February 6, 200619 yr Then it was the first sim on a console. Just because a genre isn't predominant on a particular platform, doesn't mean it's suddenly in a different genre. How could you "technically" have sims or whatever anyways? IMO a genre defies the platform. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> But Pirates! is not a SIM in the same way that "Civilization" or even "The SIMS" was. Pirates! had very heavy RPG elements. You can interact with NPCs and get quests, it had a main storyline along with non-linear side quests, you can assume different roles and positions and go up in rank... Your actions determined the morale of your fellow pirates and affected the flow of the game and the actions of those around you..you can even get married..It even had some basic choices in character creation about the same amount given in PS:T. The only thing missing was that it didn't have visible stats (i.e. HP or Levels). Although it had most of the other elements that would make an RPG, I agree that the designation is a bit blurry although I could definitely see the argument for the game being considered an RPG or a SIM... Or even as Plano stated: an adventure game with heavy RPG elements. And if you do a google search many, many sites label the SEGA version of Pirates! as an RPG. Not a SIM or even an adventure game. Edited February 6, 200619 yr by Lancer Lancer
February 6, 200619 yr there were rumors (widely believed to be accurate) that the Xbox 360 would have 3 versions: lite (no hd), deluxe (with hd) and PC. That's right, the high end one was going to be, essentially, a multimedia PC that ran Windows and even had a keyboard and mouse. That high end model never made it into production. But here is the thing: I think it had alot to do with the next-gen DVD thing. The industry has not agreed to a standard yet. So, instead of paying Sony to use Blue Ray or instead of using the alternate format instead, MS decided to let Sony rush in where angels fear to tread and see how it goes. At some point, MS will choose sides if not come up with their own version (that seems to be able to read the other ones :D ). And then they will release a console that is also a PC and then crush Sony by price-dropping their low-end machines to ridiculous levels. My theory, anyway. Xbox 360 is next gen enough to get the other guy to jump too soon or let the market pass you by.
February 6, 200619 yr Since we've opened up the semantics can of worms, what are the heavy RPG elements? Not saying they're not there, but the term "RPG elements" does get tossed around quite a bit. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> * at the beginning of the game, you chose a special skill. * also, there was decent dialogue. * in-game choices that affected the flow of the game (getting married affected the game in a significant way. * there was at least one stat (such as reputation) that could wax and wane. it was a not a numerical stat but a stat nonetheless. basically, what it did not have was: * numerical stats * leveling * class system
February 6, 200619 yr * numerical stats* leveling * class system So does Freelancer. Would that be a RPG? (Ofcourse, in another thread somebody said that too (Freelancer = RPG-influenced)... let's see what you guys think...)
February 6, 200619 yr Given your command of the English language, I have a feeling 'putsch' was pretty deliberate? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yes. It was an analogy. "putsch" is German. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Actually it is an English word of German derivation. OBSCVRVM PER OBSCVRIVS ET IGNOTVM PER IGNOTIVS OPVS ARTIFICEM PROBAT
February 6, 200619 yr Since we've opened up the semantics can of worms, what are the heavy RPG elements? Not saying they're not there, but the term "RPG elements" does get tossed around quite a bit. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> * at the beginning of the game, you chose a special skill. * also, there was decent dialogue. * in-game choices that affected the flow of the game (getting married affected the game in a significant way. * there was at least one stat (such as reputation) that could wax and wane. it was a not a numerical stat but a stat nonetheless. basically, what it did not have was: * numerical stats * leveling * class system <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That sounds like more of an RPG than any game I've ever played. P.S. numerical stats, leveling, and a class system are not RPG-defining.
February 6, 200619 yr basically, what it did not have was: * numerical stats * leveling * class system <{POST_SNAPBACK}> A small interjection.. You don't need a "class system" or even "levels" to be an RPG. There are a lot of class-less , level-less RPGs out there. Lancer
February 6, 200619 yr Decent Dialogue? Getting married significantly affected the game? And Lancer, if you don't think of Pirates! as a sim, then why did you just say it could be called one? Besides, since we're playing the semantics game, I doubt many people would consider Civilization to be a SIM game either. Most people call it turn-based strategy. EDIT: Fair enough points all around BTW. I guess I never really considered it an RPG because, at the time, there was really no other game like it. I always thought of it as an open-ended adventure game, but that was over a decade ago. Edited February 6, 200619 yr by alanschu
February 6, 200619 yr A small interjection.. You don't need a "class system" or even "levels" to be an RPG. There are a lot of class-less , level-less RPGs out there. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I think "continuing customization" is what an RPG must have. This can be class-based or skill-based.
