a powerhouse.

 

7.) A Paladin that does damage is fun. Who wants a non-offensive aura bot that is effective only because the AI is not smart enough to ignore?

 

8.) Any Paladin brings more to the team than any Fighter possibly can.

[Boeroer]

Sacred Immolation alone puts a paladin in front of every fighter DPS build. At least in PotD where you have plenty of mobs. The good thing about a DPS paladin are the on-kill-effects that can be great. A fighter doesn't have this. Aoe heals and deflection buffa on kill are great if you combine this with Sacred Immolation and FoD. A fighter can be built to be a very good dps guy also, against single targets he's doing more damage, and with the durgan refined Sanguine Plate with Pilferer's Grip and Armored Grace he will have max armor without recovery penalty which is supercool. But he's not contributing so much to the party like the pally does. Whatever - the only problem here is that brindle loves his clichee fighters and rogues and will argue till doomsday to convince you that DPS pallies and tanky rogues are inferior. All I can say is that after countless of PotD playthroughs I still discover nice and powerful builds and party compositions that are not straightforward.

[brindle88]

With a base 10 intellect the aura covers 4 meters which is plenty big enough to cover all the melee on the team. With your "minimum 16 intellect" you'd have 5.44 meters. Its bigger but I have 6 stat points that I placed in Might to have +18% damage and heals.

 

Tanky Rogues are great. maybe your squishy Rogue can do more damage but when you get KO'd your not doing much. A tanky Rogue will out damage a DPS Fighter AND have better defenses.

 

 

Back to DPS Paladins -

1.) Base intellect (10) gets you a 4 meter aura that is enough to cover your entire melee frontline

 

2.) Faith and Conviction gets you huge bonuses to your defense and deflection. This lets you shrug off many enemy CC attacks and lets you skip a shield and use big two handers without sacrificing your deflection.

 

3.) A high Might score will increase all your heals, weapon damage and Sacred Immolation. So you can still serve the group with big LoH heals.

 

4.) Doing bigger damage with weapons will discourage enemies from dis-engaging you, thus letting you 'tank' the enemy better.

 

5.) Flame of Devotion alpha strike with a high might and an arquebus does a lot of damage with a huge accuracy.

 

6.) Sacred Immolation is a great ability that lasts pretty much the whole battle, is centered on you and follows you around, does good damage to all enemies around you and heals your team. Having a high Might score will greatly enhance this, as will Scion of Flames. It even keeps working when you are paralyzed. Once you get this the Paladin is a powerhouse.

 

7.) A Paladin that does damage is fun. Who wants a non-offensive aura bot that is effective only because the AI is not smart enough to ignore?

 

8.) Any Paladin brings more to the team than any Fighter possibly can.

ok ill give it a try my next play through, I hope your right,

 

I wont be playing again until WMP2 though

 

Keep in mind I never said paladins where crap, I said I think they where fun to play. It is also clear that intelligence buffs nearly all the paladins abilities. It is also clear the dispel magic the paladin uses is terrible as it does not remove the charm/ stun afflictions (bizarrely)

 

Aslo sacred immolation is not available until nearly the end of the game.

[brindle88]

Sacred Immolation alone puts a paladin in front of every fighter DPS build. At least in PotD where you have plenty of mobs. The good thing about a DPS paladin are the on-kill-effects that can be great. A fighter doesn't have this. Aoe heals and deflection buffa on kill are great if you combine this with Sacred Immolation and FoD. A fighter can be built to be a very good dps guy also, against single targets he's doing more damage, and with the durgan refined Sanguine Plate with Pilferer's Grip and Armored Grace he will have max armor without recovery penalty which is supercool. But he's not contributing so much to the party like the pally does. Whatever - the only problem here is that brindle loves his clichee fighters and rogues and will argue till doomsday to convince you that DPS pallies and tanky rogues are inferior. All I can say is that after countless of PotD playthroughs I still discover nice and powerful builds and party compositions that are not straightforward.

I don't love my cliché fighter, I found fighters quite boring but I reckon they do more dps then a paladin. And I still think they do.

 

I do dearly love my dps rogue and I would bet my life savings It can build the strongest build in the game.