An Odd Change of Opinion and some Questions

[Bandobras Took]

I used to think that KotOR 2 wasn't that great.

 

However, I pulled it out, reinstalled, and played as a Sith Lord.

 

And the story flowed smoothly, led well from one segment to another, and seemed rather well balanced and designed overall.

 

So I thought, "Maybe I remembered incorrectly," and started up another game as a Light Side Guardian. And it's as irritating as I remember.

 

As far as I can tell, the fundamental differences are these.

 

1) Playing a Light Sider causes you to lose influence with Kreia, who contains a whole lot of the back story and insights that give later events meaning;

 

2) The manner in which a Dark Sider feeds on the Jedi Masters

[JediMasterAltena]

well guardians aren't really that technical in nature, there like the warriors of star wars while a consular is like a wizard. Obisidan did however change a bit around, on what class had what skill as a standard, like Sential used to be the repair one .. at least from what i remember from kotor 1. Plus unlike kotor 1, you can use your party members do stuff like repairs for you.

[Bandobras Took]

The point is the Workbench. The Workbench, unless I'm mistaken, always uses the Exile's skills, but many item upgrades as well as breakdown/basic item creation require high amounts of repair.

 

It just is annoying that the class that relies the most on weapons will have the hardest time making a good weapon.

 

It's still the other aspect I'm more concerned with, though: how can one gain influence with Kreia without also gaining Dark Side points?

[LadyCrimson]

Kreia is Neutral - she doesn't like it when you go too far to either side. The story re: her involvement may seem to flow more smoothly from a narrative point of view, perhaps, if you go DS vs. LS, but far as I know you're not gaining better personal influence. Generally speaking if you kill someone during her influence situations, she bickers at you - if you're too sympathetic, she also bickers at you. There are a few exceptions tho.

 

Also far as I remember, there are oppurtunties to influence her that are both DS and LS point related. I checked gamefaqs but unfortunately that influence FAQ there doesn't list what you get in each case.

[MasterJediConsular]

The point is the Workbench.  The Workbench, unless I'm mistaken, always uses the Exile's skills, but many item upgrades as well as breakdown/basic item creation require high amounts of repair.

 

It just is annoying that the class that relies the most on weapons will have the hardest time making a good weapon.

 

It's still the other aspect I'm more concerned with, though: how can one gain influence with Kreia without also gaining Dark Side points?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

The workbench uses the skill stats of whichever character you are controlling when you approach the workbench.

 

I've never had any trouble whatsoever gaining influence with Kreia, and I just about always play as a light side jedi.

 

Just use your common sense when talking to her.

 

When she says something bad about another character, and you can either gain DS points or lose influence just change the subject or leave.

 

Most of the time you gain influence just by placating her when she disagrees with something you did. It isn't necessary to do exactly what she says, just choose the dialogue that indicates you've considered her opinion (most of the time anyway).

 

Whenever there is a party discussion or decision being made, always ask her opinion and if it doesn't gain you DS points or seem idiotic, just agree with what she says over the party members who are easier to gain influence with.

 

Also sucking up to her heaps even if your a smart arse to other characters, sugary crap like "I will honour your teachings" etc. Only once or twice does that get you into trouble with her. (I think something about you protecting, or saying something about her teaching you gets her gets her to tell you to stop patronizing her near the start on the hawk).

 

Also a lot of the jedi dialogue lines about the code etc seem to p*ss her off so try to avoid those when you can.

 

I never even really take her in my party except when it is absolutely necessary and I still get all the info she had to offer.

[vaxen83]

Expect to get some criticism from Kreia in some parts of game, if character has dialogue with her during first playthrough. Some of dialogue lines that work with her either come with LS points or DS points, and sometimes neither of both. Generally, is easier to gain influence with her without having to have alignment shifts if possible.

Edited November 17, 2006 by vaxen83

[SamuraiGaijin]

The workbench uses the skill stats of whichever character you are controlling when you approach the workbench.

The workbench uses the lead character's (i.e. not the Exile in the Duxn Tomb, Exile everywhere else) repair skill to break down items, and the skills of the character using the workbench for everything else.

[cretialuv7]

see that strikes me as odd...about it always using the exile's repair skill at the workbench...because if im not mistaken...and goodness there are times when i am...lol...but i see a difference in breakdown value when i use bao-dur instead of myself at a workbench...one of the reasons that i keep him in my party so much...well that and i love bao-dur as a character....and ive played this game so much i could do it with my eyes closed...LOL...i cant find other games that are like the kotor games....im going to pay even more attention now the next time i play and see....and if im totally wrong then ive learned something new.... ^_^

[old gamer]

The workbench uses the lead character's (i.e. not the Exile in the Duxn Tomb, Exile everywhere else) repair skill to break down items, and the skills of the character using the workbench for everything else.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The skills of the character using the workbench always take precedence,for instance, try breaking down the same item with all 3 characters and pay attention to the difference in the amount of components you get,same goes for creating items. Try it for yourself and you will see.

