GTA IV gets a perfect 10 at IGN

[Arkan]

Yeah, but why even bother telling someone that it's there if they can't get to it?

Seriously?

[thepixiesrock]

I think I've come up with a new reviewing system we can all agree on. So instead of using numbers, or letter grades, or anything like that, we'll use months. Each consecutive month won't increase in value, so like, January won't be a one and December won't be a twelve. Instead, each month's place on the scale will be determined by how much the reviewer likes that month, and how that particular month makes them feel.

[Humodour]

The trouble with your logic, Hurlshot, is that it only really applies to grade systems with a small number of possibilities.

 

In reality, the systems used tend to be out of 20, 50 or 100, not 10. This allows for more detailed differentiation of somebody's work without causing them to be disheartened.

 

This is further evident in Pixies' sarcasm above, where it would be ludicrous to only rarely assign an A.

 

You again ask "why have the ten available at all?" but I answered that earlier, so I won't repeat it here.

 

Oh, and if you feel that kids should be assigned 100% from time to time just to keep their hopes up, I'm afraid I strongly disagree. At some point in their schooling, probably mid high-school, they definitely need to learn that their work is rarely perfect and that there's always room for improvement. Because at university and in employment this will certainly be the case. Where I come from, 100% scores were rare as hell, but that only made us try harder, and it made a high score like 90 seem all the more noteworthy. I appreciate your attempts to think from the mind of a student in this regard, but I think your eventual conclusion is flawed.

[thepixiesrock]

Which sarcasm were you refferring to, the one immidiately above you, or the one farther up?

[Arkan]

Which sarcasm were you refferring to, the one immidiately above you, or the one farther up?

 

Well, I'm all for the one immediately above.

[Krookie]

(in my mind) 10 out of 10 doesn't translate to "flawless" it translates to "outstanding"

[Kelverin]

I am curious, what games if any would rate a 10. Personally I would not give any games I have played a 10 score, you? If so which ones? Why?

[Pop]

(in my mind) 10 out of 10 doesn't translate to "flawless" it translates to "outstanding"

Exactly. When an olympic diver gets a perfect 10 nobody suggests that they shut down the sport (even though in that case 10 might very well mean "flawless"). Likewise, the next person to get 10 doesn't render the previous 10 a 9.9 or whatever. Hell, there are usually a number of 5-star quality movies that come out every year. Unless you're into the Oscars or some other competitive thing where you compulsively must put them in order, the fact that they're all 5 star movies is not inconsistent. Most people would probably say that even though No Country For Old Men got best picture last year, There Will Be Blood is just as worthy of viewing. Likewise, populist gaming mags can recommend GTAIV, MGS4 and SSBB while giving them all astronomically high scores as they are wont to do. There is nothing wrong with this. Reviews are far more protected from questions of objective value than, say, Top Games of All Time lists, which don't say anything about games and are there just to move units.

 

I am curious, what games if any would rate a 10. Personally I would not give any games I have played a 10 score, you? If so which ones? Why?

Rise of the Triad. First playthrough of BG2 I'd give a 10 to. Fallout as well. The problems were mainly cosmetic and not all that troubling.

Edited April 27, 2008 by Pop

[Krookie]

First playthrough of BioShock was a 10 for me.

[Arkan]

Hmm...I'd give Fallout a 9, Torment a 9, BG an 8, and Bioshock a 7. I can't think of any 10s off the top of my head, and Torment is my most favoritest game, ever.

Edited April 27, 2008 by Arkan

[Arkan]

Keep in mind I really did Enjoy Bioshock, too, mainly for the setting, art direction and such. Gameplay was very much standard fare. And the end boss was a let down all because of one power.

[random n00b]

(in my mind) 10 out of 10 doesn't translate to "flawless" it translates to "outstanding"

Exactly. When an olympic diver gets a perfect 10 nobody suggests that they shut down the sport (even though in that case 10 might very well mean "flawless"). Likewise, the next person to get 10 doesn't render the previous 10 a 9.9 or whatever.

No. An olympic athlete that getting a 10 means that from the judge's perspective, technique and execution were both flawless. That's why there isn't a single judge, because it theoretically reduces the appreciative error inherent to the human condition. The next guy to get a 10 does not render the previous 10 a 9.9, because one is not evaluated compared to the other, but separately. If you rate a merely "outstanding" performance a 10, what rate do you reserve for the truly flawless?

 

Remember, just because nobody has ever seen a perfect 10, doesn't mean it can't exist.

 

Also, I like pixies' rating system. I deem this post a september.

[Kaftan Barlast]

The rating system of virtually all sites and mags is completely off aswell. It says its like 1-10 but in reality they will never ever give an AAA title a lower scoree than 7, no matter how piss-poor it might be. And lower-budget games never get a lower score than 4. All thats sets a very high average

[N'Al]

Seriously, what is wrong with half the people in this thread!?!

 

It really isn't a particularly difficult concept to grasp.

 

Most (major) reviewing sites give you a definition of the rating scale they use in their reviews on their site; IGN's happens to be one of many where a 10/10 is not a 'perfect' score, merely the top one available (an important distinction that half of you are unable or, worse, unwilling to accept). The reviewers then base their scores on precisely their own definitions. As such, IGN giving GTA IV a 10/10 is perfectly valid.

