[Powerbuilding] Strongest builds that are still viable from beta?

[SaruNi]

Solo beckoner/ranger (any other than ghost heart) can have pet initiate combat while beckoner remains in stealth. Summoning and buffing doesn't break stealth....

[Sxsxarael]

Hm, flashy? I would take then Chanter/Melee multi. Chants are quite flashy, have a lot of good effects and Chanter combines great with melee. As for flashy melee.... Monks are quite flashy with their Torment Reach so maybe that? Paladins are also quite flashy with FOD and spells. Rogues too? So maybe one of those three combined with Chanter?

 

Very flashy is Fury Druid with elemental damage spells and combined with Paladin or Rogue.

 

I agree on Psyblade. Generally Soul Blade is most boring subclass in PoE2, all you do is click SA from time to time and this is whole reason to take that subclass- very bad design.

I was actually thinking of wizard/melee multiclass with wiz's conjure weapons I thought it would be flashy lol.

I will definitely try the builds you mentioned, thank you very much.

[Voltron]

If someone is interested I published a unofficial patch for Paladin (some minor tweaks for his weak-ass auras, FoD and nerfing Sacred Immolation self damage so its usable finally). Any feedback is welcomed as I tested it a little today but I want to finish my solo first on vanilla settings. I tried to make changes balanced: https://www.nexusmods.com/pillarsofeternity2/mods/15

[Sxsxarael]

Oh and what weapon should I use for a paladin/chanter build? Is it still dual wield?

Edited May 14, 2018 by Sxsxarael

[MadDemiurg]

Well, if you intend this to be a balance patch rather than just plain buffs:

 

-FoD needs no buffs, it's one of the better 1 resource pool abilities as is

-Eternal devotion buff (or rather un-nerf) is ok, it's inferior to shared flames now

-Base auras need no buffs except charge

-Exalted endurance doesn't need a buff, but the changes for charge/focus look good

-Greater lay of hands - no strong opinion, it should be decent enough with high int as is, but a small buff won't make it OP

-Sacred immolation - I would just reduce the self damage, aoe damage it does is quite alright

 

Also:

-Devotions of the faithful deserves a nerf, giving like 25% defenses less. It's way too strong now.

 

Some of the less useful paladin actives like abjuration or liberating exhortation could use a buff too.

Edited May 14, 2018 by MadDemiurg

[Voltron]

Well, if you intend this to be a balance patch rather than just plain buffs:

 

-FoD needs no buffs, it's one of the better 1 resource pool abilities as is

-Eternal devotion buff (or rather un-nerf) is ok, it's inferior to shared flames now

-Base auras need no buffs except charge

-Exalted endurance doesn't need a buff, but the changes for charge/focus look good

-Greater lay of hands - no strong opinion, it should be decent enough with high int as is, but a small buff won't make it OP

-Sacred immolation - I would just reduce the self damage, aoe damage it does is quite alright

 

Also:

-Devotions of the faithful deserves a nerf, giving like 25% defenses less. It's way too strong now.

 

Some of the less useful paladin actives like abjuration or liberating exhortation could use a buff too.

 

Thanks for feedback, though I disagree with base auras- base ones are imo useless. +1 Armor or +5 Accuracy are joke above level 5. Later on in game they are simply useless. As for FOD- you may be right. I will change later base dmg to what it was. Exalted Endurance 3 heal is weak per se, but I think Level IV should offer some more significant thing. But I get it, If more people will later agree I will change it to 4 HP per 3.0 sec. As for Sacred Immolation- while damage is decent, I think for Level VII + self damage spell 5 more dmg is fair increase. We talk about end-game here.

 

Thanks for feedback!!

Edited May 14, 2018 by Voltron

[MadDemiurg]

Speaking about auras - they are passive effects that affect the whole party. They're reasonably balanced in this regard, with the exception of the highly situational charge and upgrades to charge and zealous auras.

 

E.g. spirit shield gives +3 armor to self for limited duration and eats up a spell slot. +1 passive armor to the whole party is more than competitive with that. +3 would be OP. It's often hard to get mileage out of armor buffs now though, because it's a threshold stat. But it's more of an issue with the new terrible armor system than with the buff itself. +5 accuracy passive aoe is just pretty solid all around. Fighter's conqueror's stance gives +10 to self only.

 

As for sacred immolation - I think it already does solid damage with high might and some power levels and can hurt high level enemies pretty badly. Paladins are not supposed to be the best aoe blaster either. It just costs an unreasonable amount of health atm.

Edited May 14, 2018 by MadDemiurg

[Voltron]

Speaking about auras - they are passive effects that affect the whole party. They're reasonably balanced in this regard, with the exception of the highly situational charge and upgrades to charge and zealous auras.

