brindle88 Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 Right . I have studied then crap out of this topic and I have come to 3 builds that i think are fare and away more pwerful,then any other build. I will list them in order from most powerful, to least powerful: 1. Fighter, with tidefall enchanted with white forge, and that plate you get in WM enchanted to suberb and white forge enchantmen, belt of blunting and not much else matters. The soulbound weapons have there uses but are not comparable to fully enchanted customised weapons, the -15 armour penalty talent is an absolute good send, this combined with high dex will make your fighter into a dps killing machine 2. Wizard , the wizard is vastly overpowerd and rightly so. They need no weapons or armour or items that will really make any significant difference and they absolutley own the battle field, spells like slumber, mass confusion, petrify and that stunning frost fireball spell wreak havok. I think 2 wizards in a party would break the game ( I haven't tried it yet( 3. Rogue, this build requires the most work but if built right, with the right weapons, eg purgatory, resolution and animancer boots and all the crit bonos uses like merciless hand, dungeon delver ect will turn your rogue into a walking god. Tip don't drop intelligence to low you will need it to activate sneak attacks, death blows and crits. 4. The cipher gets a mention but only for 2 spells, AMPLIFIED WAVE is riduclodsly powerful by far the most powerful,spell in the game. Ecosykic echo is capable of melting entire high level party's if positioned right, heaps of fun. I fell the 2 level paralyse spell is over rated it only paralyzes for around 5 seconds and takes about nealy twice that to cast. 5. The druid gets a mention for the relentless storm spell, second most powerful spell after amplified wave. 1
AndreaColombo Posted October 20, 2015 Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) Sanguine Plate is a better armor for your Fighter than the White Crest (which looks amazing but really isn't special from a mechanical perspective); especially so when paired with the Shod-in-Faith boots. That's the bread and butter of my build, in fact. KDubya's Juggernaut Monk is up there too. But are you sure Wizard only comes second? Aloth has the highest number of crits and highest total damage done statistics in my party (though the Lady of Pain has the highest single-target damage and the most hits.) Edited October 20, 2015 by AndreaColombo 1 "Time is not your enemy. Forever is." — Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment "It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers." — Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke | Permanent Per-Rest Bonuses | PoE Items for Deadfire | No Recyled Icons | Soul Charged Nautilus
brindle88 Posted October 21, 2015 Author Posted October 21, 2015 Sanguine Plate is a better armor for your Fighter than the White Crest (which looks amazing but really isn't special from a mechanical perspective); especially so when paired with the Shod-in-Faith boots. That's the bread and butter of my build, in fact. KDubya's Juggernaut Monk is up there too. But are you sure Wizard only comes second? Aloth has the highest number of crits and highest total damage done statistics in my party (though the Lady of Pain has the highest single-target damage and the most hits.) hey mate, can you please elaborate on the benfits of sanguine plate? I had a good look at it but the -10 deflection during frenzy put me off it, you also need high intelligence to make this work properly and int is a dump stat for fighters. Anyone else on good patch 2 builds?????