[Deadly_Nightshade]

Also far as I remember, there are oppurtunties to influence her that are both DS and LS point related.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

There are many more DS incidents, as K thinks that being soft is a major weakness...

[LadyCrimson]

Yeah, that she does. I just wasn't sure if you actually got a DS hit in all of those situations - seems like there were some influence things that gave no DS/LS hit at all and wasn't sure what the balance was.

 

At any rate - I never had any major trouble gaining enough influence with her for the plot and staying LS.

[Kalfear]

Yeah, that she does. I just wasn't sure if you actually got a DS hit in all of those situations - seems like there were some influence things that gave no DS/LS hit at all and wasn't sure what the balance was.

 

At any rate - I never had any major trouble gaining enough influence with her for the plot and staying LS.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Me either, it was definately easier as DS but wasnt that hard as LS, just have to read your options and play to the character is all.

[Darth_Nihlus]

i agree this game is made for darkside! storyline wise, everything

[SamuraiGaijin]

I might be wrong about the repair / breakdown thing ... it's admittedly been a while since I played.

 

Regarding Kreia influence and conversation trees, there are two ways to approach it ... play your character, and get what you get, or try to open as much dialog as possible by carefully choosing the responses that will gain influence.

 

Keep in mind that there are some situations (mostly on Nar Shadda) for which there isn't really a good action to take, but there is usually a follow-up dialog with Kreia where you can gain some influence by claiming to see things her way.

[vaxen83]

Well, skills like treat injury and repair would likely be used by the Exile's skill. Unless, say if Exile isn't in party, of which one such part of game could be raid on Dxun where party leader is another party character. Seems that way, so far.

[Nero]

Pretty much agree with Kreia, don't show weakness or any bond to the people that are you"friends" and tell her they are just pawns to be used to your greater plan and she will love you forever. Learn to use people and thats what she wants to hear.

[Bandobras Took]

Pretty much agree with Kreia, don't show weakness or any bond to the people that are you"friends" and tell her they are just pawns to be used to your greater plan and she will love you forever. Learn to use people and thats what she wants to hear.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

And nets you dark side points. Which is what I was trying to avoid in the first place.

 

On a positive note, on Korriban, you can get positive influence without dark side points by telling her nobody is beyond redemption.

 

And on another positive if note, I found a conversation with Bao-Dur that I've never found before, where he discusses whose fault Malachor V is. Do you have to turn him into a Jedi to get that conversation, or does it just happen if you've got enough influence?

[Purgatorio]

Bandobras Took:

And on another positive if note, I found a conversation with Bao-Dur that I've never found before, where he discusses whose fault Malachor V is. Do you have to turn him into a Jedi to get that conversation, or does it just happen if you've got enough influence?

Was that in the ship? It sounds like the one that starts with: Exile; "I didn't know you were still awake." or "Don't you ever sleep?"

The Jedifying conversation will be obvious.... On my first play through he was my first apprentice, and I didn't know you could show NPCs the force. :joy:

[Bandobras Took]

Yeah, it's on the ship, and it's Bao-Dur blaming himself for the idea and throwing the switch, while the Exile can blame himself for giving the order. I've never had that conversation before, but maybe I didn't make Bao-Dur a Jedi early enough in previous games.

[vaxen83]

Could be part of dialogue after having much influence with Bao-Dur, after he comes Jedi.

[Purgatorio]

I don't know if it's influence related, (because Bao-Dur is so cool that I can't lower myself to be mean to him), so I can't say if it happens with low influence. The conversation you speak of, can also occur after Mandalore joins. When it does, it continues.... Mandalore joining the conversation when it would normally end. I got the impression that the exchange between Bao and Mandalore was what the cut bickering between Juhani and Canderous was supposed to be like in K1.

 

For Vaxen,

Does it happen for you after you make Bao a minion? For me it happens after first the Onderon visit, and by then Bao is a minion. But there is another Bao/ Mandalor (on ship) moment, when you get enough influence with Mandalore... So the first could be influence related, Bandobras Took.

[Bandobras Took]

Just finished as a light side Jedi Watchman.

 

For some reason, I never got the chance to ask Atris why I couldn't tell Kreia was a Sith.

 

And is there some sort of rule governing which companions you can ask about at the end? I could ask about Mira and Mandalore, but nobody else.

[vaxen83]

Haven't played for a while. However, my character had to get something like at least close to 4-5 influence gains with Bao-Dur. After the Jedi conversion, it seemed either having to question Bao-Dur where he would say talk about the war and how devastation wrought from activating the mass shadow generator in terms of consequences was beyond his and Exile's expectations. And he would also mention that Revan was in some other part, involved in war from a slightly different role. Exile was supposedly acting on Revan's behalf in a sense, I suppose. Can't really tell where this is situated, but it ties closely to why Bao-Dur seems intent on wanting to learn force to possibly reverse damage done by his ow designs. So, it is possible that it could even be before converting Bao-Dur, if I follow logic's lead in some sense. Suffice to say that it did not seem to be restricted to getting it it only before he becomes a Jedi, or after. Flexibility, simply.

Edited November 25, 2006 by vaxen83