kalimeeri
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Posts posted by kalimeeri
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17. Why were mining droids that had been reprogrammed to "mine" organics trying to kill T3-M4?
Was I the only one who believed that it was not a mining droid at all that got T3, but an HK? As in "HE just dumped you down the mining shaft?" That's how I remember it, anyway. It is a possibility.
Many of these questions address problems that have never happened to me, and might possibly be related to a specific setup or game. For instance, the sound crackling. An add-on card may handle things differently than onboard sound. It's all about the drivers, as it is with video. I have noted differences between my games on the same machine, however (glitches, etc) and I don't really know why this happens. But mileage may vary, and for me this type of thing isn't a game-killer as long as the story is good.
My thanks to the person who posted the cut Bao-Dur dialogue. So many of the passages (both in and out game) were beautifully written and characterized. I've replayed just to listen and appreciate. I think I'll remember that more than how many CTD's I had.
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I was very glad to see HK back, because he was one of my favorite characters from K1. In that game, he had a lot of fill-in-the-blanks backstory, delivered from a unique viewpoint. I particularly enjoyed how the term 'meatbag' came to stay in his vocabulator. He was needed for his translation abilities.
He wasn't as funny this time, although his exposition role was basically the same and much harder to get to as a LS PC. His contribution to the party effort, unfortunately, landed on the cutting-room floor, and the story suffered as a result.
I'd expect/hope to see him in K3. If HK was only memory-wiped instead of dismantled, Revan had a reason.
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Atris admits to having all the Jedi advertisement and bounty stuff which follows you all over the game, but I guess one question is why you?
Well, I can understand that she feels you're dispensable (sp?), but how did she know you weren't already assassinated?
or why not use say Bastila instead?
(I don't think she'd use one of the Jedi Masters though)
In the case of a male PC at least, she felt she was 'a woman scorned'. There were some strong feelings from the past hinted at between the two. She wanted you hung, drawn and quartered at your trial, and one of the masters told her to watch her personal feelings. This was her payback, and it made sense. I don't know how they handled it for a female.
I'm sure she had access to the coreward databases as an historian, and apparently she enjoyed herself spamming your name all over them to make sure you were easy to find. I think it was HK who mentioned finding it there. She would be monitoring to be sure any reference to herself and Telos was deleted. Passenger manifests would probably be among those records (Harbinger) she scanned.
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You get different forms with the different prestige classes. Jedi Masters get force forms while Watchmen and Weapon masters get different lightsabre forms.
Noticed this difference, too, but I think there is some other factor involved. Maybe it has something to do with the level you are at the time. My Consular got lightsaber forms from the first two masters, then a Force form from Vrook. My daughter's Consular got three lightsaber forms, just as my Guardian and Sentinels always have. But I don't think it really matters what you get from the Masters, because the leveling up process fills in the blanks.
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It's difficult to pick a 'favorite' planet, because there are so many different considerations. All in all, the game did a good job of making the worlds feel different from each other, in regards to culture and atmosphere. But it's almost impossible to compare them, because they reflect the type of colony they are--the space stations are a mixture of races and develop no character of their own, the mining colony has a specific purpose, etc. Malachor is just plain eerie, and since its largest population share is held by ghosts, I don't consider it a 'planet' in the same sense.
If you're talking about the number of quests, definitely Nar Shaddaa. It is also way up there in terms of atmosphere. A seedy, smelly, ugly place, all of the sentients grasping for power and money, humans the minority (and comparatively weak to other species). The dumpster of the universe, where most people are stuck because there's noplace lower to fall. I don't like it, but that's probably because it reminds me too much of places I've been in RL. So I guess that means as a planet, it was a success.
BTW--did anybody else try to forcibly rescue the kidnapped daughter, then immediately want to put her back the second she opened her mouth? And how about that faithful husband? Tell him he should give up, and he laughs and runs off, happy as a clam.
