Tyrell Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I'm worried that there won't be any motives to be a DS person. I mean naturally there is a motive to be good. The Jedi is near extinct, republic on their knees.....there is a motive for you to be good and stop this. Just like in KOTOR. See my plan is for TSL the first time around is to play through it first as a DS person unlike in KOTOR how I went through first as a LS person. When I play DS I want to to be something similar to what Anakin Skywalker goes through. I don't want to be DS because I choose to "bully" a person **** like that. I want to face temptations. It was too easy to be bad in KOTOR. But for Anakin it wasn't easy being bad. In TSL I want it to be where Obsidian is almost trying to "force-feed" us to be bad with the intent of us trying to be good but just seeming near impossible cause there is just so much temptation. In KOTOR instead we were force-feed to be good and had to "try" to be bad. It shouldn't be that way. In college you want to get good grades and study but there is those temptations like parties and **** like that that gets in the way. Get what I'm saying. So in other words in TSL I want to be the "Tragic Anti-Hero" not the bully of the galaxy. I know Obsidian has promised that things like this has been fixed, but who else here sees the way I see? PlayMoreConsoles TheForce.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosbjerg Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 this has been a common fear .. I too felt that the DS options were lame and you were a pawn through the game going DS or LS .. I accept that I must follow the will of the Counsil, but as a Sith Lord I shouldn't follow the orders of a little brat .. So I definitly hope that there will be more temptations and easier ways in TSL that will lead you to the DS .. A jedis life is full of choices that, without choosing wisely, can easily lead to the Dark side .. and this should be reflected in the game! Fortune favors the bald. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumquatq3 Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 When I play DS I want to to be something similar to what Anakin Skywalker goes through. But for Anakin it wasn't easy being bad. Thats all well and good, but remember thats what you want, not nessasarily the way it should be. I doubt Darth Maul or The Emporer was a "tragic anti-hero". And remember, you already start off as a fallen jedi. You havn't gone to the darkside (that we know of), but you did something so bad/dangerous that the Jedi Order chose to banish you. It's not like you start off as Mr. Rogers of the SW universe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSLuke Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I think we will feel the tempetation of the Dark Side in this game. I like to think that we will face situation where we must choose the lesser of two evils and so on. Also I do have a feeling that by playing DS the game will be somewhat easier. Of course the other Sith will plot against you, since obviously you a re still a threat for them and you may become the Sith Lord. And by the light of the moon He prays for their beauty not doom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesertHawk Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Mmmm, I like your idea. However, I want a truely seductive reason for following the DS path. I remember when I was facing Bastie at the temple and listened to her talk. Despite the fact that she sounded bitter and angry, I could understand what she was talking about. Yeah, I could get the fact that "The jedi council betrayed you once" "they're using you as a puppet" blah blah blah. But I didn't want to go mad with power (like all sith seem to do ) I wanted to look at it like I understood it; like I had a horrible grudge against the council and I wanted to know who I really was. KOTOR made it too easy to be mean. A good person can do good things that turn out bad. A bad person can do good things. Take it a step beyond "black and white and gray" look at things as "right and wrong". You can say things like "GRRR! GIVE ME ALL YER CREDITS!" or say things like "Excuse me. . .are these your credits?" after taking 3/4ths as a reward before giving them back, then casually asking for a reward. I'd also like for it to be hard to crawl back up to goodness. It was too easy to jump from light to dark to light to dark whenever you wanted to. I would also like to be a pretty good evil person. Not have those nasty veins bulging out of my face and look like I'm a walking corpse. Bastilia looked good; why can't I? Fnord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumquatq3 Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I like to think that we will face situation where we must choose the lesser of two evils and so on. Thats not really temptation is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSLuke Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Not really, but it can feed your anger.. And by the light of the moon He prays for their beauty not doom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostofAnakin Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I'm worried that there won't be any motives to be a DS person. I mean naturally there is a motive to be good. The Jedi is near extinct, republic on their knees.....there is a motive for you to be good and stop this. Just like in KOTOR. See my plan is for TSL the first time around is to play through it first as a DS person unlike in KOTOR how I went through first as a LS person. When I play DS I want to to be something similar to what Anakin Skywalker goes through. I don't want to be DS because I choose to "bully" a person **** like that. I want to face temptations. It was too easy to be bad in KOTOR. But for Anakin it wasn't easy being bad. In TSL I want it to be where Obsidian is almost trying to "force-feed" us to be bad with the intent of us trying to be good but just seeming near impossible cause there is just so much temptation. In KOTOR instead we were force-feed to be good and had to "try" to be bad. It shouldn't be that way. In college you want to get good grades and study but there is those temptations like parties and **** like that that gets in the way. Get what I'm saying. So in other words in TSL I want to be the "Tragic Anti-Hero" not the bully of the galaxy. I know Obsidian has promised that things like this has been fixed, but who else here sees the way I see? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> For this to happen, there will probably have to be instances where your character is faced with a situation where someone he cares about is in danger and the only way to save them is to go "psycho" on the enemy, tapping in to the Dark Side, or where someone you care about has been hurt and you unleash the Dark Side in a fury of rage (like Anakin did to the Sand People who killed his mother). "Console exclusive is such a harsh word." - Darque"Console exclusive is two words Darque." - Nartwak (in response to Darque's observation) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumquatq3 Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 However, I want a truely seductive reason for following the DS path. I remember when I was facing Bastie at the temple and listened to her talk. Despite the fact that she sounded bitter and angry, I could understand what she was talking about. Yeah, I could get the fact that "The jedi council betrayed you once" "they're using you as a puppet" blah blah blah. But I didn't want to go mad with power (like all sith seem to do ) I wanted to look at it like I understood it; like I had a horrible grudge against the council and I wanted to know who I really was. but not liking the council and wanting to know who you really are doesn't mean you fall to the DS. Jollee had a grudge against the council and didn't try to take over the universe. Thats what I'm saying. How do you really "tempt" a player if not with something he can use in the game (PNPC, money, items) or with something he chooses to do for fun (new quests, furthering a story line). It's pretty hard, if not impossible, to make the player feel pure hate or fear so that they turn to the DS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ameorn Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I don't know how far they went with this, but i think that the choices will be harder and that it will be easier to be DS, like DSluke said. An interesting topic btw. However, I want a truely seductive reason for following the DS path. I remember when I was facing Bastie at the temple and listened to her talk. Despite the fact that she sounded bitter and angry, I could understand what she was talking about. Yeah, I could get the fact that "The jedi council betrayed you once" "they're using you as a puppet" blah blah blah. But I didn't want to go mad with power (like all sith seem to do ) I wanted to look at it like I understood it; like I had a horrible grudge against the council and I wanted to know who I really was. That is the lure of the darkside... You think you can controle it, you don't want to be the "coucils puppet", you want to be your own master and that you don't want so much power. But once you go the dark path you will want more and more power and to be the strongest of them all! This is the way of the dark side, therefore the way of the Sith and dark jedi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSLuke Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Maybe in the situation where your party is split uo. You could receive a vision through the Force (like Luke in ESB) and sense that some of them are in danger. You could then decide whether you will help them or not. Maybe if you help them all the time your padawan is angry at you for not trusting him etc. Many interesting situations can be achieved by doing so. And by the light of the moon He prays for their beauty not doom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumquatq3 Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 For this to happen, there will probably have to be instances where your character is faced with a situation where someone he cares about is in danger and the only way to save them is to go "psycho" on the enemy, tapping in to the Dark Side, or where someone you care about has been hurt and you unleash the Dark Side in a fury of rage (like Anakin did to the Sand People who killed his mother). Yea, I thought that might be one of the only decetn ways to pull this off, but thats a one trick poney. You can't keep putting the player in that position all damn game. At the same time, it's not going to really "tempt" anyone too much. I mean, people will most likely see right throught it. If I set out to play a LS jedi, I'm prolly going to do the "right thing" without feeling to much pull. I like the idea of having more temptation, but I don't see how it can be done with out over-kill on the drama, a unbalanced path for the DS, or resorting to "tricks" EDIT: Tyrell talked of so much temptation it's almost impossible to be good, but at the end of the day people won't have much problem staying on the LS no matter what you hit them with (unless you effectively "trick" the player) because: 1. It's a video game. No temptation will beat your want to play through a certain path. 2. You know you can always play the game a different way again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSLuke Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Well the game could place you in a situation where if you choose the quick and easy path of the DS then you will very soon be rewarded, whereas if you choose LS you will be tortured to achieve something. I.e getting inside a Sith base would be much easier and you wouldn't have to kill anyone if you were a Sith. And by the light of the moon He prays for their beauty not doom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
random evil guy Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 I'm worried that there won't be any motives to be a DS person. I mean naturally there is a motive to be good. The Jedi is near extinct, republic on their knees.....there is a motive for you to be good and stop this. Just like in KOTOR. See my plan is for TSL the first time around is to play through it first as a DS person unlike in KOTOR how I went through first as a LS person. When I play DS I want to to be something similar to what Anakin Skywalker goes through. I don't want to be DS because I choose to "bully" a person **** like that. I want to face temptations. It was too easy to be bad in KOTOR. But for Anakin it wasn't easy being bad. In TSL I want it to be where Obsidian is almost trying to "force-feed" us to be bad with the intent of us trying to be good but just seeming near impossible cause there is just so much temptation. In KOTOR instead we were force-feed to be good and had to "try" to be bad. It shouldn't be that way. In college you want to get good grades and study but there is those temptations like parties and **** like that that gets in the way. Get what I'm saying. So in other words in TSL I want to be the "Tragic Anti-Hero" not the bully of the galaxy. I know Obsidian has promised that things like this has been fixed, but who else here sees the way I see? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> you want to be like anakin? whining your way through the galaxy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumquatq3 Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Well the game could place you in a situation where if you choose the quick and easy path of the DS then you will very soon be rewarded, whereas if you choose LS you will be tortured to achieve something. I.e getting inside a Sith base would be much easier and you wouldn't have to kill anyone if you were a Sith. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Doesn't that unbalance the game then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSLuke Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 What do you mean? And by the light of the moon He prays for their beauty not doom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumquatq3 Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 What do you mean? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Think about it/ If you give the DS player a "quick and easy path" and make the LS player wade through **** and enemies what effect would that have on game balance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSLuke Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 To annoy LSers and force them to be DS Seriously, it would fulfil what Yoda said about DS being the EASY and QUICK path. Being a LSer means that you will have to work for it, IMO anyway. And by the light of the moon He prays for their beauty not doom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kumquatq3 Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Seriously, it would fulfil what Yoda said about DS being the EASY and QUICK path. Being a LSer means that you will have to work for it, IMO anyway. Unfortunatly Yoda didn't have the foresight to predict the effect that might have on an RPG Not to meantion how lame it would be to breeze throught he game as the DS, untill the final boss of course, where the LS player who had been getting extra EXP is much more prepared and breezes through the boss. Scaling can only do so much without becoming cheap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosbjerg Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 What do you mean? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Think about it/ If you give the DS player a "quick and easy path" and make the LS player wade through **** and enemies what effect would that have on game balance? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> true .. but for a roleplayer you would like to make an descent to DS, where you "think" you are making a good decision and it end up being very bad .. Even though you can see right through it it will still be an enjoyable experiance .. Fortune favors the bald. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrell Posted November 19, 2004 Author Share Posted November 19, 2004 Well there is many replies to this subject so on my side some against and some between. I know it doesn't HAVE to be like Anakin Skywalker but there has to be a deeper motive of going DS besides stealing credits and such. The darkside is supposed to be the quick and easier path. Take Manaan as an example. When you had to choice to either to destroy the generator thing (LS) or poison the water (DS). When you poisened the water it wasn't really anything evil but it was the quick and easier path. I like the way that was handled...you are turning evil without even knowing what you did was evil until it actually hits you. I know I talk about temptation like this is real life and such, I know this is just a videogame btu I just want things to be more balanced. When I played KOTOR as LS I felt like I had a purpose and I felt like I had something driving me. When playing DS I didn't really feel like I had a purpose to be DS other then just to see the 2nd of the two endings. When doing DS choices I didn't really feel like I needed to do that I was always like "I just did that so that I can get DS points." See where I'm going? Do you think Darth Maul turned evil cause he stole credits from people? What about PlayMoreConsoles TheForce.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHutt Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 There is temptation to be DS... I mean who wouldn't want to be apart of the strongest power in the galaxy and cruch the last jedi remaining. DS temptations are about greed and power which is why people often take that route. And your right there is the LS temptation of being in a great struggle and outnumbered wherever you go. There is temptation on both sides... and perhaps where temptation lacks, curiosity leads the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSLuke Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 Well there is many replies to this subject so on my side some against and some between. I know it doesn't HAVE to be like Anakin Skywalker but there has to be a deeper motive of going DS besides stealing credits and such. The darkside is supposed to be the quick and easier path. Take Manaan as an example. When you had to choice to either to destroy the generator thing (LS) or poison the water (DS). When you poisened the water it wasn't really anything evil but it was the quick and easier path. I like the way that was handled...you are turning evil without even knowing what you did was evil until it actually hits you. I know I talk about temptation like this is real life and such, I know this is just a videogame btu I just want things to be more balanced. When I played KOTOR as LS I felt like I had a purpose and I felt like I had something driving me. When playing DS I didn't really feel like I had a purpose to be DS other then just to see the 2nd of the two endings. When doing DS choices I didn't really feel like I needed to do that I was always like "I just did that so that I can get DS points." See where I'm going? Do you think Darth Maul turned evil cause he stole credits from people? What about <{POST_SNAPBACK}> No idea how Maul turned bad.... And by the light of the moon He prays for their beauty not doom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GarethCarrots Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 his terrible teeth led him to believe that the jedi order were tampering with his food, so he went to the plaque protection side of the force to get revenge, little did he know that this was the one true path to faster decay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSLuke Posted November 19, 2004 Share Posted November 19, 2004 his terrible teeth led him to believe that the jedi order were tampering with his food, so he went to the plaque protection side of the force to get revenge, little did he know that this was the one true path to faster decay <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Isn't that Sidious you just described? And by the light of the moon He prays for their beauty not doom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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