Grimoire of Pestilential Thoughts

[Cultist]

As those who played Planescape remember here, PS:T had this awesome sentient book.

 

Could we have similar sentient artifact?

a quick reminder - Grimoire of Pestilential Thoughts is a sentient book, that can do favors in exchange of evil deeds. The more "evil" your deed, the more powerful the reward. At first, it can give you advices, then, it can give you a scroll of Blindness in exchange for drop of blood But then, you may have a much more powerful rewards for selling your companions to slavery or killing them.

 

Similar artifact(or person) could serve its role in PR as well, but with extended...functionality. For example, we sometimes have option to insult beggars, telling them to "Away with you, scum!" or else. So, such artifact may offer us rewards for such deeds that before was just for athmosphere. Example:

Deed: Insult/mock/laugh at a beggar

Reward: Weak spell

Deed: Desecrate an altar

Reward: more powerful spell

Deed: Betray\sell your companion

Reward: Increase attribute by 1

 

Some may be weak but quite easy to complete, but powerful rewards may be obtained only once for balance sake.

Here's an example of Grimoire's advices:

 

 

 

Nameless One: "I want some advice from you."

Book: "You wish my knowledge... master?"

Nameless One: "Yes."

Book: "I bestow this advice. Be wary of those you keep close to you. Never take them fully into your confidence, and never dilute your strength by sharing it. Many emperors I have know have done such, and I do not wish you to suffer the same fate."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book: "Then I bestow this advice. If they claim friendship, let them prove themselves. Words carry little weight compared to action. If friends they be, then they should be willing to die for you."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book: You feel a slight tightening in your chest as the book speaks. "Then I bestow this advice. Show no weakness, do not admit error, do not show hesitation. These things tell others that you are uncertain, a stone that is unbalanced and may be toppled."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book: "Then I bestow this advice. Beware mercy. A turned back is no defense against an assassin's knife."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book: "Then I bestow this advice. Beware the common view of love. Love must often be cruel in order so that it may rise above the merely sentimental."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book: You feel a faint sneer curl up in the corner of your mouth. You quickly repress it. "Then I bestow this advice. Separate yourself from small-minded fools and the weak by recognizing that you have a destiny. This alone gives you the authority to tread where others would fear to go."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book:"Then I bestow this advice. There are two secrets to becoming great. One is never to reveal all that you know."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book:"Then I bestow this advice. To become powerful, you must be willing to sacrifice: whether it is parts of yourself or things precious to you. Power is a bargain: One must give in order to receive."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book:Your blood seems to move more sluggishly within your veins as the book speaks. "Then I bestow this advice. Honor and virtue are concepts that kill men and kill the spirit. They are only abstracts that drive men to strangeness and death. Be true to yourself and obey only your own will."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book:"Then I bestow this advice. Do not suffer one who has hurt you to live. To do so is an open admission of weakness."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book:"Then I bestow this advice. The soul of a man is a sea of emotions. Often man struggles to bring order to these emotions, but it is a false order. Man's natural state is chaos, and it is a state that should be surrendered to."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book:"Then I bestow this advice. Know the meaning of mercy, use it to your advantage... but do not practice it."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book:"Then I bestow this advice. Nurture fear in others, for only fear rules men. Nothing else leaves deeper scars."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book:"Then I bestow this advice. Extend a smile and the hand of friendship to your enemies. When they clasp your hand, strike them with the dagger in your other hand, else they will surely do the same to you."

Nameless One: "Give me some more advice."

Book: As the book speaks these words, you feel a chill weight settle on your heart. You feel somehow tainted. "These are my last words of advice. Weigh them carefully. Remember that you can expunge anything you find undesirable. You need only have the will."

 

 

 

[mstark]

When it comes to sentient items, I much preferred Lilarcor

 

I'd like seeing the return of sentient items.

[Maexi]

I like this idea! These sentient items could be quite interesting characters (or even companions) and I really can imagine the soul of a person getting bound to an item by a god or something (e.g. as a punishment) ... and since PE is all about the souls :D

[JFSOCC]

this smacks of good/evil dichotomy, of which I'm not a fan. But on the concept of sentient items with agendas, awesome, why not?

[Aldereth]

this smacks of good/evil dichotomy, of which I'm not a fan. But on the concept of sentient items with agendas, awesome, why not?

Exact sentiment. What would be even more amazing are a subtle sentient item that keep the player wondering if it is sentient or not for a good part of the game.

