Troller
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Posts posted by Troller
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What made the Stamina/Health system so well designed in Darklands was that they were actually your Attributes in Endurance and Strength.
The Attributes were used for a variety of mechanics, such as encumbrance, weapon requirements and the like. It was a system in which getting hurt meant more than decreasing numbers, it also affected your ability to be effective. There were several levels of encumbrance, reducing your Agility and your Attack Speed, while Strength modified your ability to wield weapons effectively (like in Fallout).
The end result was a system that was able to accurately simulate the effects of getting injured and/or fatigued without having having to create additional systems (ala Dragon Age's crappy injury system). The beauty of it was in how everything was interrelated and how well it was geared towards simulation. That's why regeneration works. Because Health/Stamina are more than just numbers, the influence those stats carry goes far beyond whether a character is alive, unconscious, or dead. Over time, you regained Endurance and Strength. You healed from injuries and from fatigue. As you regained Strength and Endurance, the burdens of carrying your equipment were not as debilitating. Your ability to wield weapons with the same force as before your injuries returned. MicroProse knew exactly what the **** they were doing when they made Darklands.
I certainly hope that Josh Sawyer puts the same kind of thought into the systems of Project Eternity as the ones that were in Darklands. But if there's a developer outside the original team who I'd trust to get it done, it would be Sawyer.
But for those of you who are potting it as "instant regen" or "health jr." or "streamlining" or some such nonsense, I suggest you actually play and understand the game he references as inspiration before you make such off the mark statements.
Getting damaged = getting weaker at everything else doesn't sound appealing to me.
but its how it works in real life, try to get shot in the stomach and then go about your day, going to school, or working, it all becomes much harder!
Yeah, in real life you also don't regenerate the organs back after being shot in the stomach.
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Man when I hear level scaling I think about common bandits and goblins with power armor and daedric weapons, but I bet obsidian wont do that.
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We should get a Witcher or Hexer class
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I'm for.
While I could generally go both ways, and handing out xp "the old way" wouldn't be a deal breaker for me, I like the idea of having alternative ways of completing objectives, and making it less about murdering the countryside. That, and it's usually a pain to balance "murder everyone" against some sort of "killed nobody" xp bonus achievement at the end of a quest (not to mention the motivation of sneaking through a quest to get the "killed nobody" xp bonus, and THEN murder everyone on your way out, to get both.
).I'll be interested in seeing how they pull it off.
hahaha hell yeah man, I do that in all games
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Just dont save man, what the hell, or hire someone to watch you, and pay him to punch you everytime you do
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What made the Stamina/Health system so well designed in Darklands was that they were actually your Attributes in Endurance and Strength.
The Attributes were used for a variety of mechanics, such as encumbrance, weapon requirements and the like. It was a system in which getting hurt meant more than decreasing numbers, it also affected your ability to be effective. There were several levels of encumbrance, reducing your Agility and your Attack Speed, while Strength modified your ability to wield weapons effectively (like in Fallout).
The end result was a system that was able to accurately simulate the effects of getting injured and/or fatigued without having having to create additional systems (ala Dragon Age's crappy injury system). The beauty of it was in how everything was interrelated and how well it was geared towards simulation. That's why regeneration works. Because Health/Stamina are more than just numbers, the influence those stats carry goes far beyond whether a character is alive, unconscious, or dead. Over time, you regained Endurance and Strength. You healed from injuries and from fatigue. As you regained Strength and Endurance, the burdens of carrying your equipment were not as debilitating. Your ability to wield weapons with the same force as before your injuries returned. MicroProse knew exactly what the **** they were doing when they made Darklands.
I certainly hope that Josh Sawyer puts the same kind of thought into the systems of Project Eternity as the ones that were in Darklands. But if there's a developer outside the original team who I'd trust to get it done, it would be Sawyer.
But for those of you who are potting it as "instant regen" or "health jr." or "streamlining" or some such nonsense, I suggest you actually play and understand the game he references as inspiration before you make such off the mark statements.
Getting damaged = getting weaker at everything else doesn't sound appealing to me.
but its how it works in real life, try to get shot in the stomach and then go about your day, going to school, or working, it all becomes much harder!
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I mean the forum man, RPG Codex, its a decent forum, where they discuss RPG, and hate people like me
hahaha
we should probably take this to PM if you want to keep going, or soon the mods will force us hahah
Have to say the mods have been EXTREMELY lenient on this matter, I personally would've at least stopped the discussion inside the update #24 thread.
Yeah lets stop discussions, I mean why would you want discussions in a forum??
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LOL, and I was liking all your posts!
are you from the Codex?
No. I'm not interested in a codex.
I mean the forum man, RPG Codex, its a decent forum, where they discuss RPG, and hate people like me
hahaha
we should probably take this to PM if you want to keep going, or soon the mods will force us hahah
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LOL, and I was liking all your posts!
are you from the Codex?
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IMHO, if you're not willing to engage in combat if you don't get that xp bonus shows a lot more problems. The whole point of a game is to engage you, and the main form of that engagement is having fun. If the combat isn't enjoyable enough on it's own to warrant doing it for it's own sake that's a problem. And even if that's weak the looting system and making sure that at least the currency you get from the loot is meaningful and worth having should pick up the slack. I think the backlash of "I trust what they're doing" is from that if you need xp to enjoy combat and the game overall there are so many more problems than simply the xp system. There's plenty of ways to break the Pavlovian addiction to see that xp number go up without making combat less meaningful, enjoyable and rewarding.
