Blank Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 But doesn't being alive when others are not define you as chosen? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Not really otherwise every game with a protagonist would have a chosen one by default. Ha, that was my point. Being alive defines you as lucky/skillful nothing more. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I agree with you... I sure hope NWN2 will be TEH BESTEST!
Jora Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 Saw this on the RPG Codex boards and thought it's quite funny: Is it just me or is the story sound like classic Avellone. I see the inevitable conversation already... Ancient Being: Fool, you cannot comprehend your very nature. PC: What is my nature? I just thought I had a bit of metal lodged in me. AB: How typically human of you, to think a sword must be metal. PC: So its not metal, what difference does it make? AB: The sword is the very essence of creation itself. When it shattered it did not lodge into your body, it entered your very soul. PC: So my sould has a bit of creation stuck in it? AB: It is more then stuck there, it damaged your very soul. You are incomplete, hobbled, BROKEN. PC: I had no idea, how do I fix myself before its to late. AB: It may not be possible though you have no choice but to try. I know what you must do now... (cue leg of quests). The potential is there, I just know it. http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=228425#228425
Cantousent Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 I choose you all... to go to the funny farm. The NWN campaign is an example of a non-chosen one moment. For the term to have any meaning, other than to the troglodytes at the Codex, it must be reserved for situations in which it is warranted. Vol's completely nuts in regards to the term, but he is right that the NWN packaged campaign was not an example of a "Chosen One" story. However, it was still disappointing. The NWN2 story does not sound "Chosen One" driven at all. You might call it hackneyed for some other reason, but the protagonist isn't "Chosen" unless you define the term so broadly it encompasses virtually everything. If you give broad definition to the term "chosen one," folks can make an argument for every story written to fall into the same category. Fionavar's Holliday Wishes to all members of our online community: Happy Holidays Join the revelry at the Obsidian Plays channel:Obsidian Plays Remembering tarna, Phosphor, Metadigital, and Visceris. Drink mead heartily in the halls of Valhalla, my friends!
ShadowPaladin V1.0 Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 You might call it hackneyed for some other reason <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Doubt it will be any worse than NWN where whatever killed the masters of the academy buggered off and just left really weak creatures for you to fight. I have to agree with Volourn. Bioware is pretty much dead now. Deals like this kills development studios. 478327[/snapback]
Atreides Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 So what - getting shrapnel lodged in you while you were minding your own business and trying to survive qualifies lots of Iraqis and Egyptians. Spreading beauty with my katana.
Tigranes Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 That's cause they are the Chosen People. Let's Play: Icewind Dale Ironman (Complete) Let's Play: Icewind Dale II Ironman (Complete) Let's Play: Divinity II (Complete) Let's Play: Baldur's Gate Trilogy Ironman - BG1 (Complete) Let's Play: Baldur's Gate Trilogy Ironman - BG2 (In Progress)
Musopticon? Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 Looooow zinger. kirottu said: I was raised by polar bears. I had to fight against blood thirsty wolves and rabid penguins to get my food. Those who were too weak to survive were sent to Sweden. It has made me the man I am today. A man who craves furry hentai. So let us go and embrace the rustling smells of unseen worlds
deganawida Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 Yup. And, NWN2's stated story fits in the JE camp - though not the same degree; but much closer to that than to NWN OC where you are just some adventurer. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You could still replace the PC with another if the first died though. If it's just a matter of digging out the shard. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Exactly. The shard is what's important, not the one in whom it is embedded. To further clarify, ask yourself this question: Would the githyanki still have reason to pursue the PC were the shard not embedded in him, assuming nothing else in the story changed? The answer is a resounding "no". However, the githyanki would still need the shard, so the story could progress with minimal interference. Now, take BG2 (oh, and Volo, Irenicus is most definitely the protagonist of BG2, as he defines all the action in the game save for side-quests; the protagonist does not have to be the hero, which is why Gromnir's old MacBeth argument is so very apt in describing the plot of BG2): Could that game had proceeded had the PC not been the Bhaalspawn? Again, the answer is "no". The entire reason that Irenicus sought out the PC was due to his Bhaal essence, which was part of his nature. In conclusion, "Chosen One" stories are guided by the principle that there is something intrinsic in the protagonist's nature which renders him important. A bit of sword lodged deep in your body is not part of your nature.
Judge Hades Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 GET IT OUT! GET IT OUT! IT BURNS LIKE HYGEINE!
deganawida Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 (edited) GET IT OUT! GET IT OUT! IT BURNS LIKE HYGEINE! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Too much coffee is not a good thing. EDIT: Heck, now that I think about it, coffee period is not a good think. Drink some tea, for crying out loud, preferrably sweet tea (sweetened with Splenda is best). Edited April 27, 2006 by deganawida
Judge Hades Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 No, not coffee. Sugar and caffiene of Coke with the munching of cheap and cheeze!
deganawida Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 No, not coffee. Sugar and caffiene of Coke with the munching of cheap and cheeze! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> "Munching of cheap and cheeze" coupled with your avatar has led me to create a new nickname for you: Gurgi.
ShadowPaladin V1.0 Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 "Munching of cheap and cheeze" coupled with your avatar has led me to create a new nickname for you: Gurgi. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Chronicles of Prydain ? I have to agree with Volourn. Bioware is pretty much dead now. Deals like this kills development studios. 478327[/snapback]
Dark_Raven Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 Is it time? Time to retire this? Hades was the life of the party. RIP You'll be missed.
deganawida Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 "Munching of cheap and cheeze" coupled with your avatar has led me to create a new nickname for you: Gurgi. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Chronicles of Prydain ? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yup.
