help making DPS melee as main character + mini rant

[FlaviusPTZ]

Hello guys,

I have recently purchased Pillars of eternity complete edition for ps4; I have played the game before on pc, got to about level 6 with a paladin(using a bit of cheats to make him better, I was playing the game when the paladin was rubbish) but I didn't like the fact that, even if I boosted the stats and gave him more abilities/talents, he was just meh compared to other more potent classes like druid, priest, wizard and ciphers;

 

So my question for those of you that have more experience with this game: Is there any possibility of making a melee character, that can do substantial damage, AND tank decently well at the same time?

 

So the idea behind this character is to be as close to a late medieval knight as possible (heavy full plate armor, 2 handed weapon - poleaxe, or greatsword) hit hard, and also take a lot of punishment; So I was thinking class(in order of preference):1 fighter,2 paladin,3 cipher ,4 wizard(I would really like a fighter, but from what i've heard they are quite bad for dps sadly...). Just to make some clarifications, I am planing on playing on normal(maybe hard, if I find normal too easy), I can only afford to play during the weekend, so I really need to start a character and finish with it ( the main problem I have with this game, and games in general, is I keep starting over because I mess up the character, or I just don't like playing with it). also, i want the guy to be aumaua, human, maybe moon godlike, the idea of having a orlan or elf in full plate and a greatsword is just silly to me.

 

So if you guys could give me breakthrough of race,class, attributes, abilities, talents, weapons etc I would be most grateful; I just don't have the know how, and I can't afford the time to start over again and again until I get it right; also I want the guy to be good from start to finish, not when I get certain ability and gear, 30-40 hours into the game

 

Now for the rant part(tryed to make it as quick as possible):

First I just want to say, I really like PoE, i think it is a well made game, given the budget, I am not trying to trash the developers or anything like that,I can imagine the work that was put in to this project, and I also know there wasn't much money made out of it ,so that being said...

 

When did all rpg games start adopting this silly, childish, mmo-ish roles for the different classes; who invented this idea that the fighter/warrior (the name itself should be enough to tell you what it should do, it should FIGHT!!!) is a "tank", it is good for taking hits but not doing damage;instead that role is given to a skinny, unarmored, "dual-wielding" "rogue" type of character; I mean think about it, how in the world would a skinny elf, with "leather" armor", "dual-wielding" 2 knifes "ninja style" could possibly do more damage that a knight type character with FULLPLATE armor and a freaking GIANT greatsword??? it just make no sence pleople, I mean i get it for mmo's, because there you want a nice mix of diferent roles, and mmo's are childish cartoonish in nature, so I can understand that; but in ALL rpg games that I have recenlty played i see this trend with is really sad, because I really really like knights and I alway like to play as some sort of fighter in most rpg, only to find, for my frustration, well they are good at "tanking"  and thats about it :|

 

In my humble opinion (not that it is going to make any difference, dota 2 is the most popular game, and despacito has the most youtube views, what am I expecting) this is what the roles of classes should be in this types of rpgs (not MMO, dotas): fighters (highly armored and armed, highly trained in martial arts from a young age) should be the MAIN guys you want to have for fighting!!! rogue type character should get the role of support, get doors unlocked, disable traps/mechanism, scout ahead, etc; as for combat, they should take out guards quietly(that should be the use of sneak attack..), things like this, but when the real fighting begins, let the fighter fight for God sake...I mean thats the single thing they'r good at right?; As for casters...lets just get something clear here, if you live in a universe were you can throw fireballs and icebolt and the like, there really is no sense for swords, bows, and armor, so clearly you wouldn't want to be anything other that a wizard or druid; but, if you want to build a world in which there are swords and such along side magic, there should be a different kind of magic; this is what I am thinking of, spells like, slow, blind, haste, mind control stuff, etc, you get it stuff like buffing/debuffing, crowd control, etc; as for non-combat, they should read ancient texts, know arcane stuff, etc.

 

Now before there will be any comments, I just want to say something because, I can anticipate some of the comments:

"But wait, this is fantasy, so anything is possible;" well, yes this is fantasy, but still if the laws of physics of this fantasy world are similar to ours, similar things should remain the same; how can you possibly justify a "dual-wielding" ninja rogue with 2 knifes, or a half-naked "dual-wielding" axes "barbarian" ever to be better at combat than a guy that's in full plate armor, with a freaking poleaxe, or longsword??? there is just no way, thats how, and it just looks silly...and again for casters, well if you can make a "fireball" out of thin air, doing massive amounts of damage, something like a grenade explosion, well, then its game over for swords and armor, as these would become obsolete; I know its fantasy, I like fantasy a lot in movies and games, but what I don't like is silly stuff that makes no sense at all, in games that present themselves as more mature; I can totally understand things like dual wielding ninja rogues and fireball trowing mages in games for 12 year olds, but I am pretty disappointed seeing stuff like that in games that I expected more from.

