Martial Arts Skill

[Musopticon?]

GF: "Awww"

[mkreku]

And what's the purpose of those pictures

None! I just think they're really cool

[Noxt]

Ah, you think two half-naked men hugging each-other is cool.

[Joseph Bulock]

Fedor's style is cool, but is also still a sport style. As far as I know, Fedor has never claimed to be trained in anything more than Sambo, and while it is one of the more open sport systems, it doesn't allow for the types of attacks you'd want to use in self defense/ lethal combat situations. Flying arm bars are cool, but kinda useless if there are three guys trying to punch, stab, or shoot you.

[mkreku]

Ah, you think two half-naked men hugging each-other is cool.

Yes, I do. Two reasons: hugging each other after a fight is considered good sportsmanship in MMA. Second, I live in the 21:st century so I don't have to hide behind pathetic homophobic insinuations.

[Llyranor]

Much like many melee games with action elements, there is a soft-targeting cone (no hard lock) in front of Mike. When you perform your attacks, there is a slight amount of distance and heading adjustment done by Mike and the target to make sure the attacks and hit reactions line up properly. The soft-targeting is pretty generous, but you do have to be close to the target to pull off the attack.

How do you determine which attacks are being used? Is melee tied to a single button, or multiple (or combinations of)? Or is the move dependant on the actual scenario (range, position, etc)?

[Noxt]

Ah, you think two half-naked men hugging each-other is cool.

Yes, I do. Two reasons: hugging each other after a fight is considered good sportsmanship in MMA. Second, I live in the 21:st century so I don't have to hide behind pathetic homophobic insinuations.

Cool.

[J.E. Sawyer]

Much like many melee games with action elements, there is a soft-targeting cone (no hard lock) in front of Mike. When you perform your attacks, there is a slight amount of distance and heading adjustment done by Mike and the target to make sure the attacks and hit reactions line up properly. The soft-targeting is pretty generous, but you do have to be close to the target to pull off the attack.

How do you determine which attacks are being used? Is melee tied to a single button, or multiple (or combinations of)? Or is the move dependant on the actual scenario (range, position, etc)?

There is only one attack button for unarmed attacks. Attacks change based on Mike's state (standing or walking vs. running), the enemy's state (hostile vs. unaware or stunned) and length of button input (tap vs. hold). Standing/walking Mike vs. a hostile enemy will perform a hard strike with a held button, and will perform chained hits with taps. The chained hits are randomized linked combos. So there may be a total of five hits in combo A and five hits in combo B. When you start the chain, it randomly picks between combo A and B, though you are still giving individual inputs for each attack -- so you can stop whenever you want. But once combo A starts, it will only use combo A attacks unless you let the chain expire and start a new sequence.

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

So, a related question, is there a way to get the chain to go off reliably *without* button mashing? Some of us like to save our fingers Or is the held attack just an equally-viable alternative to mashing?

 

Edit: oh yeah, and is the Kerambit used in normal attacks, or just takedowns?

Edited December 11, 2008 by Cl_Flushentityhero

[Joseph Bulock]

Ah, you think two half-naked men hugging each-other is cool.

Yes, I do. Two reasons: hugging each other after a fight is considered good sportsmanship in MMA. Second, I live in the 21:st century so I don't have to hide behind pathetic homophobic insinuations.

 

:)

[Llyranor]

Much like many melee games with action elements, there is a soft-targeting cone (no hard lock) in front of Mike. When you perform your attacks, there is a slight amount of distance and heading adjustment done by Mike and the target to make sure the attacks and hit reactions line up properly. The soft-targeting is pretty generous, but you do have to be close to the target to pull off the attack.

How do you determine which attacks are being used? Is melee tied to a single button, or multiple (or combinations of)? Or is the move dependant on the actual scenario (range, position, etc)?

There is only one attack button for unarmed attacks. Attacks change based on Mike's state (standing or walking vs. running), the enemy's state (hostile vs. unaware or stunned) and length of button input (tap vs. hold). Standing/walking Mike vs. a hostile enemy will perform a hard strike with a held button, and will perform chained hits with taps. The chained hits are randomized linked combos. So there may be a total of five hits in combo A and five hits in combo B. When you start the chain, it randomly picks between combo A and B, though you are still giving individual inputs for each attack -- so you can stop whenever you want. But once combo A starts, it will only use combo A attacks unless you let the chain expire and start a new sequence.

Ah, okay. Simple enough, but still providing a decent variety (at least, compared to other titles where melee basically means one attack). Tap vs hold is a nice touch.

[Pidesco]

I'd prefer it if there was, at least, one other button for melee. To add a bit of variety to the combos. One button could be leg attacks while the other arm attacks, for example.