AndreaColombo Posted October 21, 2015 Posted October 21, 2015 ^ In a nutshell: I like to give my build a high score in Survival to make potions of Deleterious Alacrity of Motion last longer in combat. I generally crank it up to 10, and Sanguine Plate adds +2 on top of that for a total of 12. That's a 60%-longer duration for the one potion that ridiculously boosts your DPS. My build has poor Deflection and is prone to being critted. It offsets this with packing high DR and by wearing items that unleash beneficial effects upon taking a crit: Sanguine Plate and Shod-in-Faith. The -10 penalty to Deflection that comes with Frenzy doesn't really matter much on a build whose Deflection is already poor, especially when Consecrated Grounds is healing you for over 200 points of Endurance and you dish out damage like there was no tomorrow. My build also relies on the presence of a Priest that buffs it, and Priests sure aren't short on Deflection buffs: They can get you as much as +50 Deflection with but two spells, plus another +50 against specific afflictions through the various Prayer Against [...] spells. That said, Frenzy's bonus to Attack Speed doesn't stack with Deleterious Alacrity of Motion and its bonus to Might doesn't stack with that from Priest spells, so its value is diminished in fights in which you heavily rely on buffs. However, it makes a pretty decent trick in fights where you've run out of good buffs or you just can't be bothered to cast them. "Time is not your enemy. Forever is." — Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment "It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers." — Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke | Permanent Per-Rest Bonuses | PoE Items for Deadfire | No Recyled Icons | Soul Charged Nautilus
brindle88 Posted October 21, 2015 Author Posted October 21, 2015 ^ In a nutshell: I like to give my build a high score in Survival to make potions of Deleterious Alacrity of Motion last longer in combat. I generally crank it up to 10, and Sanguine Plate adds +2 on top of that for a total of 12. That's a 60%-longer duration for the one potion that ridiculously boosts your DPS. My build has poor Deflection and is prone to being critted. It offsets this with packing high DR and by wearing items that unleash beneficial effects upon taking a crit: Sanguine Plate and Shod-in-Faith. The -10 penalty to Deflection that comes with Frenzy doesn't really matter much on a build whose Deflection is already poor, especially when Consecrated Grounds is healing you for over 200 points of Endurance and you dish out damage like there was no tomorrow. My build also relies on the presence of a Priest that buffs it, and Priests sure aren't short on Deflection buffs: They can get you as much as +50 Deflection with but two spells, plus another +50 against specific afflictions through the various Prayer Against [...] spells. That said, Frenzy's bonus to Attack Speed doesn't stack with Deleterious Alacrity of Motion and its bonus to Might doesn't stack with that from Priest spells, so its value is diminished in fights in which you heavily rely on buffs. However, it makes a pretty decent trick in fights where you've run out of good buffs or you just can't be bothered to cast them.[/quote/) Bro I think you get way more ot of another suit of plate for the following reasons- - if dextrious motion does not stack Whith frenzy why bother - you lose - 10 def from frenzy - you need a high int which most fighters don't have - boots of cg and healing buffs can be used on anyone. If think the armour just looks really cool and that's about it
AndreaColombo Posted October 22, 2015 Posted October 22, 2015 Yeah, forgot to mention I'm also a huge aesthetics b**ch and Sanguine Plate is my favorite "Time is not your enemy. Forever is." — Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment "It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers." — Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke | Permanent Per-Rest Bonuses | PoE Items for Deadfire | No Recyled Icons | Soul Charged Nautilus
brindle88 Posted October 22, 2015 Author Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) Anyone lse got some our powered builds after the latest patch, come on share them with us. Can't see anyone bettering the wizards, rogues and fighter builds though. I really think ciphers are over rated but They are still fun, Barbarians, rangers and canters need a complete over haul, they are week and boring. Paladins are weak but fun Edited October 22, 2015 by brindle88
Teioh_White Posted October 22, 2015 Posted October 22, 2015 Well, Wizards are clearly the best class, no real question there. Druids and Clerics are great as well, but don't have the same number of obviously overpowered spells as the Wizard. Ciphers are extremely powerful as well, if going strictly by what's in the game. Unlike the Casters however, whose class is just set up to be powerful, Cipher is mostly balanced outside of a few hilarious cheesy powers. Don't select those powers, and it's an interesting and balanced class. Ranger/Rogue/Barbarian/Chanter/Monk/Paladin are pretty well balanced, and wouldn't say one's better than the other. They all just do different things well, and get roughly the same value to a team, which is what you want balance to be. Fighter's pretty much the only class in need of an increase in power, which it looks like 2.03 will be supplying.