PS: First, I just want to say that I din't intend on insulting anybody with my rant here, so if you felt insulted in any way I apologize, it wasn't the intent

Second, english is not my native language, so I also apologize for the grammar and such

Third, if I posted in the wrong section here, I also apologize, I a complete noob when it comes to forums and computers in general

[Braven]

Fighters can be built to be both deal great damage and take a lot of punishment; I actually think a very aggressive playstyle is best for that class. Often people like to build fighters into stupid meat shields hiding behind large shields, but that playstyle is much better with a chanter or paladin in this game. Fighters are designed to swing hard, dispatch enemies fast, and playing defensively just wastes the potential of their best abilities including the constant recovery staple ability. You want to be hurt so constant recovery is always healing you and not being wasted.

 

Mechanically, this is because fighter abilities are all duration and use limited. Basically, fighters are very strong immediately at the start of combat where other classes need to build up by spending time buffing, or gather wounds, focus, etc. They will start to fall behind if a battle drags on, so you want to hit hard and fast with them.

 

Now the stats need to be a little strange to make this work optimally, which is why some people try to play a fighter, think they are weak, and then move on. CON and Resolve would seem like staples, but they are actually the least important stats. You don’t need a large endurance pool or deflection because you will kill off your enemies before they are ever needed. Constant recovery along with other endurance/health booster will keep you standing without those stats. You do need very high intelligence because your abilities are duration limited; Think of this as your warrior training, I guess... street smarts, so to speak.

 

Might: maxed (If given an option, always buff this over others. It helps both damage and self-healing)

Con: low

Dex: high

Per: high. (Critical hits will be key to high damage)

Int: high

Res: low

 

I recommend either human or coastal aumuana. They both get increases to Might and have good racial passives and fit the character thematically.

 

First take disciplined barage followed later by stalwart defense. With the defense and barage abilities active, your fighting prowess will outshine everyone else until they wear off and hopefully your enemies are pretty much dead by then. Pair this with a big hitting great sword and heavy armor and you will both deal solid damage and can take a beating. My favorite sword which also fits your vision of a fighter is “The Hours of St. Rumbalt”. It is one of the most damaging weapons in the game, if you critically hit, and also will also sometimes knock your enemy to the ground. It is pricy, but if you save up your coins in ACT 1, you can by it at the start of ACT 2. Disciplined barage increases your accuracy by 20 allowing you good chances to get critical hits making this great sword a particularly good fit with a fighter. Just be sure to get weapon focus - soldier and anything else you can to boost accuracy or lower the enemies deflection. Critical hit damage will continue to scale as you progress through the game if you get durgan steel, merciless hand talent faction bonus, and dungeon dweller talent in ACT 3. Along with anihillation that the great sword has, combined, they increase per hit damage by 170% for critical hits. After you get the Charge ability at level 13, you can one-hit-kill a whole line of foes and the Damage output increases dramatically for the Fighter.

 

For talents, I would take “Rapid Recovery” followed by weapon focus soldier, followed by two-handed style.

Be sure to take anything that helps your endurance regeneration. This means focus on the “survival” skill and buy the “Cape of the tireless defender” in Defiance Bay. Always Use a piece of equipment with a “healing multiplier” enchantment. One can be found in the wilderness very early in ACT 1. This makes a big difference for the “tankiness” side.

 

The “undying” ability at level 9 can compensate for the low endurance in case the enemies get a lucky streak of attack rolls. You will also want to pick up “Binding wounds” around level 8 to ensure you don’t run out of health in the middle of a long battle, if that becomes an issue. Also, saves having to rest so much.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Braven

[Boeroer]

The PoE fighter is actually way better as a dps character than a tank. People who say that a fighter is bad at dealing damage doesn't know the game properly.