February 6, 200619 yr Pirates! can *definitely* be considered an RPG.. Unless you are of Ender's camp that profess that the defining characteristic of an RPG is stat-based gameplay.. Which I don't really agree with. Pirates! is the prime example of a game without a real stat system yet it is still an RPG. Edited February 6, 200619 yr by Lancer Lancer
February 6, 200619 yr http://megagames.com/news/html/console/ps3...evelopers.shtml ::Shrug:: Take it for what it is... I had thought that some of nature's journeymen had made men and not made them well, for they imitated humanity so abominably. - Book of Counted Sorrows 'Cause I won't know the man that kills me and I don't know these men I kill but we all wind up on the same side 'cause ain't none of us doin' god's will. - Everlast
February 6, 200619 yr And Lancer, if you don't think of Pirates! as a sim, then why did you just say it could be called one? Only because it is labeled as such on the PC. I would imagine that the lack of stat-based gameplay lent it to be labeled as a SIM. However, I have always thought it was more akin to an RPG than a SIM. Edited February 6, 200619 yr by Lancer Lancer
February 6, 200619 yr Pirates! can *definitely* be considered an RPG.. Unless you are of Ender's camp that profess that the defining characteristic of an RPG is stat-based gameplay.. Which I don't really agree with. Pirates! is the prime example of a game without a real stat system yet it is still an RPG. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I miss Ender. Anyone got a link to his column? OBSCVRVM PER OBSCVRIVS ET IGNOTVM PER IGNOTIVS OPVS ARTIFICEM PROBAT
February 6, 200619 yr I've always considered it an action/adventure game :D <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I know you do.. Let's put it this way: Pirates! has more RPG elements than Diablo or most JRPGs that are marketed as RPGs. Lancer
February 6, 200619 yr Pirates! can *definitely* be considered an RPG.. Unless you are of Ender's camp that profess that the defining characteristic of an RPG is stat-based gameplay.. Which I don't really agree with. Pirates! is the prime example of a game without a real stat system yet it is still an RPG. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I miss Ender. Anyone got a link to his column? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> This? http://enderandrew.livejournal.com/ Lancer
February 6, 200619 yr Author http://megagames.com/news/html/console/ps3...evelopers.shtml ::Shrug:: Take it for what it is... Interesting. Megagames aren't very far up my trust-list (if I had one..), but it's still fun to read some differing views on the accessibility of the CELL and its SPU's. Too many people claim that it's impossible (or near at least) to write code for, but seldom does anyone have any direct contact with the beast. I read somewhere that over 4000 devkits for the Playstation 3 had been shipped.. I wonder where they all went? Swedes, go to: Spel2, for the latest game reviews in swedish!
February 6, 200619 yr I've always considered it an action/adventure game :D <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I know you do.. Let's put it this way: Pirates! has more RPG elements than Diablo or most JRPGs that are marketed as RPGs. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Wait a minute. Maybe it's your definition of RPG elements that don't match up with the rest of the world, if two game types marketed (and branded by customers) as RPG games supposedly have less "RPG elements." I mean, if RPGs don't have much RPG elements, are the RPG elements actually RPG elements?
February 6, 200619 yr This?http://enderandrew.livejournal.com/ <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I was thinking about the online review journal, but that'll do OBSCVRVM PER OBSCVRIVS ET IGNOTVM PER IGNOTIVS OPVS ARTIFICEM PROBAT
February 6, 200619 yr Pirates! has more RPG elements than Diablo or most JRPGs that are marketed as RPGs. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Wait a minute. Maybe it's your definition of RPG elements that don't match up with the rest of the world, if two game types marketed (and branded by customers) as RPG games supposedly have less "RPG elements." I mean, if RPGs don't have much RPG elements, are the RPG elements actually RPG elements? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Maybe there are Dark RPG Elements that make up all the undetectable RPG elements in RPGs ... OBSCVRVM PER OBSCVRIVS ET IGNOTVM PER IGNOTIVS OPVS ARTIFICEM PROBAT
February 6, 200619 yr Hehehehe. DOn't forget the Tachyons, the imperceptible RPG elements. Edited February 6, 200619 yr by alanschu
February 6, 200619 yr I've always considered it an action/adventure game :D <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I know you do.. Let's put it this way: Pirates! has more RPG elements than Diablo or most JRPGs that are marketed as RPGs. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Wait a minute. Maybe it's your definition of RPG elements that don't match up with the rest of the world, if two game types marketed (and branded by customers) as RPG games supposedly have less "RPG elements." I mean, if RPGs don't have much RPG elements, are the RPG elements actually RPG elements? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> There are quite a few consumers (here on this forum and all over the world)that would agree with me that Diablo is not an RPG. There are quite a few arguments that explain why JRPGS really are more like adventure games. Not RPGs. Just because a game is marketed as belonging to "x-genre" doesn't mean that it is a 100% correct placement. Marketing designations are nothing more than just convenient labels so that the consumer can get a superficial idea of what the game they are buying is roughly like. They are not meant to be 100% accurate. Edited February 6, 200619 yr by Lancer Lancer
February 6, 200619 yr Diablo would be the lesser of the two, but I don't think it's too significant of a minority that feels JRPG games are not RPG games.
February 6, 200619 yr Hehehehe. Don't forget the Tachyons, the imperceptible RPG elements. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> So games that have no RPG elements will be impregnated by RPG elements from the future? :cool: OBSCVRVM PER OBSCVRIVS ET IGNOTVM PER IGNOTIVS OPVS ARTIFICEM PROBAT
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