US Presidential Elections - 2024 edition

[BruceVC]

10 hours ago, uuuhhii said:

even 5 percent of project 2025 will change the world forever

great depression drag half of the world down with it

this time global economy are far more connected

effect will be felt anywhere someone can buy canned food

And again can you give examples of what you mean?

 

Project 2025 is 900 page document, Im interested in what you think Trump will implement that will impact the entire  world and could even create another great depression?

Just 2-3 examples for clarity and be specific?

[rjshae]

Election ad spending in the US is $10 billion this year. Yep, we spent more than DJT's net worth on this circus. Fun times.

[BruceVC]

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4956319-trump-says-hell-let-rfk-jr-go-wild-on-health-and-food-in-potential-second-term/

This is a few days old 

"Former President Trump said Sunday that he would let Robert F. Kennedy Jr. “go wild” in dealing with issues related to food, medicine and health in a potential second administration. I’m going to let him go wild on health. I’m going to let him go wild on the food. I’m going to let him go wild on the medicines,” Trump told supporters at Madison Square Garden.  " 

@Lexx   This is a good example of how Trump could really harm and erode a US institution like health. Put  an anti-vaxxer in charge 

Its so absurd you must laugh 

 

[Lexx]

Nah, can't laugh about this anymore. It was funny like 5 years ago, now it's just sad.

[Malcador]

https://apnews.com/article/musk-million-sweepstakes-lottery-pennsylvania-krasner-4f683c48eb7dcc57f183e54ef16e7320

The grift never quits

[rjshae]

Meanwhile, prepare to have more cavities and rotten teeth for your kids:

Robert F. Kennedy Jr. says Donald Trump would seek to remove fluoride from water if elected

 

[Hurlshort]

2 hours ago, rjshae said:

Meanwhile, prepare to have more cavities and rotten teeth for your kids:

Robert F. Kennedy Jr. says Donald Trump would seek to remove fluoride from water if elected

 

Thankfully it is typically done on a local level, not a federal level, so it's unlikely that these two will have much power over such things. Which I'm going to repeat, is a big reason to worry less about the Presidential outcome and more about your local measures

[Also gorgon]

Don't vote for the orangutan guys.

[rjshae]

7 hours ago, Hurlshort said:

Thankfully it is typically done on a local level, not a federal level, so it's unlikely that these two will have much power over such things. Which I'm going to repeat, is a big reason to worry less about the Presidential outcome and more about your local measures

Yes, if it happens it is more likely to occur in red states. Georgia, Kentucky, and Nebraska have bills in the works to ban the practice of floridating the water supply. They should provide useful political experiments.

[BruceVC]

https://www.democracydocket.com/news-alerts/california-governor-signs-law-to-ban-local-voter-id-requirements/

I initially assumed this was fake news but its real and I dont understand why California would pass a law specifically making it illegal around voter id requirements?

This is the  story and justification below 

 

" California Gov. Gavin Newsom (D) signed a bill into law on Thursday that bars local governments from enacting laws to require residents to show a valid form of identification in order to vote. 

 " The right to freely cast your vote is the foundation of our democracy and Huntington Beach’s voter ID policy flies in the face of this principle,” Bonta said in a statement at the time the lawsuit was filed. “State election law already contains robust voter ID requirements with strong protections to prevent voter fraud, while ensuring that every eligible voter can cast their ballot without hardship. Imposing unnecessary obstacles to voter participation disproportionately burdens low-income voters, voters of color, young or elderly voters, and people with disabilities.”

But  what stops  someone pretending to be someone they not and how do you vote? I assume you need to be registered which requires your ID and proof of citizenship and then you  arrive on the day to vote. But how do you then confirm you are the person. Does California use a voters role?

@Hurlshort

I assume you understand this logic?

 

[Gorth]

1 minute ago, BruceVC said:

I assume you understand this logic?

I know it wasn't directed at me, but you don't have to use more than a couple of the grey cells to figure out its a reverse uno on the law that introduced id requirements. Unregistered and illegal migrants can vote if ID isn't required (and they usually vote democratic). Same shenanigans when people in power resort to gerrymandering (i.e. vote rigging) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerrymandering

[BruceVC]

4 minutes ago, Gorth said:

I know it wasn't directed at me, but you don't have to use more than a couple of the grey cells to figure out its a reverse uno on the law that introduced id requirements. Unregistered and illegal migrants can vote if ID isn't required (and they usually vote democratic). Same shenanigans when people in power resort to gerrymandering (i.e. vote rigging) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerrymandering

I honestly dont understand how you can vote without ID as confirmation of who you are 

 

In  South Africa we have a voters role and you first need to register on that and then on the day you vote you need to produce a form of acceptable ID which they check against the voters role. And then you get a permanent mark, for a few days,  on your thumb and  then you vote. It has some criticism but its a good system and ensures legitimacy around our voting system but it does require identification on the day you cast your vote 

How would this work in California specifically? Do they have a voters role and then do you just arrive and say " Im person X " and you can vote

The article mentions " State election law already contains robust voter ID requirements with strong protections to prevent voter fraud"

What Im asking is " what robust voter ID requirements " if you dont need to produce an ID on the day you vote 

Im sure Im misunderstanding it which is why Im looking for clarity?

 

 

 

[ShadySands]

It's a solution to a problem that literally doesn't exist and any extra burdens you start adding have a chilling effect, especially on the groups mentioned.

Plus our country has a history of this kind of thing so it's just a new spin on an old classic.