Volourn Posted April 27, 2006 Author Posted April 27, 2006 (edited) "Now, take BG2 (oh, and Volo, Irenicus is most definitely the protagonist of BG2, as he defines all the action in the game save for side-quests; the protagonist does not have to be the hero, which is why Gromnir's old MacBeth argument is so very apt in describing the plot of BG2): Could that game had proceeded had the PC not been the Bhaalspawn? Again, the answer is "no". The entire reason that Irenicus sought out the PC was due to his Bhaal essence, which was part of his nature." No. Irenicus is not the BG2 protagonist. Everything in BG2 is about the BG2. Irenicus, as the main antagonist, is a big part of it; but he isn't it. Irenicus would be irrelevant if his story didn't have soemthing to do with the PC. BG2 is the continuation of the PC story - his learning of his past - hence the dream sequences - hence the Hell tests - the story is also told by the view of the PC hence the PC being the protagonist. The story is about the PC. This is undisputable. Unless you ar egonna argue BG1's protagonist is Sarevok or FO's story is the Master's, etc., etc. The fact that Irenicus has a good motivation, and a background story means just that... he's, comapred to most main villains, is deep (comparitvely speaking). Edited April 27, 2006 by Volourn DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.
StillLife Posted April 27, 2006 Posted April 27, 2006 (edited) Chosen One seems to fall into two categories for people: 1) You're the central character tasked with some epic quest to save the world/galaxy. 2) Your character has some sort of divine relation and an epic destiny as a result of that relation. That really just qualifies as the archetypal hero though, in the Greek sense. That said, NWN2 doesn't seem to be tied to either of those routes from what is known yet. It could very well be that you have to save the world at some point, or you could just be a random shmuck caught up in something messy that you need to solve in order to have some peace. In my opinion, The Nameless One, The Vault Dweller, The Guy(from Gothic), your character in Divine Divinity, NeverWinter Nights, and VTM: Bloodlines are all examples of games where you were not a Chosen One. KOTOR, KOTOR 2, Baldurs Gate, Morrowind, Oblivion, and Fallout 2 were examples of game's where the protagonist qualified for Chosen One status in my book. It's kind of cliche, but some people seem to at least on a subconcious level, require their character to have some epic sense of purpose in CRPGs. Spoiler: Take the ending of Bloodlines for example, where it turned out you were really just some naive fledgling caught up in a political struggle, not really the savior of the world or even a part of something of epic proportions. That revelation seemed to really irk a lot of people, though I thought it was a very refreshing conclusion. Edited April 27, 2006 by StillLife
Azarkon Posted April 28, 2006 Posted April 28, 2006 Gah, every discussion ends up an argument over semantics. Who cares what "Chosen One" stands for? Argue the storyline, not the terminology. There are doors
Cantousent Posted April 28, 2006 Posted April 28, 2006 Gah, every discussion ends up an argument over semantics. Who cares what "Chosen One" stands for? Argue the storyline, not the terminology. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The reason we argue terminology is simple: the simpletons at the Codex have turned the term into a swearword. Fionavar's Holliday Wishes to all members of our online community: Happy Holidays Join the revelry at the Obsidian Plays channel:Obsidian Plays Remembering tarna, Phosphor, Metadigital, and Visceris. Drink mead heartily in the halls of Valhalla, my friends!
Volourn Posted April 28, 2006 Author Posted April 28, 2006 YAHOO! I'm a simpleton! Good stuff! DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.
ShadowPaladin V1.0 Posted April 28, 2006 Posted April 28, 2006 Gah, every discussion ends up an argument over semantics. Who cares what "Chosen One" stands for? Argue the storyline, not the terminology. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> In order to determine if it's a chosen one story. You first have to determine what a chosen one is. I have to agree with Volourn. Bioware is pretty much dead now. Deals like this kills development studios. 478327[/snapback]
Cantousent Posted April 28, 2006 Posted April 28, 2006 YAHOO! I'm a simpleton! Good stuff! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> No, Volourn. You're the mascot for the simpletons. Fionavar's Holliday Wishes to all members of our online community: Happy Holidays Join the revelry at the Obsidian Plays channel:Obsidian Plays Remembering tarna, Phosphor, Metadigital, and Visceris. Drink mead heartily in the halls of Valhalla, my friends!
Volourn Posted April 28, 2006 Author Posted April 28, 2006 That's hilarious considering the hate the Codex has for me is even greater than the hate here! DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.
Cantousent Posted April 28, 2006 Posted April 28, 2006 I can only speak for myself. I don't hate you Vol. I rather like you. You drive me to madness, but I'm a masochist. Fionavar's Holliday Wishes to all members of our online community: Happy Holidays Join the revelry at the Obsidian Plays channel:Obsidian Plays Remembering tarna, Phosphor, Metadigital, and Visceris. Drink mead heartily in the halls of Valhalla, my friends!
Volourn Posted April 28, 2006 Author Posted April 28, 2006 I know you don't. And, that knowledge makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside and makes enduring all the hate that much easier. :D In essence, I. LOVE. YOU. :"> DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250.
Recommended Posts