 

You CANNOT then just come along and apply your own interpretation of what you think a 10/10 should mean to their scores; your interpretation is simply irrelevant. Well, I guess you can, since half of you have been doing so for the last 6 (!) pages, but it just makes you look like an ass. Considering that Hurlshot, Spider et al. have drawn your attention to this already (on page 1, no less!) makes it doubly so.

 

You guys were pulling the same stunt when Eurogamer gave Oblivion a 10/10. You were wrong then, you are wrong now. I honestly believed that humans have the capacity to learn, but you guys make a good case for why they might not. Mega-fail.

[WITHTEETH]

Sweet I can't wait to play this game when (if) it comes out on PC! Higher Textures, keyboard Mouse control, add my own mp3's and higher resolutions ftw!

 

Im surprised everyone is stuck on this grading system too. I'm not going to bother to touch that subject because its its making my head hurt. I just want to see some game play shots, less of this posing animation from the game. Give me the real deal action with the heads up display and map!

[Humodour]

Oblivion was an awesome game. Truly a masterpiece of fiction and interactivity. I can only hope future games emulate it in every way, shape and form.

[Guest The Architect]

Point not found, Krezzy.

[Tel Aviv]

You guys were pulling the same stunt when Eurogamer gave Oblivion a 10/10. You were wrong then, you are wrong now. I honestly believed that humans have the capacity to learn, but you guys make a good case for why they might not. Mega-fail.

10/10

[random n00b]

You CANNOT then just come along and apply your own interpretation of what you think a 10/10 should mean to their scores; your interpretation is simply irrelevant. Well, I guess you can, since half of you have been doing so for the last 6 (!) pages, but it just makes you look like an ass. Considering that Hurlshot, Spider et al. have drawn your attention to this already (on page 1, no less!) makes it doubly so.

Sorry. But I think I am entitled to my own criterion regarding their rating system. If instead of 10 being "best around" or something equally vague, it was assigned to games that "have b00bies", wouldn't you object?

 

I don't think folks have failed to understand that IGN has first defined their rating criteria, and then are applying it. I thought the discussion has evolved to how valid/reliable/logical those criteria are.

 

 

You guys were pulling the same stunt when Eurogamer gave Oblivion a 10/10. You were wrong then, you are wrong now. I honestly believed that humans have the capacity to learn, but you guys make a good case for why they might not. Mega-fail.

Hey, don't let me stop you from letting others do your thinking for you!

[N'Al]

Sorry. But I think I am entitled to my own criterion regarding their rating system. If instead of 10 being "best around" or something equally vague, it was assigned to games that "have b00bies", wouldn't you object?

No, I would ignore it, because whether or not a game has b00bies is not relevant to my finding enjoyment in a game (which may or may not be a complete lie ). However, what I would NOT do is go around claiming the reviewer said it's the perfect game, when all he's saying is that the game has b00bies.

 

 

I don't think folks have failed to understand that IGN has first defined their rating criteria, and then are applying it. I thought the discussion has evolved to how valid/reliable/logical those criteria are.

I'm not convinced that everyone truly has understood, to be honest. I mean, why have this discussion again when it should have been done and dusted in the Oblivion thread that mentioned the Eurogamer review, for example? At least the discussion does seem to have moved on somewhat, as you said, but I think I'll reserve judgment once I've seen more of it down the line. For my part, I think the criteria are perfectly valid/reliable/logical, as anything else would just make a complete mockery of having a 10-point scale in the first place.

 

 

Hey, don't let me stop you from letting others do your thinking for you!

That doesn't even make sense.

[Humodour]

So bitter, N'Al.

[thepixiesrock]

You jerks, that bit would have killed over at Cracked.

[Hurlshort]

This thread is getting ugly. You have one group that sees the glass as half full and another that sees it as half empty. I don't think any arguing will get people to change that perspective.

[thepixiesrock]

Haha, you've probably just created another argument Hurly.

[random n00b]

No, I would ignore it, because whether or not a game has b00bies is not relevant to my finding enjoyment in a game (which may or may not be a complete lie ). However, what I would NOT do is go around claiming the reviewer said it's the perfect game, when all he's saying is that the game has b00bies.

Right. You would ignore a game reviews site giving a 10 to a game just because it "has b00bies", but you just can't bear people here discussing how they feel about how those ratings are assigned?

 

You go man. Fight the good fight.

 

 

I'm not convinced that everyone truly has understood, to be honest. I mean, why have this discussion again when it should have been done and dusted in the Oblivion thread that mentioned the Eurogamer review, for example? At least the discussion does seem to have moved on somewhat, as you said, but I think I'll reserve judgment once I've seen more of it down the line. For my part, I think the criteria are perfectly valid/reliable/logical, as anything else would just make a complete mockery of having a 10-point scale in the first place.

So, now you are the authority on what can and cannot be discussed in these boards?

 

I guess it's one of those cyclical things, here. You might want to go throw another rant in the "Top 10 Games" thread, as well, since the current iteration is by no means the first. And while you're at it, have a go at the politics threads as well.

 

As for the last part in the quote, that sure looks like your opinion on IGN's rating system. But I thought you had said everything you had to say on the subject in the Oblivion thread? What's the point of repeating yourself?

 

So, let's sum this up so a misunderstanding cannot be blamed on the derailment anymore. Not saying they CAN'T give GTAIV a 10,. Just that I disagree with some of the rationale behind it. Surely I am welcome to my opinion?

 

 

That doesn't even make sense.

That's precisely the problem. When you are used to others doing your thinking for you, simple stuff like understanding basic sentences becomes an uphill battle...