 

E.g. spirit shield gives +3 armor to self for limited duration and eats up a spell slot. +1 passive armor to the whole party is more than competitive with that. +3 would be OP. It's often hard to get mileage out of armor buffs now though, because it's a threshold stat. But it's more of an issue with the new terrible armor system than with the buff itself. +5 accuracy passive aoe is just pretty solid all around. Fighter's conqueror's stance gives +10 to self only.

 

As for sacred immolation - I think it already does solid damage with high might and some power levels and can hurt high level enemies pretty badly. Paladins are not supposed to be the best aoe blaster either. It just costs an unreasonable amount of health atm.

 

Good points, still disagree with Accuracy Aura though. One weapon can already give +20 acc. However I think you convienced me to change +3 Armor to +2 armor. +1 is still too low in my opinion. There needs to be reason to turn off Acc aura and change to others. I think since now all auras are stronger, you can actually switch to them and feel difference. Before I was just running that poor +5 Acc all the time.

 

Sacred Immolation does not make you best AOE blaster. 25-35 is low for Level VII. White Worms or Seven Night on Chanter can nuke group of enemies faster, not to even mention Wizard or Cleave Stance. But that needs to be tested first instead of theory crafting of 5 damage will change much. This is pretty much the only AOE damage spell for pure Paladin so I think it should be on Level VII strong enough to make up for it.

 

As always, thanks for feedback.

[MadDemiurg]

For auras, as far as unupgraded ones go zealous focus is the best currently, mostly because it has guaranteed returns. But as I said the issue with endurance is the new armor system, and it's not easy to fix without making it too strong in some cases. Upgrader endurance is imo a lot better than upgraded focus actually, it gives quite a bit of passive healing in aoe.

 

Sacred immolation 25-35 is just one tick of damage though, total is a lot more than that. It's a lot stronger than seven nights if not for self damage. And cleave stance needs a nerf tbh.

Edited May 14, 2018 by MadDemiurg

[Climhazzard]

Exalted endurance is really strong as is if you combine it with ancient memory, and since you'd be multi classed to do so you can double buff them both with +100% healing.  If it were just solo I can see better options, but since it's an AoE I think it's plenty strong as is.

 

Perhaps it's not as appealing for a single class Paladin though, I'd be afraid of the consequences of buffing it however.  If anything I kind of expect Paladins to get defensive nerfs if/when balance patches start getting thrown around, but only time will tell I guess.  I even figured out how to safely use sacred immolation on my healing tank..   as long as it's not empowered.

[Voltron]

Thanks for feedback. I changed Endurance Aura to +2 and reverted change to Exalt Endurance to 3 HP healing as it was by default. Also Flame of Devotion/Eternal base is back to 25%, while I left new 20% lash on Eternal to make it competetive with other option.

Sacred Immolation I will test at end game how it plays with little more damage.

For anyone who is interested I will post also a special version with Focus Aura back to +5 Acc, but I will keep Exalted Focus 10% Hits to Crit, as I think it's the only way for this upgrade to be worth.

 

Thanks for feedback.

I will work later on some other abilities and bleak walker.


EDIT: Added optional file with +5 ACC back if anyone doesn't like new change. Exalted is still buffed.

Edited May 14, 2018 by Voltron

[Voltron]

Sacred immolation 25-35 is just one tick of damage though, total is a lot more than that. It's a lot stronger than seven nights if not for self damage. And cleave stance needs a nerf tbh.

 It deals less, but more overall vs deal once big nuke but less overall. I think that's usually how DOT spells work vs nuke spells.

Edited May 14, 2018 by Voltron

[Climhazzard]

My main problem with most accuracy buffs in this game, including the focus aura, is they don't stack with devotions for the faithful, which is way better and makes them all useless, lol.  So something besides accuracy might be the right solution.

[Dongom]

War Caller  

 

Unbending + Mercy (100% Healing Chant) + Set to Their Purpose = You are Immortal and can Spam damage attacks from both classes. GG.

 

Although tbh that is a lvl 19 build. Many lvl 19 builds are practically unkillable monsters.

Edited May 14, 2018 by Dongom

[Voltron]

War Caller  

 

Unbending + Mercy (100% Healing Chant) + Set to Their Purpose = You are Immortal and can Spam damage attacks from both classes. GG.

 

Although tbh that is a lvl 19 build. Many lvl 19 builds are practically unkillable monsters.

 

Lvl 19 is gg anyway, doesn't matter what you play :D

[Voltron]

My main problem with most accuracy buffs in this game, including the focus aura, is they don't stack with devotions for the faithful, which is way better and makes them all useless, lol.  So something besides accuracy might be the right solution.

 

That is true, but if you don't have priest in your party or if you solo- it's not a problem then.

[Dongom]

 

War Caller  

 

Unbending + Mercy (100% Healing Chant) + Set to Their Purpose = You are Immortal and can Spam damage attacks from both classes. GG.