" Onderon represents a proud culture in danger of having its individuality absorbed by the Republic. But while his heart is in the right place in defending and preserving that, Vaklu is being extremely short-sighted. No planet can survive as an island unto itself; they would be among the first to fall to any threat, and no one would care. As young and arrogantly annoying as she is, Talia is right.
Seeing Dantooine and Korriban again was nice. They've changed ... but yet they haven't. (Even in terms of an ATI graphics card). It's a nice turnaround that we're using the Matale estate as a government center. I know this place!
The restoration zones on Telos' surface are extremely beautiful and interesting. The message is hope, with the mercs and Czerka representing a very real threat.
But my vote has to go to Dxun. That's where I go to rest up. It's easy on the eyes (especially after Nar Shaddaa!), its sense of history powerful and compelling. I want to explore, and dig out more of its secrets. But at the same time, it's a place of the past, and it would be easy to get stuck living there. Like the Mandalorians.
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Just a thought, but which character did you pick to lead the party? When my party entered Freedon Nadd's tomb I had chosen Mira as the party leader when assembling the party on Dxun. The full party was Mira (sentinel), Disciple (consular) and Mandalore. Mira was the only party member in my group that would attempt to access the DS energy fields. I have to assume that it was because she was the party leader.
That was rather funny actually, as she apparently tried to converse with someone who wasn't there when I tried to click on the energy field. Perhaps the devs never considered the possibility that someone would choose her to lead the party into the tomb. Rather odd, as she's one of the only four that you can choose.
I don't think it's necessarily restricted to the party leader. I usually take Mandalore, Bao-Dur (Jedi), with Visas leading. Visas has stepped up to the plate, and so has Bao-Dur. I'm approaching that point in my latest game, so maybe I'll try taking Atton and Mira if I'm feeling brave this time, just to see what happens.
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Yeah, I never got her to talk about Atris. As long as she's a Jedi, you're all set.
For my games, she talked about Atris for a while, then all of a sudden started refusing to discuss her. I figured it was her own jealousy getting in the way.
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Neither. That's the whole point of K2.
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KotOR had around 14 such interactions, depending on whether you include brief exchanges like the one between HK-47 and T3-M4 in the Korriban academy. How many does TSL have?
There are a few, but you don't even see them unless you have those particular people in your party in a certain place. Fr'instance, the brief interaction between Visas and Handmaiden at the entrance to the Korriban academy, or the one between Atton and Handmaiden as they discuss how best to deal with Davik on Nar Shaddaa. Most of the serious disagreements between NPC's occur on Ebon Hawk.
I too miss the spontaneous interruptions of the NPC's in K1 ... felt sorry for Revan when Mission just would not shut up. They added sparkle, lightened the tone. But then, Exile has a more serious personality than Revan; he/she went through some really rough times because of it. Stuff just rolled off Revan.
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There is also an Influence Guide available online which points out some of the places and situations where each party member will be affected. It's not all-inclusive, as I've found others, but it gives you a basic idea who you might want to take along in your party at various locations.
Depending on your class, Handmaiden can be easy or difficult. My Sentinels have found her a handful, but neither the Guardian nor the Consular had much trouble. Not sure why, unless NPC stats are generated randomly each game.
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Malachor V, without a doubt. Nothing matches it for the sheer echo of all of those lives that were lost in one act of horrible violence.
Dxun has mixed signals, reflecting the hopes of the Mandalorians as well as the Republic assault. Nadd's tomb is there, but nobody really knew it. If they felt its presence, it was only very faintly. Dantooine was a smaller, more isolated planet, and while it was bombed extensively, the Jedi there had some warning. It seems just empty and sad now, faintly echoing of past glory and quietly testifying to its own destruction.