 

[BruceVC]

Just now, ShadySands said:

It's a solution to a problem that literally doesn't exist and any extra burdens you start adding have a chilling effect, especially on the groups mentioned.

Plus our country has a history of this kind of thing so it's just a new spin on an old classic.

 

Thats fine but that doesn't answer my question 

Does California use a voters role and if you arrive on the day to vote do you just need to say  " Im person X " and then they just confirm your name on the voters role and you can vote?

And if thats true how do you get into the voters role? Do you not need ID for that 

[Lexx]

13 hours ago, Malcador said:

https://apnews.com/article/musk-million-sweepstakes-lottery-pennsylvania-krasner-4f683c48eb7dcc57f183e54ef16e7320

The grift never quits

"“We’re going to be awarding a million dollars randomly to people who have signed the petition every day from now until the election,” Musk vowed."

"Musk’s lawyers said the winners are paid spokespeople and not chosen by chance" literally what.

How can this even exist. Please someone tell me that nobody actually falls for this.

Edited November 5 by Lexx

[ShadySands]

2 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

To register online you will need

 

Your California driver license or California identification card number,

The last four digits of your social security number and

Your date of birth.

Your information will be provided to the California Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) to retrieve a copy of your DMV signature.

 

If you do not have a California driver license or California identification card, you can still use this form to apply to register to vote. However, you will need to take additional steps to complete your voter registration.

How to get on the voter roll.

[BruceVC]

4 minutes ago, ShadySands said:

How to get on the voter roll.

Thanks and this is relevant and makes sense

But now on the day of voting, I am registered to vote and I arrive to vote. My name is on the voters role but I dont need to produce ID as confirmation of  that person?

Whats stopping me saying " Im Hurlshot and voting Trump" 

I realize this would not apply to many people but it just seems like such an unusual way of  not ensuring basic voting credibility? 

 

 

[ShadySands]

I have no idea what they do when they arrive in person as I've never voted in California but I think they get mostly get their ballots mailed to them and then they mail them back or have drop boxes like we do in Colorado. But please, please refer to my first post.

Do you really think hundreds of thousands or millions of illegal immigrants, for the first time ever, are going to put themselves under extra scrutiny and risk serious charges from the government just to go vote? While also having at least the names of just as many people who registered but they know aren't going to show up to vote, otherwise they'd be found out real quick, in a state where it doesn't even matter? 

Why is this an issue? Is it the principle of the thing or something? I don't get it but I'm genuinely curious. It has never happened in recent history and I have no idea about the beforefore times but I doubt it.

If this is now moving to the swing states next then I'm out because please read my first post.

 

Edited November 5 by ShadySands

[BruceVC]

11 minutes ago, ShadySands said:

I have no idea what they do when they arrive as I've never voted in California but please, please refer to my first post.

Do you really think hundreds of thousands or millions of illegal immigrants, for the first time ever, are going to put themselves under extra scrutiny and risk serious charges from the government just to go vote? While also having at least the names of just as many people who registered but they know aren't going to show up to vote, otherwise they'd be found out real quick, in a state where it doesn't even matter? 

Why is this an issue? Is it the principle of the thing or something? I don't get it but I'm genuinely curious. It has never happened in recent history and I have no idea about the before times but I doubt it.

If this is now moving to the swing states xt then I'm out because please read my first post.

 

Its not an unusual voting requirement to have ID checks on the day of voting, I always assumed this was normal and I am sure if you ask anyone on this thread who votes outside the US they are required to produce ID. But I might be wrong and maybe its not expected in other countries?

I see there are several states that dont require ID checks 

https://thehill.com/homenews/4969868-states-require-aid-vote-in-person/

The remaining states and Washington, D.C., do not require any documentation to vote at the polls:

• California
• Hawaii
• Illinois
• Maine
• Maryland
• Massachusetts
• Minnesota
• Nevada
• New Jersey
• New Mexico
• New York
• Pennsylvania
• Vermont

Its not about principle. ID verification is used to check  you are who you say you are  on the voters roll 

Its one way to ensure  you dont have a  type of  voting fraud 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lexx]

So, how many hours until we know who won?

[BruceVC]

57 minutes ago, Lexx said:

So, how many hours until we know who won?

As usual it could take several days, especially if its close and swing states take there time 

Do you need to produce ID verification to vote in Germany?

[Lexx]

18 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

As usual it could take several days

Noooo, just let it end already.

 

18 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

Do you need to produce ID verification to vote in Germany?

You should have it with you, but I never needed to show it. You have a slip of paper with a number on it, your name, address, and the location where you go to vote. You bring that there, they check their lists, mark you down, then you get the voting paper, walk to a booth, fill it out, deliver it back, done.

[BruceVC]

29 minutes ago, Lexx said:

Noooo, just let it end already.

 

You should have it with you, but I never needed to show it. You have a slip of paper with a number on it, your name, address, and the location where you go to vote. You bring that there, they check their lists, mark you down, then you get the voting paper, walk to a booth, fill it out, deliver it back, done.

And the slip of paper with the number is that  a print out linked to the voters role?

And I assume it doesnt have a photo so you could also theoretically be someone else than the actual person?

[Lexx]

Sure, anyone can go with it. But if they ask for your ID and it doesn't match, you're f'd.

[Also gorgon]

If you wanted exacting ID checks for voting, a drivers license or a passport would have to be free. If it isn't, then you have just excluded people living in poverty from voting.  This is a common republican tactic, putting up extra barriers with a specific demographic in mind. Of course illegal immigrants can't vote.