Because he comes with good defensive qualities from the start and also has some decent dps abilities you can build him exactly like you wanted: offensive + heavy armor + two hander. He will not be able to tank all incoming enemies, but that doesn't work anyway. However he's sturdy enough to survive for a long long time in the front line. To make him more sturdy you can focus on thick armor and self healing rather than deflection. Here is a quick rundown how to skill this fighter:

MIG: 15
CON: 15
DEX: 15
PER: 15
INT: 15
RES: 03

Survival 12 (pick Healing Bonus most of the time when camping)

Talents:
Rapid Recovery
Weapon Focus Soldier
Bonus Knockdown
Two Handed Style
Apprentice's Sneak Attack
Weapon Mastery Soldier
Savage Attack
Runner's Wounding Shot


Abilities:
Disciplined Barrage
Knockdown
Confident Aim
Weapon Spec Soldier
Armored Grace
Clear Out
Charge
Sundering Blow

Story talents: Merciless Hand and Dungeon Delver

Weapon & armor and other items:
I'd use a great sword and aim for Tidefall or Hours of St. Rumbalt. As armor I'd use Sanguine Plate. It not only procs Frenzy which will give you more MIG and CON and speed, but also gives you +2 survival which is nice in order to get to 14 survival which will give you +60% healing from Constant Recovery (+Rapid Recovery + Consecrated Ground + Cloak, see down below).
For the hands I'd search for Gauntlets of Swift Action or Mourning Gloves or Celebrant's Gloves, the belt could be a Belt of Bountiful Healing. The neck slot can be used for The Cloak of the Tireless Defender (improves regeneration) and the ring slots may be used for a Ring of Protection and whatever you like else. Boots should be Shod-in-Faith (procs Consecrated Ground when getting a crit).
The helm might be a Tempered Helm (not only a good helm but also looks good and knightly with the armor).

If you have a priest then cast Holy Meditation if you're not using the Celebrant's Gloves to nullify the disadvantage of low RES (=low Concentration) or use potions of Spirit Shield.

This fighter is potent and fun to play. He's also very good against dragons, too if you pair him with a priest (Inspiring Radiance + Devotions of the Faihtful) and a paladin who uses Coordinated Attacks and a marking weapon like Blade of the Endless Paths (estoc, late) or Spectacular Spetum (pollaxe, early - both work with the same weapon focus).

Edited October 31, 2017 by Boeroer

[JFutral]

Be careful, though, if you want your fighter to use St. Ydwen's Redeemer. It is difficult to get that last upgrade! (I am discovering.)

 

Joe

[Braven]

Be careful, though, if you want your fighter to use St. Ydwen's Redeemer. It is difficult to get that last upgrade! (I am discovering.)

 

Joe

I prefer the other, non-soulbound sainted great sword. Ydwen simply does a lot less damage since you can’t give it an elemental enchantment or durgan refine it. Really only good for killing vessel-type enemies... and you don’t need the final upgrade to do that when needed.

 

Tidefall of course is another good option too (probably the best weapon in the game). It provides both the highest damage and tank-ability thanks to wounding and endurance draining. Also looks awesome and also a Great Sword.

 

I recommend looking at the “Lady of Pain” build as it is basically what I think the OP is looking for.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Braven

[FlaviusPTZ]

One thing that I forgot, if at all possible, I would also like the damn thing not to wear weapons that look like Christmas trees, or armor made of tree bark or weird stuff like that; why do they always make the better swords look like Christmas trees as you progress more throughout the game is beyond my undestanding...

[FlaviusPTZ]

Hey, guys, thank you so much for replying so quickly, din't expect it, most grateful; one thing I forgot to mention is, if possible, I would like weapons not to look like Christmas trees, and armor made of tree bark and strange things like that, you know what I mean

[Boeroer]

Tidefall or Hours of St. Rumbalt look like normal great swords. Don't know what you mean.

 

Sanguine Plate looks like a red plate armor. If you don't like that: there are plenty of other plate armors. If only looks matter: I like the fine plate armor best.

[Torm51]

I guess it depends what mode you play if you play with no maimed I think low HP low Deflection front liners stink.

[Braven]

Could go higher con and lower perception, like Boerers stats if health is a concern or you want to prevent knock out injuries. Never was an issue for me since I take the under-appreciated binding wounds talent pretty early. You should never die with that talent unless you are really reckless since it almost doubles your health pool.

 

The weapons look normal unless you enchant them with an elemental lash... then they look a little over the top with the visual effects. If you don’t plan to ever enchant your weapon, I recommend a soul-bound weapon. The Grey Sleeper both looks good and is a great weapon. You can’t enchant soulbounds so you will never feel like you are missing out because you chose aesthetics over DPS.

 

On second thought, Grey Sleeper is a bad idea. It has all kinds of visual effects like summoning vessels (zombies) and shooting giant boulders out of the end of the blade randomly.

 

I think Steadfast might end up being the best, though that is a one-handed sword instead of a two-hander and comes rather late in the game... only soulbound I can think of that does nothing silly and looks normal. Really hard to have a “clean” weapon without losing out on significant DPS by not enchanting it. Wish there was a graphics setting to just turn off the elemental lash visual effects.