Star Forge was a very powerful place, I agree, but it seemed nullified without the presence of a strong leader. It's more a DS device than an entity. The deaths it is responsible for occurred as a result of its use, but distantly. It didn't destroy the Rakatan--they built it, then destroyed themselves. Malak was able to use it, but was not as strong in the Force as Revan. Output dropped drastically. And with both Malak and Revan gone, it stopped completely, becoming just another echo. Assuming that it still exists (I thought I blew it up), or that another one does, it waits passively.
Korriban is much the same. It bears a strong DS taint, but it's empty. The most powerful souls, such as Ajunta Pall, are gone. The less powerful ones function on an elemental level, stirring the Hssiss but little more. What DS influence remains responds to strong Force users and attempts to claim them, so it will always be dangerous. But the violence on its surface just petered out, as the Sith students fought amongst themselves and the Masters fled.
Malachor is alive with death. The shadow generator not only instantaneously crushed every living being on the surface, but it pulled the orbiting ships and their crews down into it, too. The Force was not stripped away, as it was from Katarr; it was trapped. It reaches out so strongly that anything within earshot can't help but be affected. It's anger and fear and pain incarnate.
The rest of the choices are just silly.
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I'd pay for another copy, if it was released in all its intended glory. There are games that are throw-aways, and there are those that are keepers. This one is a keeper.
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I find it odd that I have gotten no forms of any kind and I have even supposedly learned one from Vrook on Dantooine. I have always gotten them before; did I mess something up? Disciple doesn't have any either, but Visas has all the ones I should have learned. Did this happen to anyone else?
I have found that at times, the game doesn't level up as it's supposed to. Then sometimes it'll do it all at once. I don't know why.
You don't get as many Force Forms as Weaponsmaster as you do with Consular, but you don't get the crap beat out of you, either. For all those who find it too easy, crank up 'hard' mode x 2 and try staying alive in that class. Definitely humbling ... but fun if you don't employ cheats. I've learned that I am not above using underhanded tricks on my opponents.
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All right, thanks for the help but I'm still stuck on Nar Shaddaa. What I really need to know is how you find Goto so that I can get on with the main quest.
Trust me. He will find you. You can pay some folks to spread a bad 'rep' for you, but I've never had to waste the credits. Get all your quests done elsewhere, do the Refugee Quad, and hang onto something when you come back out.
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Vrook was no Jedi. He enjoyed his power too much, and refused to consider that anyone else might have a valid point. The signs of this are apparent even in K1, although not so pronounced. But it's not hard to imagine the pleasure he got out of turning Revan back on himself. A little payback for flaunting his authority.
Even when Exile was a padawan, Vrook perceived another threat to his power. People flocked to Exile, and they were listening and following, even in non-important issues. He did everything he could to block Exile's acceptance by the Order, without (apparently) alerting the rest of the Council to his personal motives.
This guy is almost too real. He will never be anything better. Kreia's Toaster was all the justice and redemption he earned, although if it had been employed much earlier, maybe the Jedi Order wouldn't have had to die so dramatically a la Revan.
Pretty good villain, though.
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I think her feelings for Exile were the crack in her armor. She was obviously as taken by the bonding aspect as many others, but to her it was very personal. She believed herself betrayed, and the dark side Holocrons appealed to her bitterness. Surrounded by their influence, she fell slowly farther and farther, without even realizing how she had changed. She had no Jedi around to compare herself to or to reinforce those teachings. Just the fact that she had surrounded herself by non-Jedi who catered to her every whim made her feel superior--something she needed because Exile's actions caused her to doubt herself.
Did she believe, as the Echani boasted, that she was the 'only' Jedi left? Yes. She knew of the continued existence of those Masters who had fled. But she believed them cowardly, wrong, and could not respect them as Jedi any longer. She had never felt she was comparable to Exile, but had finally bested him/her because of the non-Jedi status. Her strongly arrogant front was overkill, because she had dreamed of the day when she could tell Exile off, yet she still felt threatened.
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I got another new and very interesting conversation with HK which I'd never had before, although please note that I lost INF with him when I did it. This is with a Consular, so persuade may have some bearing.