 

Although tbh that is a lvl 19 build. Many lvl 19 builds are practically unkillable monsters.

 

Lvl 19 is gg anyway, doesn't matter what you play :D

 

 

 

wtb working scaling. Or hell a mode that scales everything +1-2 lvls higher than you no matter were you are.

[Voltron]

Also after playing Herald Kind Way/Troubadour (now I see why he is so good, with his modal active he gets Phrases like crazy) I have to say to there is no point going with moon godlike for them. The amount of healing you get here is just enormous + defenses.

Also now my buffed Eternal Devotion works really well with Mith Fyr chant.

I think Nature Godlike would be better in long run here. But It's not like Moon is bad, every heal is good :D.



Btw. How do you think you should play Troubadour with his modal on- just all chants you know one by one or I should have prepared like 3 debuffs, 3 heals, 3 self buffs Chants when I use his modal (which is all the time really since it give Phrases so fast).

And that Sabre saber from Neketaka is sooo good on Chanter :D

[Climhazzard]

It's kind of cool that Troubadour can choose between active and passive playstyles, I'm assuming you'll have a lack of ability picks if you try to get a decent range of invocations though, at least with a multi class.

[Answermancer]

I still can't decide between Shadowdancer and Swashbuckler for my imported original Sneak Attack/Crit rogue, heh, I'm playing a game with each of them now to compare and they're just both so fun.

 

I really like the survivability of the Swashbuckler, and Cleave Stance is hilariously awesome, I'm also stacking a fair bit of accuracy and crit conversion (including the Orlan bonus) and Devoted bonus means I usually over-penetrate and one-shot smaller enemies.

 

The Shadowdancer isn't as far along, but Swift Strikes is just sooooo good, especially with Nature Godlike which I chose for that one, basically a permanent +2 power levels (which I only just realized affects Sneak Attack).

 

I considered going with Shadowdancer when import is fixed, but then also making a new character for Swashbuckler, that's a sort of 3 Musketeers style guy with a Rapier (probably Devoted) and One-Handed style for even more crits. Is One-Handed completely outclassed by dual wielding?

[Voltron]

It's kind of cool that Troubadour can choose between active and passive playstyles, I'm assuming you'll have a lack of ability picks if you try to get a decent range of invocations though, at least with a multi class.

 

I only try to take those I use the most, and I respec once some stop being useful:

 

So what aim to get is:

 

Level I: And Hel-Hyraf (-2 armor is good in melee) and Chant Dull The Edge + Come Come Soft Winds

Level II: At the Sound of His Voice , Gernisc Slew and White Worms  - I will probably ditch out White Worms once I get So Singt or Seven Nights but so far it's great AOE nuke and AOE dmg on solo it's good especially since you can kill one enemy super fast with Sworn Rival-empowered FOD.

Level III: Ancient Memory and I took Combat Focus to be able to summon my empowered Wurms at the beginning of fight since sometimes range enemies can iterrupt you. One I get maybe some item with Concentration I will ditch that.

Level IV: Nothing yet as I grabbed Sworn Rival on Paladin. But I am for Mith Fyr for sure here and probably The Brideman Slew. Ogres and The Long Night's Drink are also good.

Level V: Her Courage thick as steel (of course), The Bridge, and better Gernsic (I will ditch Gernisc from before and grab something on Paladin).

Level VI: Old Siec and maybe So Singt.

 

I don't know what I want more- grab invocations that will buff me greatly or chants that will debuff enemies greatly (or buff me) so I can stick to spamming Paralyze and Damage invocations.

 

But things like The Bridgeman Slew and The Bridge give you so many buffs it's crazy.

 

Thing is on Paladin I have only to grab: Eternal Devotion, Exalted Focus and till Stoic Steel I don't see anything worth over Chanter Stuff.

 

Edited May 14, 2018 by Voltron

[Voltron]

Few more thoughts about Troubadour:

 

Brisk Recitation modal:

 

It's awesome for chanting two or one healing chants (like Soft Wind + Ancient Memory) as it's keep it perma and you get Phrases like crazy at the same time. It's also great for chanting one good Chant or Two that works well one after another.

My fav combos for now in Brisk modal are:
1. Ancient Memory + Soft Wind. Decent healing while doing some additional dmg around.

2. Her Courage + Old Siec. Actually works pretty well, you have Her Courage first, then Old Siec mostly when you attack, then shield again, then old siec again to heal from your attacks. Works good together in this modal.