Edited October 31, 2017 by Braven

[Boeroer]

Eh, actually I had a typo with the stats. It's all 15 (PER too) except RES which is 3. Sorry!

 

If you enchant Tidefall or Rumbalt with a freezing or shocking lash it doesn't look so bad. Burning and corrosive lash are more eye-catching visual effects.

 

Just don't put a slayer enchantment on it. Those VFX are ugly. Also Savage Attack will let your weapon glow. Usually the VFX of that will disappear if you save & reload with Savage Attack activated. So no big deal. Same with Vulnerable Attack.  

Edited October 31, 2017 by Boeroer

[Madscientist]

I play PoE on hard right now and Eder does lots of damage.

He dual wields sabres (resolution + bittercut right now, I am lv 10) and has weapon focus, specialisation, mastery, confident aim, armored graze and spirit of decay.

 

He does more damage than my paladin with Rumbalt.

Eder attacks much faster and every hit does good damage thanks to his talents, not just 2 flames of devotion.

 

I play only hard, not PotD, and I think pure tanks are rather useless.

Good chars deal good damage (and are good at causing buffs and debuffs if they are casters) while being tough enough to survive until the end of combat.

Being able to survive forever is useless if you cannot kill enemies.

The best way to avoid getting killed is to kill enemies fast and to use CC if fast killing cannot be done without it (you are swarmed by enemies or a strong enemy hits really hard)

 

Fighters are good in dealing good damage while surviving in the middle of the action.

[Dr <3]

I was trying to beat the lady of pain build in terms of dmg, so right now i'm soloing with a warrior dual wielding drawn in spring. Most offensive talents taken (max str, high dex, confident aim, savage attack, weapon mestery, novice sneak attack, ecc).

He hits like a rogue, but with 3 times the "staying alive" Power. boring to play but strong.

[FlaviusPTZ]

Tidefall or Hours of St. Rumbalt look like normal great swords. Don't know what you mean.

 

Sanguine Plate looks like a red plate armor. If you don't like that: there are plenty of other plate armors. If only looks matter: I like the fine plate armor best.

sorry for that, I didn't realize there were any replies to my post yet, so I remembered that little detail; I looked up the weapons and armor you suggested, they look good, thank you for the time spent to reply

[FlaviusPTZ]

 

Tidefall or Hours of St. Rumbalt look like normal great swords. Don't know what you mean.

 

Sanguine Plate looks like a red plate armor. If you don't like that: there are plenty of other plate armors. If only looks matter: I like the fine plate armor best.

sorry for that, I didn't realize there were any replies to my post yet, so I remembered that little detail; I looked up the weapons and armor you suggested, they look good, thank you for the time spent to reply

 

Well I just searched for sanguine plate, no offence to anybody, I would like to use the most natural looking armors out there, and sanguine I personally don't like :| white crest armor seems to look pretty decent; would it work with the lady of pain build or is sanguine mandatory?

[FlaviusPTZ]

I play PoE on hard right now and Eder does lots of damage.

He dual wields sabres (resolution + bittercut right now, I am lv 10) and has weapon focus, specialisation, mastery, confident aim, armored graze and spirit of decay.

 

He does more damage than my paladin with Rumbalt.

Eder attacks much faster and every hit does good damage thanks to his talents, not just 2 flames of devotion.

 

I play only hard, not PotD, and I think pure tanks are rather useless.

Good chars deal good damage (and are good at causing buffs and debuffs if they are casters) while being tough enough to survive until the end of combat.

Being able to survive forever is useless if you cannot kill enemies.

The best way to avoid getting killed is to kill enemies fast and to use CC if fast killing cannot be done without it (you are swarmed by enemies or a strong enemy hits really hard)

 

Fighters are good in dealing good damage while surviving in the middle of the action.

 

I would like a 2 handed build, I don't like dual wielding at all; I mean thing about it, pretty much no one used it in medieval or any other period, why is it so successful in rpgs I don't get

[Madscientist]

This is role playing vs power gaming.

Computer games have their rulesets, and these rules do not need to be the same as in the real world.

You can look at those rules and try to get the most powerful char by combining several stats and skills, no matter how much sense such a combination makes in the real world.

Or you can try to create a char that makes sense to you regarding game world and story.

Furtuanatly PoE allows both things. Unless you want the highest difficulty and some other restrictions, the game is easy enough that you do not need an optimized char to finish it.

[AndreaColombo]

 

white crest armor seems to look pretty decent; would it work with the lady of pain build or is sanguine mandatory?

 

You can use any armor with the LoP. Sanguine Plate was one of its staples in the early stages but in later versions I only kept it because it's my favorite armor looks-wise.