I picked the choice, "I won't allow you to remain on the ship if you've killed Jedi." Which, if you're thinking about INF, you normally wouldn't choose.
I'm going to paraphrase here, from the best of my memory, so if you're interested in specifics, load a save game where you have some LS INF with HK. I got some INF by using Force Persuade on the gate guard at Onderon ... and lost it right afterward.
HK replies that you as Exile should think back and count how many Jedi YOU have killed, and then proceeds to tell you that Revan recognized that as a leader, you were able to inspire folks to do things that they normally would not. That after you left, Malak wanted to have you killed, but Revan would not allow it. He says that Revan expected and WANTED you to go back to the Jedi Council, because there was some power in parading a fallen leader in front of his people. Revan wanted to show them what the Jedi were capable of, and the cost. And he wanted Exile to see the hipocrasy that the Council was capable of, because he believed that they would not listen. HK assumes from your attitude and what happened afterward that this was indeed the case.
So it seems that Revan had a distinct plan for Exile to do what he is doing right now. And perhaps Kreia, as Revan's master and loyal follower, was charged with this duty, as Mandalore was charged with reuniting the Mandalorians, as Carth was charged with readying the Republic forces.
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Nah. It was a reference to Ulic Qel-Droma. As far as I know, he is the only Jedi/Sith to be blocked from the force. It was done so by his lover, Nomi Sunrider.
I think the Exile believed the Jedi responsible for stripping him. Kreia was stripped by Sion and Nihilus, apparently
Thanks for clearing that up. I don't believe they mentioned Ulic in connection with that, in the game, so it led to some confusion. Sometimes the little nuggets on the loading screens flash by a bit too fast on my setup, though, so I might've missed it. That's not bragging; occasionally a cutscene will break into the next without finishing, too.
Kreia said Nihilous was practically unable to control his power, so if anything, he would have killed her by doing his thing. (Like she did to the Jedi Masters)
Sion is the more likely of the pair. He likes causing pain, and nothing was more likely to make her suffer. She does say she was 'cast out, stripped of my power.' I assumed that meant her role as leader of the Malachor academy, but I see it could have other meanings as well.
Exile believed the Jedi responsible only because Kreia told him that. When he questions it, she says, "Who did you think was responsible?" He's just looking for answers, trying to understand what happened to him, and she manipulates the situation to her advantage. She wanted to give him a reason to find the remaining Jedi ... no sense wasting energy if you can get someone else to do it for you. Not to mention that she felt the struggle would strengthen her star pupil.
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Sorry, just the image this question brought up...
Bastila: "Look, no-eyes. You think that just because the Jedi were responsible for completely destroying your planet and all of the Miraluka men, that we owe you one of ours. Well, you're wrong. I got mine, now you run along and find yourself a nice little Wookie doll, 'cause you can't play in the big leagues. You want to see what 'Battle Meditation' REALLY is?. Oops, sorry, you can't. No eyes."
Visas: "Your life ... is mine."
Rrrrrooowwl... hiss.
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Priceless.
Here's hopin' that they ARE spoofs. But the title of the second one kinda sums that up.
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I understood it as a broken quest, you cant use the airspeeder for anything even if you do repair it? Correct?
BTW, It's no quest at all, never appears in the journal.
After repair you use it for quick transport (quite useless)
The main point is some XP and influence from Bao Dur...
The broken thing might inplicate that if you use the Speeder to get somewhere else before triggering the Ebon Hawk capture by the Red Eclipse, it won't trigger except if you run in that sector and run outside (easy to miss and then you're stuck...)
Actually, in every game I've done, the Red Eclipse triggers the instant I step back outside the refugee sector, which is a little annoying if I missed a quest earlier. The airspeeder lets you go anywhere from within the Refugee Sector, and not trigger the rapid events that follow until you're ready. That's helpful if you're fiddling with INF, since you can't change party members while inside the Refugee Sector.
