New Space Siege Interview

[@\NightandtheShape/@]

I really need to get a console.

 

*Speechless*

 

The days of being a pc only gamer are through.

 

*Still speechless*

 

Other than the occasional STALKER or X universe game, pc gaming is just cast-offs, rejects, buggy ports, and junk.

 

*Frown of confusion* ...

 

I need some money.

 

I best just keep my mouth shut in regards to that one... Anyone for cookies?

[newc0253]

Inventory systems need an overhaul and a rethink.

you guys saw this article, right?

 

i think it's on the money: on the one hand, being able to carry unlimited amounts of loot is silly. on the other, it's kinda dumb to make carrying your gear such a major part of gameplay.

 

as the article points out, most story-driven CRPGs approach it more sensibly, by having weight limits tied to character strength. but it still comes across as kinda arbitrary sometimes, e.g. you get DEX penalties for wearing a certain kind of armour, but no penalties for hauling fifty scrolls, fifty scrolls, two staffs, two swords, three shields and twenty library books into combat...

Edited July 10, 2008 by newc0253

[Slowtrain]

I best just keep my mouth shut in regards to that one... Anyone for cookies?

 

 

bah. I need to win the lottery.

[qt3.14159]

Inventory systems need an overhaul and a rethink.

you guys saw this article, right?

 

i think it's on the money: on the one hand, being able to carry unlimited amounts of loot is silly. on the other, it's kinda dumb to make carrying your gear such a major part of gameplay.

 

as the article points out, most story-driven CRPGs approach it more sensibly, by having weight limits tied to character strength. but it still comes across as kinda arbitrary sometimes, e.g. you get DEX penalties for wearing a certain kind of armour, but no penalties for hauling fifty scrolls, fifty scrolls, two staffs, two swords, three shields and twenty library books into combat...

 

But obviously you wouldn't carry all that into combat, you'd have your bag(s) off you and on the ground in a heartbeat if any fighting broke out.

[newc0253]

But obviously you wouldn't carry all that into combat, you'd have your bag(s) off you and on the ground in a heartbeat if any fighting broke out.

sure, but that just goes to show how schematised the whole inventory thing is.

 

after all, most CRPGs allow you to access any inventory item during combat, but how realistic is that, given that all those scrolls and potions are laying in a heap in the corner? i think only BG made this vaguely realistic, by not pausing combat during inventory checks.

 

i'm not making a plea for inventories to be more realistic, mind. i'm just pointing out there seems to be an unhappy balance between games that give you unrealistically silly amounts of space and games that make you spend your whole time playing inventory-tetris...

[mkreku]

after all, most CRPGs allow you to access any inventory item during combat, but how realistic is that, given that all those scrolls and potions are laying in a heap in the corner? i think only BG made this vaguely realistic, by not pausing combat during inventory checks.

No, the Gothic games are the same. They even have an animation for you when you drink potions. In the middle of the combat, your character calmly puts away his weapon, reaches for his backpack, picks out a potion, unplugs it, drinks it, puts back the empty bottle and then redraws his weapon. Meanwhile the orc you've been fighting has chopped off your head.

 

Also, in the Gothic games there's no limit on the size of the inventory: if it's loose, pick it up! I think that's the best way of handling the inventory-Tetris-problem. Sure, it's absurd being able to carry so much, but that's a prize I am willing to pay to not have to constantly rearrange my inventory to fit that vital piece of eq. you desperately want and just found. That, combined with the auto-sorting (weapons, armor, potions & scrolls, and other) makes it very easy to handle.

 

When designing a game and a game interface, you always have to balance absurdity, user friendliness and fun. In Space Siege it sounds like they've gone too far with the user friendliness.

[Musopticon?]

after all, most CRPGs allow you to access any inventory item during combat, but how realistic is that, given that all those scrolls and potions are laying in a heap in the corner? i think only BG made this vaguely realistic, by not pausing combat during inventory checks.

No, the Gothic games are the same. They even have an animation for you when you drink potions. In the middle of the combat, your character calmly puts away his weapon, reaches for his backpack, picks out a potion, unplugs it, drinks it, puts back the empty bottle and then redraws his weapon. Meanwhile the orc you've been fighting has chopped off your head.

That is, unless you are uncool enough to edit an ini file to include an autodrink button.

[@\NightandtheShape/@]

I'm bizzare, I liked Arx Fatalis's inventory system.

[Humodour]

Inventory systems need an overhaul and a rethink.

you guys saw this article, right?

 

i think it's on the money: on the one hand, being able to carry unlimited amounts of loot is silly. on the other, it's kinda dumb to make carrying your gear such a major part of gameplay.

 

as the article points out, most story-driven CRPGs approach it more sensibly, by having weight limits tied to character strength. but it still comes across as kinda arbitrary sometimes, e.g. you get DEX penalties for wearing a certain kind of armour, but no penalties for hauling fifty scrolls, fifty scrolls, two staffs, two swords, three shields and twenty library books into combat...

 

Haha. I wouldn't try to rationalise it. For me it's just part of the complexity dynamic; complex enough to be interesting, but not so complex it's hard or annoying to use.

 

Diablo 2's inventory system verges on annoying to use, as does the IE engine's. I found Deus Ex did it well, even though it would seem there's little difference. It certainly worked well to balance the weapon system and such.

 

I wouldn't really shed any tears if such a system were reworked as Night suggests. However, if we're simply to end up with Bloodlines's or Fallout's system, that's hardly better.

[Gorth]

I liked S.T.A.L.K.E.R. inventory. Simple, elegant, easy to use.

 

You can't carry much and need to leave most loot behind

[Tigranes]

I know we are on inventory by now, but I just wanted to say: the reason I despised Dungeon Siege 1 (never tried 2, apparently its better) wasn't because it was simple, streamlined, etc. I mean, I played Diablo 2 religiously (and revived it just now). The problem was that, if Diablo 2 wasn't deep, it was fun. What it did it did incredibly well. Dungeon Siege doesn't do anything well. There is no "well its got a crap story but at least X". It just "well it's got a crap story, and crap gameplay, and crap.. uh."

 

Anyway. I think inventory systems shouldn't be considered independently: it's all part of your economy. For example, Morrowind and Oblivion had a thousand different little bits and bobs of alchemy and crafting you pretty much had to keep, so it made sense to have an unlimited number of slots (and the option to buy houses or whatever). In Diablo 2 it wouldn't have made as much sense because Charms, for example, are a gameplay dynamic that is dependent on the idea of having to make hard choices: you need to plan out and economise your inventory screen just like you do your character. And because Diablo 2 is about calculating all those crazy combinations between items and the permutaitons of each item, having loads of space for inventory (and thus carrying a large amount of crap around) would just make things very messy. On the other hand, for example, IE games, with their use of D&D rules, encouraged you to carry around more than one or two weapons per character - you wanted to carry around the Mace of Disruption for undead, Wave Halberd for elementals, the Hammer +1, +4 vs. Giantkin, etc. In that case their inventory system made sense: allow a lot of room (though not TOO much), and get rid of inventory tetris.

[Humodour]

But it had pretty graphics.

 

And I agree, Tigranes, that a universal inventory system is a bad idea (I believe that's what you were implying); it should be designed to suit the game.