4E Rules: First Look

[SteveThaiBinh]

 

Freudian at all?

Useful for slicing a very large cake.

[Xard]

Except that art is from Pathfinder, not D&D

 

(maybe 4E art is similar, then feel free to link)

 

[Xard]

That's it, they killed The Great Wheel

 

D&D Cosmology is dead

Edited March 28, 2008 by Xard

[Darque]

It's been dead since 3.0

 

What planar items WotC did release were more like... raised dead versions.

[Xard]

It's been dead since 3.0

 

What planar items WotC did release were more like... raised dead versions.

 

Making changes that worked and in general made sense = Win (3.0 and 3.5)

 

Dumb****ing everything = fail (4.0)

[quake]

With the advent of 4.0, D&D seems to have shifted its focus almost entirely to that of combat - it's become a miniature-based skirmish game. I'm not saying this is a bad thing, just that I already have plenty of great minis-based skirmish games (Necromunda, Mordheim, etc.) and therefore have zero interest in 4.0.

[Stephen Amber]

With the advent of 4.0, D&D seems to have shifted its focus almost entirely to that of combat - it's become a miniature-based skirmish game. I'm not saying this is a bad thing, just that I already have plenty of great minis-based skirmish games (Necromunda, Mordheim, etc.) and therefore have zero interest in 4.0.

 

The miniatures have been the big sellers the last few years, so it's not really surprising. What's annoying is to see superficial changes, like a fat troll as opposed to a thinner one, as wotc continues to attempt to force you to imagine the beasties looking a certain way... and thus upgrade your figures as well.

[Darque]

With the advent of 4.0, D&D seems to have shifted its focus almost entirely to that of combat - it's become a miniature-based skirmish game. I'm not saying this is a bad thing, just that I already have plenty of great minis-based skirmish games (Necromunda, Mordheim, etc.) and therefore have zero interest in 4.0.

 

Ironically, as I recall, the original DnD evolved out of miniature combat games.

 

Full circle, I guess.

[Jediphile]

With the advent of 4.0, D&D seems to have shifted its focus almost entirely to that of combat - it's become a miniature-based skirmish game. I'm not saying this is a bad thing, just that I already have plenty of great minis-based skirmish games (Necromunda, Mordheim, etc.) and therefore have zero interest in 4.0.

 

Ironically, as I recall, the original DnD evolved out of miniature combat games.

 

Full circle, I guess.

 

Or Regression?

[quake]

Absolutely on regression, and yeah I'm sure it was sparked by economic factors.

 

General question: does anyone else find the D&D minis as poorly made, uninspired and well, crappy as I do? Sure there are a few exceptions, but compared to other minis on the market - yikes! I wouldn't spend money on those POS'.

[Stephen Amber]

The latest set, Desert of Desolation or somesuch, stinks imho, but there have been some very nice figures in previous sets. I particularly like what they've done with orcs.

 

And the quantity of people with the time, money, and skill to make painting the pewter figures worth it has always been limited... pre painted plastic figures might have flown as far back s the 80's... back in the m.u.s.c.l.e. figure days if you remember those.

[Magister Lajciak]

[quote name='H

[Stephen Amber]

Removal of gnomes and bards are two of the aspects of the 4th edition that do not irk me personally (though I can see why they would irritate fans of the race/class).

 

Gnomes weren't in Tolkien, so they don't have quite as solid a backing as fantasy staples. In fact, I think they appear in CS Lewis's quaint, christian allegorical Silver Chair.

[newc0253]

Gnomes weren't in Tolkien, so they don't have quite as solid a backing as fantasy staples.

gnomes weren't in Tolkien and Tolkien = fantasy, ergo gnomes aren't 'fantasy staples'?

 

i guess it beats 'Socrates is a fish' in the inane syllogism stakes.

 

seriously, i'm no giant fan of gnomes as a playable race but you'd have to be pretty hard pressed to argue that they aren't a major part of northern european folklore going back to the middle ages.

[Stephen Amber]

Sure. Pretty much any creature ever mentioned in one of those old folk tales has probably made it's way into the game in some form, but if you actually read them, trolls, gnomes, dwarves and such are relatively interchangeable and do little more than pull mischievous pranks... they shock the pants off medieval peasantry. Oh boy.

 

Not until the early 20th century would writers spin that whole cloth into something more detailed and fully developed... Starting with Dunsany and his noble, immortal, highly magical elves(which Tolkien got his ideas from), and other creatures. Howard, Leiber, Tolkien, and others took up the mantle and continued to define modern fantasy elements, which, through osmosis, ended up in the d&d games. And, as far as the playable races are concerned, I think it is clear Tolkien was the most important in defining them... the basic ones and characters like Aragorn(half elf) and the half-orc mongrels.

 

Speaking of interchangeable, and other than the pointy noise, an eccentric halfling wizard differs from a gnome how? Seems to me having both gnomes and halflings was a bit redundant. One of them was expendable...

[Cantousent]

I vote for expending them both.

[steelfiredragon]

the elf in pathfinder is ugly with those goblin ears.

 

the dnd 4e gnome has player write ups in the mm

 

 

no problem as far as im concerned. dont care for gnomes as characters, the bard on the otherhand

[player1]

the dnd 4e gnome has player write ups in the mm

 

And will be expanded in PHB2.

[unangbangkay]

I was reading a Dev article on wizards.com and they mentioned that bards are in 4e, and will benefit from the rules changes.

 

You'll need to login:

http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/drdd/20070831a

 

One last thing before I go, since I started this note off by talking about Nils. This time, let me say a few things to Nils directly:

[steelfiredragon]

raise dead aint all that good either in 4e

[Magister Lajciak]

I was reading a Dev article on wizards.com and they mentioned that bards are in 4e, and will benefit from the rules changes.

 

You'll need to login:

http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/drdd/20070831a

 

One last thing before I go, since I started this note off by talking about Nils. This time, let me say a few things to Nils directly:

[player1]

just like gnomes...

[steelfiredragon]

btw there is something on the new mm at the wizards site now

http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/4ex/20080414a

Edited April 14, 2008 by steelfiredragon

[steelfiredragon]

http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/4dnd/artpreview

[Magister Lajciak]

Wizards of the Coast now releases previews every Monday, Wednesday and Friday until the game is released on 6 June 2008.