AndreaColombo Posted October 22, 2015 Posted October 22, 2015 ^ Chanters have the issue of building up chants really slow. Other than that, they're not a class I'm particularly keen on, but that boils down to personal taste. Just tried to build a Barbarian—there's a pretty nice synergy between Threatening Presence, Brute Force, and Apprentice's Sneak Attack. Barbaric Blow is pretty neat and of course Dragon Leap is cool. Other than that, I can get him to attack with no recovery time while dual-wielding battle axes with Vulnerable Attack. That's A LOT of DPS, especially if we factor in (accurate) Carnage and the ability to stun-lock enemies with We Toki. Deflection and Will are low but there's a Priest for that plus Edge of Reason regenerates Endurance so ... yeah, I wouldn't say Barbarians are weak. "Time is not your enemy. Forever is." — Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment "It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers." — Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke | Permanent Per-Rest Bonuses | PoE Items for Deadfire | No Recyled Icons | Soul Charged Nautilus
mosspit Posted October 23, 2015 Posted October 23, 2015 Just tried to build a Barbarian—there's a pretty nice synergy between Threatening Presence, Brute Force, and Apprentice's Sneak Attack. Barbaric Blow is pretty neat and of course Dragon Leap is cool. Other than that, I can get him to attack with no recovery time while dual-wielding battle axes with Vulnerable Attack. That's A LOT of DPS, especially if we factor in (accurate) Carnage and the ability to stun-lock enemies with We Toki. Deflection and Will are low but there's a Priest for that plus Edge of Reason regenerates Endurance so ... yeah, I wouldn't say Barbarians are weak. I am not getting the synergy of Threatening Presence with Apprentice's Sneak Attack, at least on their own. Sneak Attack needs Weakened to trigger whilst Threatening Presence only inflicts sickened. And a while back I saw discussions that Threatening Presence and Brute Force is not as attractive as it seems, as enemies with high deflection usually have have high fortitude. That being said, I really like carnage and the way on-hit procs propagate through it. And with Dragon Leap, you can jump into the midst of a group and activate One Stands Alone for both the dmg boost and difficulty to be flanked (Eye of the Storm is meh). Add in a Heart of Fury with proc effects and enemies start biting the dust.
AndreaColombo Posted October 23, 2015 Posted October 23, 2015 ^ Ah, I thought Sickened also triggered Sneak Attack but I see I was mistaken. Oh well. I'm not a fan of Heart of Fury as I don't think it is powerful enough to justify its being just 1/rest. Barbaric Blow is per encounter and gets more bonuses, unless I'm missing something. Threatening Presence + Brute Force should work well on Hard; I see how it could be less effective in PotD. Barbaric Shout and Vengeful Defeat (or Blooded) can be good replacements. Eye of the Storm can actually make it harder to trigger One Stands Alone so I would definitely avoid it unless you were purposefully going for a mobility build. "Time is not your enemy. Forever is." — Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment "It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers." — Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke | Permanent Per-Rest Bonuses | PoE Items for Deadfire | No Recyled Icons | Soul Charged Nautilus
mosspit Posted October 23, 2015 Posted October 23, 2015 (edited) @AndreaColombo: Yeah if you ever used a Barb and a Rogue in the same team, your thought process should arrive at combining TP and SA/DB at some point (and realizing they don't match up). The condition to use HoF effectively is to get surrounded by as many enemies as possible, which Dragon Leap is good at as it bypass body blocking. HoF will hit every enemy around the barb and EACH of these hits will proc it's own Carnage. Meaning to say if the Barb is surrounded by 4 enemies and does HoF, each enemy can get hit by a full attack followed by multiple carnages (up to 3 sets). That is the fundamental mechanism difference between HoF and BA. HoF is a skill for good spike dmg and, due to overlapping carnages, high proc chances. As for worthiness, it is a matter of reserving HoF for key encounters. Otherwise both abilities are essentially once per battle. Edited October 23, 2015 by mosspit
KDubya Posted October 23, 2015 Posted October 23, 2015 Right . I have studied then crap out of this topic and I have come to 3 builds that i think are fare and away more pwerful,then any other build. I will list them in order from most powerful, to least powerful: 1. Fighter, with tidefall enchanted with white forge, and that plate you get in WM enchanted to suberb and white forge enchantmen, belt of blunting and not much else matters. The soulbound weapons have there uses but are not comparable to fully enchanted customised weapons, the -15 armour penalty talent is an absolute good send, this combined with high dex will make your fighter into a dps killing machine Change Fighter with Monk and you have a much better combatant. Give the Monk the same armor and weapons and the Monk will hit harder and faster with Lightning strikes and any damage you take become wounds which fuel your attacks. Even with just auto attacks the Monk will do more than the Fighter, which unfortunately for the Fighter is all they get. Add in the Monks AoE attacks or super duration knockdowns and you outclass the Fighter by a mile. The only thing a Fighter is better at is going full meat sack with the taking damage for the team aura.