3. Old Siec alone for decent healing - I think I may actually ditch out Ancient Memory and Soft Wind because with Old Siec active + Two Handed Weapons + 20% less recover from Devil Corc armor + Sasha's recovery bonus for every learnt chant + high dex + Modyr recovery bonus I attack very fast with those two blades and if I crit for 59+7 it heals me for 9,9 for attack before applying healing bonuses. It also combos well with Kind Wayfarer FOD. This plus Exalted Endurance + Moon godlike Passive is actually a lot. So I think for healing as I play solo melee I can atcually stick to Old Siec when I need healing. Or maybe keep it active with Ancient Memory. If you play melee solo it should work better.
4. Mith Fyr - if fight is not hard it's actually nice to keep that burn bonus permanent as it combos well with Eternal Devosion.

5. I don't have that chant but Level VII summon Skeleton would work well too as there would be skeleton summoned every 3 sec.

6. Also don't have that chant, but I think The Silver Knight Shield + Her Courage would work well together, although it might be pointless to have +10 deflection if you can have perma 10 dmg reduction. 

Normal Mode but longer Linger of Troubadour:
1. Dragon Trashed should be decent as they will linger if you only chant that, but then it's not that strong as some others combos. But I think the Slash damage needs to be change to every 3.0 sec instead 6.0 sec (same as Burn). I will do mod for it later.

2. Mith Fyr + Old Siec is awesome. Damage boost + healing from damage. 

3. Mercy and Kindness + any healing works well.

4. Ancient Memory is actually decent when it stacks with itself with longer linger.
5. Level VII Skeletons, you should have 2 for a short time.

So far that's my fav combos.

[Madscientist]

I am planning what chars to make and I have a few questions:

 

- Do berserkers really lose 3/4 upgrades to frenzy or is this a bug in the character creation and they can take the same talents as the other barbariens?

I wanted to make a berserker/soul blade but if berserkers do not get the frenzy upgrades I might take a barbarien/soul blade instead.

 

- When making a fighter/monk, which of these things can trigger what:

  + Cleave stance: does it only work if you kill the primary target or does it also work with torments reach AoE, blade turning, swift flurry, heartbeat drumming, rooting pain, long pain + upgrades, the cleave attack itself, something else?

  + heartbeat drumming, swift strikes: same as above

  + does weakening critical work for all kinds of attacks?

I want to make a devoted/shattered pillar who spams torments reach and rooting pain and each crit or kill can cause more instant attacks while weakening and interrupting all enemies around me. Helwalker/devoted may do more damage, but I like the shattered pillar concept more than the helwalker concept.

[theBalthazar]

1) Nerf Devotion to the faithful to 15 accuracy.

2) unlock stacking rules for active abilities with a simple rule : same spell = no stack. (two same aura in the team for example)

3) Stay with 5 accuracy with zealous focus 1, but boost to 10 % hit to crit for the second step. (Zealous focus)

4) Put 20 % fire damage with personnal boost for FOD and 15 % for shared.

5) Everybody is happy with a paladin.

 

Because without more advantageous stacking rules, the bigger is the best. 20 accuracy is OK in this way. And focus is totally useless (like conquerer stance... etc).

 

Obsidian have a great idea in POE2 : open mind, open stacking rules with ITEMS...

 

...But not with abilities.

 

Except there is a big problem. An item can be moved. An ability not. If I am a priest/devoted. I lose an option.

 

Conquerer stance+devotion of the faithful. If in my team there is a paladin with zealous, same.

 

So this problem is very annoying...

 

PS : Dragon trashed... and died. : p

Edited May 15, 2018 by theBalthazar

[Voltron]

1) Nerf Devotion to the faithful to 15 accuracy.

2) unlock stacking rules for active abilities with a simple rule : same spell = no stack. (two same aura in the team for example)

3) Stay with 5 accuracy with zealous focus 1, but boost to 10 % hit to crit for the second step. (Zealous focus)

4) Put 20 % fire damage with personnal boost for FOD and 15 % for shared.

5) Everybody is happy with a paladin.

 

 

 

1. K, I will do optional file for it

2. I don't think I know how to do it without editing EVERY single ability, which is too much work for simple mod :/

3. There is optional file with 5 Acc, though I still stay with +10 as imo it's where it should be.

4. Already done for personal Eternal Devotion

5. I am in general, just I think that for example Fighter should not get Rapid Recovery, it should be Paladin skill. They are from healing in general. And Fighter can get that to 7 HP per 3 sec later instead of weak 3.0 HP per 3 sec from Exalted Aura. Which even needs to be activated first so you loose other stuff, while Fighter can get 7 HP per 3 sec for free as passive. 

 

For example Exalted Aura + Ancient Memory + Soft Winds heal you around 9 HP per 3 sec. That is from 3 stacking abilities/chants. While Fighter can get 7 HP from just one upgraded passive and it lasts 45 sec which gives room for other spells/abilities being active. 

 

Of course Paladin has Lay on Hands + Kind Wayfarer healing FOD and passive Defenses, but I still don't think healing should be a factor of Fighters.