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Basically, I voted 'why did they cut...' but I know the reasons. I just wish with all my heart that this character had been allowed to reach her potential. She was complex and interesting; I wanted to know more about her, and she would have added a lot more depth to the story. And one h** of an emotional ending possibility.
Atris knew that going to war was right, but she was afraid to buck the system. She remained politically correct, and rationalized away her conscience. But she always envied Exile for having the guts to do something she could not. Add to that the fact that she loved Exile and wanted him to stay with her, and you have the seeds of bitterness. She saw his leaving as an act of personal betrayal, of rejection as well as political suicide. So, when he returned, it was payback time for all his slights, real or imagined.
A good character, just one which could have been as great and memorable as Kreia. And IMO a needed contrast, showing Kreia as someone strong enough to ultimately rise above Fate.
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Kreia. Absolutely no contest.
The mix of DS and LS and life experience are just overwhelming. Bastila initially believed so strongly in Jedi teachings and was so naive that even the Council was able to manipulate her. She'd be chopped liver for Kreia. No grasp of the more subtle tactics.
Now, REVAN vs. Kreia ... that would be interesting, but I can never see it happening, due to their history and their bond.
Mira? How did she even get in the running? She may think she knows everything, but Nar Shaddaa is a long way from being the whole galaxy. Dead meat.
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Force Wound/Void and Force Bonds
in Star Wars: General Discussion
Posted
I think bonding is a critical part of the overall story. I'll put spoiler tags on, just for safety's sake.
Exile may be the key to the 'true Sith' problem.
Revan studied bonding extensively, according to Kreia. He created bonds by artificial means at Malachor, and turned Jedi into Sith.
He studied the Exile in particular, whether it is actually stated or not. HK says Revan mentioned Exile, specifically expressing that the bonding might be Exile's downfall. That leads to the conclusion that Exile naturally possesses an unusual affinity, and as such, would be an asset if properly used. Revan already did exactly that (per HK), and I don't think it's over yet. If Revan doesn't need his droids or his ship or can't chance the vulnerability of his party members, he's going to need SOME help. If he and Exile can convert enemies into allies...
Exile's other main attribute also plays a part. He cannot be easily detected because of the disconnection from the Force. A Jedi would be discovered and killed in short order, but the true Sith probably won't even see Exile coming.
And what more fitting way to get back at them than to use one of their own techniques against them? The 'wound in the Force' or the 'void' was their baby, but probably any of them who reached expert level self-destructed, like Kreia said Nihilous would eventually starve. Or maybe they haven't yet ... but they're looking to our galaxy to sustain themselves.
As far as the 'lethal' bond, no, I don't believe it exists or ever did. Kreia merely lied about it to get Exile to take her along.
None of the historians or Jedi Masters has ever heard of it, and in fact it is proven false in the end. There was some indication that an alignment change might break a bond, but Kreia didn't. She'd already been there and done that, both sides; she was staunchly neutral. At that point Exile's feelings about her probably hadn't changed extensively enough, either. Although she did some questionable stuff to his party, by now Exile knows she's a manipulator. She is still his teacher (both times). There was still a bond, and the only sure way to break it was for her to die. So she forced a stand-off, knowing Exile would have to defend himself. It was no big deal to her--IMO she was quite frail and her health was failing. But she held on so she could do this one last thing for Revan.
I don't know about taking Kreia's statement about killing the Force too literally. Since all life is connected through it, what would be the point? Her pal Revan is trying to fix the galaxy, not annihilate it. And what would be the point of creating a 'new order' of Jedi through Exile? She may be referring to destroying the way it's perceived and used, and the way it uses in return. She hates that it 'balances' the 'verse by war and killing, without care for the beings that are lost or what side they are on. She wants that power removed, to let choice be the deciding factor. That's why Exile is beautiful to her--he can live without the Force, and it is his choice whether to use it or not ... as a tool. But it doesn't control him. IMO it's the control she's trying to destroy, not the Force itself.