brindle88 Posted October 25, 2015 Author Posted October 25, 2015 Right . I have studied then crap out of this topic and I have come to 3 builds that i think are fare and away more pwerful,then any other build. I will list them in order from most powerful, to least powerful: 1. Fighter, with tidefall enchanted with white forge, and that plate you get in WM enchanted to suberb and white forge enchantmen, belt of blunting and not much else matters. The soulbound weapons have there uses but are not comparable to fully enchanted customised weapons, the -15 armour penalty talent is an absolute good send, this combined with high dex will make your fighter into a dps killing machine Change Fighter with Monk and you have a much better combatant. Give the Monk the same armor and weapons and the Monk will hit harder and faster with Lightning strikes and any damage you take become wounds which fuel your attacks. Even with just auto attacks the Monk will do more than the Fighter, which unfortunately for the Fighter is all they get. Add in the Monks AoE attacks or super duration knockdowns and you outclass the Fighter by a mile. The only thing a Fighter is better at is going full meat sack with the taking damage for the team aura. Not a fan of monks, they may be good but just not my style
brindle88 Posted October 25, 2015 Author Posted October 25, 2015 ^ Chanters have the issue of building up chants really slow. Other than that, they're not a class I'm particularly keen on, but that boils down to personal taste. Just tried to build a Barbarian—there's a pretty nice synergy between Threatening Presence, Brute Force, and Apprentice's Sneak Attack. Barbaric Blow is pretty neat and of course Dragon Leap is cool. Other than that, I can get him to attack with no recovery time while dual-wielding battle axes with Vulnerable Attack. That's A LOT of DPS, especially if we factor in (accurate) Carnage and the ability to stun-lock enemies with We Toki. Deflection and Will are low but there's a Priest for that plus Edge of Reason regenerates Endurance so ... yeah, I wouldn't say Barbarians are weak. I have tried REALLY hard to make barbarian builds work. But I encountered the following problems witch led me to conclude they are the worst melee class build. - you cannot min max effectively as they need high stats in just about everything including intelligence - the whole point of the build "frenzy" basically gives you a very minor dps boost for a significant deflection nerf???? Wtf is the point of this. - the talents and abilities to choose from upon level up are very mediocre, hardly make any difference to making your barbarian more effective They really need there talents buffed, a rogue will kill a barbarian (or 2) every time
Boeroer Posted October 26, 2015 Posted October 26, 2015 (edited) Barb: high DEX, high INT, high PER, Brute Force, Threatening Presence, Interrupting Blows, stunning or overbearing weapons (Hours of St. Rumbalt, Tall Grass, Mabec's Morning Star and so on), Gauntlets of ACC +5, Sanguine Plate, Shod-in-Faith boots, Blunting Belt, Spelltongue. PLUS a priest with Painful and Empowered Interdiction (important). Do it like so: Barb into the fray, Interdiction, one attack with Spelltongue, switch to your main disabling weapon set and keep hitting. Enemies will be stunlocked. End of encounter. Why? Weakened and Sickened add up and lower fort by nearly 40 points. In most cases that's enough for your barb to crit a lot with carnage. If the enemy is afflicted with stun/prone plus sickened and weakened, he is so weak that he's not a threat any more. The chance to crit is even higher now in most cases now. If you're attacking fast enough, you will stunlock all mobs with carnage. Even if you don't crit you will interrupt. A weapon with high interrupt is nice (Mabec's or dual wielding Shatterstar (1 sec interrupt) & Godhansthingy(stun)) or dual wielding Cladhaliath(stun) and Vile Loner's Lance (-5 defl.). Edge of Reason & We Toki is also very nice. Tall Grass is maybe best because you get it early, it's a reach weapon and it has the perfect enchantments. Barb is best when he can proc afflictions and the like with carnage. That's also the reason why Tidefall is so great on a barb: draining with carnage makes him very sturdy while applying "wounded" with carnage is also very nice when you have one or two rangers in your party. Grey Sleeper is also fun on a barb because of all the carnage hits the special enchantments will trigger very offen. Edited October 26, 2015 by Boeroer Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods
brindle88 Posted October 27, 2015 Author Posted October 27, 2015 Barb: high DEX, high INT, high PER, Brute Force, Threatening Presence, Interrupting Blows, stunning or overbearing weapons (Hours of St. Rumbalt, Tall Grass, Mabec's Morning Star and so on), Gauntlets of ACC +5, Sanguine Plate, Shod-in-Faith boots, Blunting Belt, Spelltongue. PLUS a priest with Painful and Empowered Interdiction (important). Do it like so: Barb into the fray, Interdiction, one attack with Spelltongue, switch to your main disabling weapon set and keep hitting. Enemies will be stunlocked. End of encounter. Why? Weakened and Sickened add up and lower fort by nearly 40 points. In most cases that's enough for your barb to crit a lot with carnage. If the enemy is afflicted with stun/prone plus sickened and weakened, he is so weak that he's not a threat any more. The chance to crit is even higher now in most cases now. If you're attacking fast enough, you will stunlock all mobs with carnage. Even if you don't crit you will interrupt. A weapon with high interrupt is nice (Mabec's or dual wielding Shatterstar (1 sec interrupt) & Godhansthingy(stun)) or dual wielding Cladhaliath(stun) and Vile Loner's Lance (-5 defl.). Edge of Reason & We Toki is also very nice. Tall Grass is maybe best because you get it early, it's a reach weapon and it has the perfect enchantments. Barb is best when he can proc afflictions and the like with carnage. That's also the reason why Tidefall is so great on a barb: draining with carnage makes him very sturdy while applying "wounded" with carnage is also very nice when you have one or two rangers in your party. Grey Sleeper is also fun on a barb because of all the carnage hits the special enchantments will trigger very offen. Sounds interesting, I might give it a try, but I don't think will be as effective as rogue and fighter builds for the following reasons. - you have said it is very important for a priest to cast 2 buff spells before for this to take its full effect. So A: you need a priest B: that is two actions a priest is doing (or another caster) that could do damage or de buffs to the bad guys. So in effect I think you have equaled out the benefits from this as rogues and fighters are more self sufficient. - you have only noted 2 barbarian talents that you think are of any use, with the third you mentioned interrupting blows available for selection by any class. It is absurd that obsidian have created an entire class with no useful abilities. - one point I am interested in is carnage and how effective it is at stunning/ proning/ spell striking groups of enemies in one hit. I have read a previous thread where a barbarian with a animancer boots, plus the 20% shock ability and high might and perception was seriously wiping out entire groups of enemies by spreading the jolting touch to just about all enemies on the screen.
Boeroer Posted October 27, 2015 Posted October 27, 2015 (edited) Nay - Interdiction is not a spell. It's the fast per encounter ability of priests that dazes enemies in a huge area. You can pimp that with two talents: Painful Interdiction adds the Weakened affliction, Empowered Interdiction adds +10 accuracy to this ability. So only one action while the barb runs towards the enemy. The main reason I love this ability is because you don't only turn your barb into a crit beast but also your ciphers will profit so much from this synergy: all will and fortitude defended powers will crit so easily. More so if your barb stunlocks entire groups. Many people think of one single char when they talk about a "most powerful build" while that's not even half as powerful as using and mixing the abilities of several party members to perfection. Of course you need more abilities and talents on your barb - but these are pretty straight forward and I don't feel the need to mention them. Brute Force & Threatening Presence are the key parts here. I think I completed the game more than 10 times on PotD and used all classes and several builds - and I can tell you that CC always beats DPS (of course you need at least one guy that does some good damage). If it wheren't so, six rogues would make the most easiest party - which they are not. It's doable, but it's no fun and not very easy. They just lack CC capability - even if you give each one a weapon with prone/stun on crit it's not enough and it's not very reliable either. A good party composition on the other hand turns PotD to Easy Mode after some time. The barb I mentioned above (with some help from a priest) is a very powerful CC PLUS DPS build in itself while contributing to the whole party performace. He may not be top of the notch concerning single target DPS and he's not the most reliable CC char - but he does both at the same time which is great. This barb and a well balanced monk are the most fun and powerful melee chars I ever had (if you judge from start to end and not just judge the build when it reaches lvl 11+). No fighter nor rogue nor paladin came close to that. They have other qualities though. If it comes to pure power, nothing beats casters anyway. 6 wizards are the ticket to an easypeasy walktrough - with a ton of micromanagement. Edited October 27, 2015 by Boeroer Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods
brindle88 Posted October 27, 2015 Author Posted October 27, 2015 Nay - Interdiction is not a spell. It's the fast per encounter ability of priests that dazes enemies in a huge area. You can pimp that with two talents: Painful Interdiction adds the Weakened affliction, Empowered Interdiction adds +10 accuracy to this ability. So only one action while the barb runs towards the enemy. The main reason I love this ability is because you don't only turn your barb into a crit beast but also your ciphers will profit so much from this synergy: all will and fortitude defended powers will crit so easily. More so if your barb stunlocks entire groups. Many people think of one single char when they talk about a "most powerful build" while that's not even half as powerful as using and mixing the abilities of several party members to perfection. Of course you need more abilities and talents on your barb - but these are pretty straight forward and I don't feel the need to mention them. Brute Force & Threatening Presence are the key parts here. I think I completed the game more than 10 times on PotD and used all classes and several builds - and I can tell you that CC always beats DPS (of course you need at least one guy that does some good damage). If it wheren't so, six rogues would make the most easiest party - which they are not. It's doable, but it's no fun and not very easy. They just lack CC capability - even if you give each one a weapon with prone/stun on crit it's not enough and it's not very reliable either. A good party composition on the other hand turns PotD to Easy Mode after some time. The barb I mentioned above (with some help from a priest) is a very powerful CC PLUS DPS build in itself while contributing to the whole party performace. He may not be top of the notch concerning single target DPS and he's not the most reliable CC char - but he does both at the same time which is great. This barb and a well balanced monk are the most fun and powerful melee chars I ever had (if you judge from start to end and not just judge the build when it reaches lvl 11+). No fighter nor rogue nor paladin came close to that. They have other qualities though. If it comes to pure power, nothing beats casters anyway. 6 wizards are the ticket to an easypeasy walktrough - with a ton of micromanagement. Interesting, I will be trying a barb on my next play through. Can you confirm that they can stun or jolting touch multiple targets with there carnage ability? Can you or anyone else please also give me other tips form building a good barb. I agree with your statement on wizards, they have overall the most powerful spells when you combine there entire repertoire. Though when you look at individual spells I think the most powerful are the ciphers amplified wave, the ciphers spell that chain confuses groups (I can't remember its name), the ciphers spell that chain reduces attack speed, and the Druids spell relentless storm. Relentless storm will basically stun lock the entire screen. Amplified wave is basically an I win button.
Boeroer Posted October 27, 2015 Posted October 27, 2015 Yes, as I said: weakened plus sickened = ~-40 Will and Fortitude. Combine that with Amplified Wave (targets fort) and you have the perfect spell. I once used said barb and priest together with 4 ciphers and after I got Amplified Wave that I could spam 4 times all encounters where a joke. Really all. Carnage works with everything except: - retaliation (be it battle forged or item induced) - spells (including jolting touch - I think they nerfed this because it was too powerful) Everything else that comes from weapons like overbearing/stunning/disorienting/interfering/draining/wounding/spelltongue effects and so on work with carnage. A good dual wielding barb that wants to debuff and stun at the same time would be one that uses Cladhaliath with stun in crit plus the Vile Loner's Lance that causes -5 defense on hit/crit. The one spear lowers defenses with every hit while the other stuns on crit which is Mord likely to happen when they have -5 defensese. AND Spears habe +5 ACC anyways - making this a great setup. 1 Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods
brindle88 Posted October 27, 2015 Author Posted October 27, 2015 Yes, as I said: weakened plus sickened = ~-40 Will and Fortitude. Combine that with Amplified Wave (targets fort) and you have the perfect spell. I once used said barb and priest together with 4 ciphers and after I got Amplified Wave that I could spam 4 times all encounters where a joke. Really all. Carnage works with everything except: - retaliation (be it battle forged or item induced) - spells (including jolting touch - I think they nerfed this because it was too powerful) Everything else that comes from weapons like overbearing/stunning/disorienting/interfering/draining/wounding/spelltongue effects and so on work with carnage. A good dual wielding barb that wants to debuff and stun at the same time would be one that uses Cladhaliath with stun in crit plus the Vile Loner's Lance that causes -5 defense on hit/crit. The one spear lowers defenses with every hit while the other stuns on crit which is Mord likely to happen when they have -5 defensese. AND Spears habe +5 ACC anyways - making