The combat we are expecting for P:E is a hard combat, with tough enemies, and difficult tactical decisions. Its only natural that after the hard work of defeating your enemies, you get a reward, thats how it works in real life too, you work hard, you get money, you get women, you get friends.
That has always been how an RPG is played, some people dont like to grind, I personally think it can be boring, but it should be rewarded, because its only natural that those who spend more time doing something, become better at it, than others who are just delivering bread to the old lady next door.
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Wait, did I forbid you to have an opinion? It's a free country...
not really that free, usually the rights of someone ends where the feelings of others begin, that`s a rule for most internet forums...
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Since you're probably not competent enough to find it on your own and would rather sneak past it, here it is:
http://forums.obsidi...illing-enemies/
"Would you like experience to be rewarded for killing enemies?"
(285 member(s) have cast votes)
Yes (96 votes [33.68%])
Yes, but only a small amount to favour other aspects of the game than combat (86 votes [30.18%])
Yes, but only for big fights like boss battles (25 votes [8.77%])
Yes, so long as the number of enemies in the game is fixed thereby fixing total combat experience (12 votes [4.21%])
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No = (66 votes [23.16%])
OH! That crowd was not so HardKOre like the ME2 quest-xp-only crowd.
(printscreen'd)
hahaha I remember I thought it was so lame I voted "NO" just joking, I bet a lot of people who voted no thought the same.
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I voted for. It'll give me more of a reason to explore the world better.
I agree bro, there's no better incentive to explore areas full of monsters that want to kill you than awarding no xp for killing them.
Man, I cant wait to go through a cave full of monsters and almost kill all my party for no reason at all
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When its 1 billion hours long
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what if my character just wants to kill everyone, how will i get XP THen this is unnaceptable!!!
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dude all I`m saying is that This is the biggest bull**** ive heard here so far, not getting XP for killing stuff??
Its outrageous
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Just saying, you all are making a mistake here, this isn`t call of duty where you can kill thousand of soldiers and never get anything, an rpg since the dawn of time awarded players for their hard work(grinding for monsters for example) now if they do it in P:E in a way that if you kill monsters you get no XP, what is the point of killing them? i will just make a stealth or diplomatic build then...
The point is that you may find the combat approach to be the most enjoyable one.
....just as the stealth junkies play the stealthy way because it's the most enjoyable way for them.
....just as the speech junkies play the speechy way because it's the most enjoyable way for them.
If no one finds the combat solution to be the most enjoyable, then the problem is entirely nothing to do with the XP system, but because the combat mechanics turned out to be unfun and should be redesigned.
about the first junkie part, that really depends on the game. The rest yeah I agree, but still its not just about fun, say you are playing a Paladin guy, and there is this evil rapist necrophile pedophile dude that eats children for breakfest cannibal too, your character would do anything to kill him, then you go kill him and you get no XP??? RPGS arent just about fun IMO, its about roleplaying a character, its like real life, you might hate to live, but you still go on, or you suicide maybe...
WTTFFFF
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Just saying, you all are making a mistake here, this isn`t call of duty where you can kill thousand of soldiers and never get anything, an rpg since the dawn of time awarded players for their hard work(grinding for monsters for example) now if they do it in P:E in a way that if you kill monsters you get no XP, what is the point of killing them? i will just make a stealth or diplomatic build then...
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hahaha man I wonder if they might argue and fight during the game, that would be cool
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HAHAAHAHA SOMEONE ASK HOW MUCH AVELLONE BENCH PRESS PLS
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Ive noticed this in Fallout New Vegas, you faced some tough enemies, and they give very low XP points, to balance this out, like in the Deathclaw part in the cement manufacturer, there were some very small deathclaw babies, that were easy to kill, but awarded the same XP as the bigger ones.
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Best way to improve your combat skills is doing combat, if you kill something, your combat skills improve, unless its like a little kid or a little dog or a baby.
Actually, XP is an abstraction, unless you are dealing with "learn by doing" systems like the one used in Oblivion and other TES games.
Yeah I know, maybe those systems are better than not getting xp for killing things :/
why change this, fallout BG 2 Torment, all had that and were great...
Try to go out into the street and get into a fights, or even just join a gym(that`s safer) and challenge some people, winning or losing, your fighting skills will most likely improve, you will get confidence, I used to fear a lot getting into conflicts, after years of martial training and sparring with people, your confidence improves a lot...
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Also what is the big deal of making a peaceful solution to a quest, then later killing everyone?
I always did that when I could in RPG`s, "degenerate gameplay" ? what the hell, isn`t the point of an rpg to be able to roleplay the character the way you want to?
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Best way to improve your combat skills is doing combat, if you kill something, your combat skills improve, unless its like a little kid or a little dog or a baby.
).
Big City #2- 3.5mil. stretch goal
in Pillars of Eternity: General Discussion (NO SPOILERS)
Posted
They should make the 4 mill stretch goal to ADD more 2 big cities, then we will see it going past 4 million maybe