[Braven]

 

white crest armor seems to look pretty decent; would it work with the lady of pain build or is sanguine mandatory?

You can use any armor with the LoP. Sanguine Plate was one of its staples in the early stages but in later versions I only kept it because it's my favorite armor looks-wise.

“He who wears scars” is another good option. It has some endurance regeneration and looks like you would expect plate armor to look like (dull gray). White-crest also looks good.

[Boeroer]

"He Carries Many Scars" (don't want to sound schoolmasterly - just in case you wonder why you can't find it in the wiki or the object folder).

 

I think that's one of the best looking plates in the game, too.

Edited November 1, 2017 by Boeroer

[FlaviusPTZ]

Ok guys, thank for all the replies, I'm just glad that I can actually make the kind of character I want in this game, so 2 handed fighter it is; that being established could you give me some advice for party setup?; I want to use the game's own companions as much as possible, so my idea for the party would be: main 2 handed dps fighter, Pallegina as main tank, Durance, Eder build for ranged with arquebus, Sagani as well ranged with arquebus, and a custom build barbarian with a pike; So 2 questions, first, do I really need a tank or should I just equip Pallegina with 2 handed and build her for some dps and support, or are her attributes not very good for that (low might, low dex)?; second question: is Durance enough for casters, for buffing/debuffing and healing, or should I ditch the barbarian, and replace him with another caster like Aloth(12 might kinda sucks for wizz though), Hiravias, or Grieving Mother?

[FlaviusPTZ]

Also, what race should I chose?; I was thinking between costal aumaua, human, or moon godlike

[Boeroer]

All three races are fine. Pick what you like best visually.

 

I would never build a fighter for ranged combat (I tried several times and it sucks in my opinion). Their innate sturdyness is wasted and their best abilites are for melee combat only. Nearly every other class besides barb is better in ranged combat than a fighter.

 

You can build Edér as a dual wielding fighter (I like dual war hammers) or as a pike user (tall grass), having max regeneration and using Take the Hit to reduce damage on the whole front line - it works wonderfully (but only if you don't use mind control abilites - because it's a bugged combo). 

 

I would def. pick Aloth because you are terribly short of CC options atm. 12 MIG doesn't matter that much. Wizards have awesome spells. If you focus on CC then MIG doesn't matter at all. And CC is one of the keys for a good playthrough (besides accuracy). Or try him as melee wizard from 2. row with Concelhaut's Staff and later Citzel's Spirit Lance - powerful throughout the whole game.

 

If you want to use mostly official companions I would skip the barb and take Kana instead for the front line - with weapon & shield. From lvl 9 on he will start to take over the lead as best damage dealer with The Dragon Thrashed chant (sadly not on the char sheet because the game fails to log the damage of Dragon Thrashed) and fullfills the same role as a barb (killing mobs) but with less hassle. But he also works with a pike or a quarterstaff from 2. row.

Another way would be to give him a ranged weapon and use Sure Handed Ila. It stacks with everything and also lets your other ranged chars shoot faster. But honestly nothing beats Dragon Thrashed. In the early game the Phantom is very strong, as is White Worms (if you deactivate gib effects in the game options menu): bodies can be used over and over again and if you pile enough of them at a chokepoint you can one-shot whole groups with it. 

Edited November 2, 2017 by Boeroer

[dgray62]

I would like a 2 handed build, I don't like dual wielding at all; I mean thing about it, pretty much no one used it in medieval or any other period, why is it so successful in rpgs I don't get

 

Keep in mind that the world of POE isn't medieval Europe. Dual wielding was more common in other parts of the world in medieval times, such as in the martial arts traditions of East Asia. I think that the fondness for dual wielding in D&D and video games (such as Baldur's Gate) goes back to fascination of Japanese samurai, who commonly wielded both a katana and wakazashi, although they didn't necessarily dual wield; these swords were more typically used for different purposes. As Madscientist wrote, POE gives you the flexibility to build whatever sort of character you'd like. POE might be criticized as being unrealistic in not giving you an accuracy penalty for dual wielding, as in older games such as BG. [edited for grammar]

Edited November 2, 2017 by dgray62

[Boeroer]

Every style has its bonus and no penalties.

 

Single handed weapon use gives you +12 ACC and the style a 15% hit to crit conversion.

 

Weapon & shield gives you higher deflection and the style raises his even higher and also gives you more reflex.

 

Dual wielding removes the melee attack speed penalty (equivalent of a 50% speed boost) and the style adds another 20%.

 

Two Handers have higher base damage and the style gives you additional +15% damage.

 

None of them has penalties and I think it's good to keep things consistent and don't make too many exceptions.

Edited November 2, 2017 by Boeroer