this a great setup. I here you and it sounds like a fun build and I will more then likely try it out. I am certain this build is not more powerful then a rogue. To compare these two builds you have to take them on there own merits eg buffs from priests, casters ect should not be included. A rogue can obvisiouly be buffed by a priest to give it an advantage as well. I also tried and tested the priests interdictions and they did realistically include an entire casting/ attack round, so for you to say the priest buffing the barb (quickly) is not correct, the opportunity cost of this is the priest casting a far more powerful spell at perhaps a slightly longer frame rate. Taking the above into consideration, let's look at the two builds : Barbarian - it's is agreed that the barbarians most powerful ability is to apply afflictions to mobs via its carnage, and this ability has been nerfed to not include spell striking abilities from weapons. You need to remember that these afflictions only apply on crits which is probably on average 15% of hits (at the most) with a barb - I think the above is the only thing the barbarian is good at - apart from the carnage all other melee classes can do everything else a barb can do but better. - if you look at the barbarian talent tree for selection upon level up there are no talents to choose from that are comparable to powerful rogue talents and powerful fighter talents. - even if the barb was succesful at carnage critting/ stunning a mob there are about 20 spells that spellcasters can cast that can do the same but better, at a distance out of melee range and therefore better protected. Rogue (Where do I start) - sneak attacks - talents to chose from that GREATLY increase crits, therefore applying procs more often then the barb with certain weapons - DEATHBLOWS , holy **** this ability is powerful - invisibility to immediately break engagement that by the way no spell caster can replicate. A rogue will win every time, the barbarian will locked down with dps that will kill it in less the 6 seconds.
brindle88 Posted October 27, 2015 Author Posted October 27, 2015 ^ Chanters have the issue of building up chants really slow. Other than that, they're not a class I'm particularly keen on, but that boils down to personal taste. Just tried to build a Barbarian—there's a pretty nice synergy between Threatening Presence, Brute Force, and Apprentice's Sneak Attack. Barbaric Blow is pretty neat and of course Dragon Leap is cool. Other than that, I can get him to attack with no recovery time while dual-wielding battle axes with Vulnerable Attack. That's A LOT of DPS, especially if we factor in (accurate) Carnage and the ability to stun-lock enemies with We Toki. Deflection and Will are low but there's a Priest for that plus Edge of Reason regenerates Endurance so ... yeah, I wouldn't say Barbarians are weak. How do you get your barbarian to attack with no recovery time? Not possible
AndreaColombo Posted October 27, 2015 Posted October 27, 2015 Dual-wield durgan-enhanced weapons, wear durgan-reinforced hide armor, start with 18 dex + 3 from item + 3 from resting bonus in Caed Nua + 2 from Rauatai Sweet Pie, and sip a potion of Deleterious Alacrity of Motion. Voilà - no recovery. (of course also take the Two Weapon Fighting talent.) "Time is not your enemy. Forever is." — Fall-From-Grace, Planescape: Torment "It's the questions we can't answer that teach us the most. They teach us how to think. If you give a man an answer, all he gains is a little fact. But give him a question, and he'll look for his own answers." — Kvothe, The Wise Man's Fears My Deadfire mods: Brilliant Mod | Faster Deadfire | Deadfire Unnerfed | Helwalker Rekke | Permanent Per-Rest Bonuses | PoE Items for Deadfire | No Recyled Icons | Soul Charged Nautilus
brindle88 Posted October 27, 2015 Author Posted October 27, 2015 Dual-wield durgan-enhanced weapons, wear durgan-reinforced hide armor, start with 18 dex + 3 from item + 3 from resting bonus in Caed Nua + 2 from Rauatai Sweet Pie, and sip a potion of Deleterious Alacrity of Motion. Voilà - no recovery. (of course also take the Two Weapon Fighting talent.) This can be done by rogues and fighters as well obviously so it's not exclusive to barbarians and there is is still a recovery time you have just reduced it.
brindle88 Posted October 27, 2015 Author Posted October 27, 2015 Dual-wield durgan-enhanced weapons, wear durgan-reinforced hide armor, start with 18 dex + 3 from item + 3 from resting bonus in Caed Nua + 2 from Rauatai Sweet Pie, and sip a potion of Deleterious Alacrity of Motion. Voilà - no recovery. (of course also take the Two Weapon Fighting talent.) This can be done by rogues and fighters as well obviously so it's not exclusive to barbarians and there is is still a recovery time you have just reduced it. And if you added the fighters ability armoured grace to this which is getting buffed to 20% in the next patch, you would elevate this to a whole new level.
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