[mkreku]

I really liked the combat system in Gothic (and Gothic 2), where you had an action button on the mouse. When you pressed a direction and the action button, your character behaved in different ways. If you pressed forward + action button, you'd thrust forward. If you pressed left/right + action button, you'd do a slash and a sidestep. If you pressed backwards + action button, you'd stand still and block for a split second (active blocking, you could not hold up your block indefinitely). There were no combos, other than the ones you strung together yourself (thrust forward, strafe around the target while he's stunned, slash him while strafing etc.).

 

It gave combat a sense of player skill which some like and some don't. Since this will be an action RPG, I'd prefer it if you let player skill take part in the equation. Otherwise I don't really see the meaning of having the action part at all.

[Musopticon?]

Truth to be told, most of Gothics combat consisted of sidestepping into a good position to unleash the front-front-front-combo, which gained in attacks with each new rank in a melee skill. IIRC, there was only the forward-combo, but you could mix and match pretty freely. Though that always meant your character would meticulously flail away the strikes while standing with their feet stuck to the ground. Freeform combos usually got you killed.

[Pop]

Much like many melee games with action elements, there is a soft-targeting cone (no hard lock) in front of Mike. When you perform your attacks, there is a slight amount of distance and heading adjustment done by Mike and the target to make sure the attacks and hit reactions line up properly. The soft-targeting is pretty generous, but you do have to be close to the target to pull off the attack.

How do you determine which attacks are being used? Is melee tied to a single button, or multiple (or combinations of)? Or is the move dependant on the actual scenario (range, position, etc)?

There is only one attack button for unarmed attacks. Attacks change based on Mike's state (standing or walking vs. running), the enemy's state (hostile vs. unaware or stunned) and length of button input (tap vs. hold). Standing/walking Mike vs. a hostile enemy will perform a hard strike with a held button, and will perform chained hits with taps. The chained hits are randomized linked combos. So there may be a total of five hits in combo A and five hits in combo B. When you start the chain, it randomly picks between combo A and B, though you are still giving individual inputs for each attack -- so you can stop whenever you want. But once combo A starts, it will only use combo A attacks unless you let the chain expire and start a new sequence.

Do the attacks / attack animations change with skill? If I have level 10 unarmed do I just do more damage or will I pull off more complex / impressive moves and combos?

[J.E. Sawyer]

Your combos become longer with increased skill, and the moves at the end of the combo are more spectacular/damaging/crazy/sexy/cool.

 

Also a few moves (like the flying knee) are unlocked with skill progression.

[Pop]

Cool. Can we choose to punctuate our combo at any time? For example, let's say I'm melee fighting some enemies towards the end of the game, so they're going to be tough ones. If I go in for a 10-hit combo on one of them or whatever the limit is I'd be opening myself up to ranged fire from the others (this is a problem in other games) so assuming the final attacks are stunning in some capacity could I put in a few hits here on one guy and then dart over and put in a few hits on another, without actually breaking a combo chain?

[Noxt]

Hmm.. so your combos become longer. But what happens when you're facing someone that you'll take down with 3 strikes and you can do a 15 hit combo? Is the last strike a cool finishing move or just a normal punch?

 

So what I'm asking is.. do you always need to finish the combo to do the cool move?

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

Regarding longer combos, it seems like having them *extended* with skill progression would actually be less practical, even in a game. I mean, other than aesthetics, what's the in-game benefit of dropping somebody in 8 hits if you can drop them in 4?

[Noxt]

Yeah.. that's what I was thinking. Would kinda suck if we can't see the really cool/nice/sexy/whatever moves unless we finish the combo.

[J.E. Sawyer]

Regarding longer combos, it seems like having them *extended* with skill progression would actually be less practical, even in a game. I mean, other than aesthetics, what's the in-game benefit of dropping somebody in 8 hits if you can drop them in 4?

If you can, there is no benefit. Attacks increase in damage as your skill increases and you get more moves in the chain. To answer Pop's question, stick input can override the default targeting (based on heading) between moves. So you could hit one guy with two attacks and then smack another guy with your third (fourth, fifth). And you can always stop a combo simply by letting off the attack button. For combos, one button in the input window = one attack.

 

Also, depending on the relative skill of your target, he or she may block some of your attacks, so a longer chain increases your chance of actually landing hits. When you are able to do five-hit combos, the final hit will always break a block/cause a stumble, so it's pretty worthwhile if dudes are blocking you left and right.

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

Hmm, are the hold attacks at all linked to stunning people for takedowns? Or are they just a way to mix up the standard combos and do more damage?

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Woah, that sounds pretty complex. And cool. Suddenly I don't even want to bother using guns.

[Cl_Flushentityhero]

Woah, that sounds pretty complex. And cool. Suddenly I don't even want to bother using guns.

 

You and Plaxico.

 

[mkreku]

Also a few moves (like the flying knee) are unlocked with skill progression.

Flying knee you say? This is what Fedor thinks about your flying knee!

 

 

The result? This:

 

 

Arlovski is actually unconscious in mid-air!

 

Thorton is going dooown!