[Nonek]

Allthough I liked the grimoire, it was a rather deliberate attempt to lure the player towards the evil side of the alignment axis. I'd prefer something a little more subtle, taking the grimoire and Torment as a template, i'd say make every step a little more logical and well reasoned.

 

Each companion had a secret hidden from Nameless, a few had many, let the grimoire hint of these and reveal them once it's got what it wanted (a drop of Nameless' immortal blood, a certain deed accomplishing etcetera.) Let it still deliver free powers at the higher levels of use, so that it appears to be helping the player, all the while alienating the protagonist from his companions and vice versa. Their morale steadily drops as the tome keeps whispering, and they either leave or attack the player at the lowest levels of loyalty, thus when the book suggests selling one of them off it seems to be a wise precaution rather than just a nasty and petty move. A pro active strike, after all the skull lied, the gith slave hates you, the tiefling conspired with her father, the fire wizard wants revenge, the succubus is evil, the cube knows too much and the Mercykiller is just too dangerous.

 

Also make the grimoire useful in and of itself, it's curse is clever because it reveals no great penalty when equipped, instead aiding you in a very real way. Ideally i'd say let it have a motive and a game plan beyond corrupting the player, give it goals that it needs help achieving for which it will reward generously. For instance it could want a body ultimately, and ask that the player once he has slain someone like the construct wizard, place it upon the corpses chest so that it might drain their knowledge. Amply rewarded the player exits the Modron cube, and finds the grimoire rotting in his hands, the cube is unresponsive and the reborn Wizard has total control of that construct never to be seen again.

 

Or perhaps come the end of Torment, the loyal grimoire finally switches sides, betraying the Nameless One to his doom. Either siding with mad Ignus, if he's present at the Fortress, or the Transcendant One himself if he is not. The player has given too much power and influence to the grimoire, it masters him easily and he is doomed to imprisonment in his own body, a flesh toy for Ignus burning, or a mindless tramp wandering Sigil watched over by the Transecndant Ones shadows. A real downbeat ending worthy of a man who sold himself into slavery. Though i'd also include an ending for the most cunning of incarnations to betray the grimoire, a deal returning it to the greedy hands of Lothar who will tear its spine apart, and rip the words from its pages with fell necromantic powers. Or even just thrown from the high battlements of the Fortress, to be consumed by the nothingness of the negative material plane.

[JFSOCC]

fantastic Nonek, but you need to add spoiler tags for those of us (like myself) who haven't played planescape torment.

Edited May 10, 2013 by JFSOCC

[Cultist]

this smacks of good/evil dichotomy, of which I'm not a fan. But on the concept of sentient items with agendas, awesome, why not?

Well, n+1 shades of gray is no better than evil-neutral-good from AD&D. So why not have arfefact with purpose to corrupt its owners?

 

Allthough I liked the grimoire, it was a rather deliberate attempt to lure the player towards the evil side of the alignment axis. I'd prefer something a little more subtle, taking the grimoire and Torment as a template, i'd say make every step a little more logical and well reasoned.

Grimoire saw just a brief role in PS:T and I doubt developers planned bigger or more important role for it. In PE I hope such quest or interaction would be possible. I could be sentient artifact with hidden motives or person, or some demon we could made pacts with, or some feature unique for Project Eternity setting.

 

I am personally interested in aspect of corruption, tradeoffs, tough decisions and moral dilemmas.

There's a lot of ways to make it..wrong...for example, sacrificing\selling someone. Player can always sell annoying companions or ones thy don't like. But if additional condition would be added, it could be made an interesting decision - like, sacrifice companion PC have high influence with(had a lot of positive interactions), or companion PC have active romance with.

[Nonek]

Sorry had to step away, and now the posts un-editable i'm afraid JFSOCC, I do apologise.

[Ohnoyoudient]

This is always a great way to add some depth and personality to a story. Though it HAS been done ad nauseum in nearly every forum, past and present.

  It is still worth saying that the discussion of sentient items with a possible agenda, always reminds me of this little poem.

 

  "Three Rings for the Elven-kings under the sky,
Seven for the Dwarf-lords in their halls of stone,
Nine for Mortal Men doomed to die,
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.
One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them,
One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie."

                                                                  J.R.R. Tolkien : LOTR

 

 A seemingly sentient item with a questionable and visibly suspect agenda. Classic.

[Hulk'O'Saurus]

Just evil without any reason is kind of bland.

 

A sentient/living item, with drives of it's own, trying to use the main character because otherwise it cannot fulfil it's agenda(because it/he/she cannot move) is a decent start. You can get involved and uncover more or you kinda do something and then the artefact goes away with just some reward left behind.