Most overpowered builds post patch 2.02

[brindle88]

Also you don't need max stats, 15s can get it done.

 

Try something like:

Might 10 or 15

Con 13 or 10 and add 3 to whatever

Dex  15 or 10

Per  15

Int   15

Res 10

 

If dual wielding good pairs are Flails - unforgiven -speed enchant + Starcaller - fast speed stun on hit. Warhammers - Strike hard - -def on hit and speed + Shatterstar -bigger interrupt or Godansthunyr - stun on hit, Spears - craftable one with stun + the one with -def on hit.

 

Two hander - Mabec's Morningstar, Tall Grass, Hours of St Rumbault, Grey Sleeper

 

Or you can skip the on crit affliction weapons and go for speed, endurance draining, - defense on hit types.

Which one is it 15 or 10? You've made it look like you have more stats to allocate then you actually do. Compare this to a rogue or fighters min maxed stats.

[brindle88]

A Barbarian can lock down the mob with every swing and can do it all day long in every encounter. Casters will run out of spells, even a Cipher only has enough focus for one Amplified Wave and then has to do normal attacks to regen.

 

To really make it work you need the Priest to cast his per encounter ability that debuffs fortitude, I think it is Painful Interdiction.

 

Going for the damage route gets the Barbarian hitting multiple foes with every swing. Maybe he hits only half as hard as your Rogue but he is hitting 4 or 5 guys at a time. All together he is doing twice the damage of your Rogue in certain situations.

Hang on mate a barbarian is only going to do this when he crits, and then only if the enemies fake there saves.

 

I've played POTD many times and never ran out of spells and the spells are more powerfull then this anyway.

[Teioh_White]

^ That's pretty much it, unless you're rest spamming (or a Wizard) total battlefield control isn't feasible every fight. And that's where the barb comes in, essentially tossing out 35~ damage interrupting+stunning 2.15m ~ aoe every round, forever and ever.

 

Actually goes very well with those above caster moves, as the caster can spend one spell slot to open a fight and CC a bunch of things, then the rolling wave of stunlock cleans everything up.

[brindle88]

^ That's pretty much it, unless you're rest spamming (or a Wizard) total battlefield control isn't feasible every fight. And that's where the barb comes in, essentially tossing out 35~ damage interrupting+stunning 2.15m ~ aoe every round, forever and ever.

 

Actually goes very well with those above caster moves, as the caster can spend one spell slot to open a fight and CC a bunch of things, then the rolling wave of stunlock cleans everything up.

What the hell is rest spamming? You mean resting very now and then at an inn or camping? You make it sound like its a sacrificial sin

[brindle88]

 

^ That's pretty much it, unless you're rest spamming (or a Wizard) total battlefield control isn't feasible every fight. And that's where the barb comes in, essentially tossing out 35~ damage interrupting+stunning 2.15m ~ aoe every round, forever and ever.

 

Actually goes very well with those above caster moves, as the caster can spend one spell slot to open a fight and CC a bunch of things, then the rolling wave of stunlock cleans everything up.

What the hell is rest spamming? You mean resting very now and then at an inn or camping? You make it sound like its a sacrificial sin

It's official everyone wizards suck because you have to rest

[KDubya]

 

A Barbarian can lock down the mob with every swing and can do it all day long in every encounter. Casters will run out of spells, even a Cipher only has enough focus for one Amplified Wave and then has to do normal attacks to regen.

 

To really make it work you need the Priest to cast his per encounter ability that debuffs fortitude, I think it is Painful Interdiction.

 

Going for the damage route gets the Barbarian hitting multiple foes with every swing. Maybe he hits only half as hard as your Rogue but he is hitting 4 or 5 guys at a time. All together he is doing twice the damage of your Rogue in certain situations.

Hang on mate a barbarian is only going to do this when he crits, and then only if the enemies fake there saves.

 

I've played POTD many times and never ran out of spells and the spells are more powerfull then this anyway.

 

 

Being limited to on crit is why you need the Priest's Painful Interdiction to debuff the enemy.

 

Personally, I much prefer using a Monk than a Barbarian. You're more durable, better defenses, better deflection, better single target damage and Torment's Reach can also clean up bunched up trash mobs. Monks are also more flexible on stats, as you've noticed Barbarians are stat starved.

 

Or use a Paladin with Sacred Immolation you clear trash as well.

[aweigh0101]

how can i make a barb succesfully on-crit on potd?

weapon focus
gallant's aura
accurate carnage

that's +15 ACC to their Carnage right there :D

if we add gear then it just becomes ridiculous:

gauntlets of +5 ACC
lilith's shawl +3 PER

barbs have Low Def / Med ACC
fighters have Med Def / High ACC
monks have Med Def / High ACC (same as fighter)
rogues have Low Def / High ACC
rangers have Low Def / High ACC (same as rogue)
paladins have Med Def / Med ACC

[brindle88]

 

 

A Barbarian can lock down the mob with every swing and can do it all day long in every encounter. Casters will run out of spells, even a Cipher only has enough focus for one Amplified Wave and then has to do normal attacks to regen.

 

To really make it work you need the Priest to cast his per encounter ability that debuffs fortitude, I think it is Painful Interdiction.

 

Going for the damage route gets the Barbarian hitting multiple foes with every swing. Maybe he hits only half as hard as your Rogue but he is hitting 4 or 5 guys at a time. All together he is doing twice the damage of your Rogue in certain situations.

 

Hang on mate a barbarian is only going to do this when he crits, and then only if the enemies fake there saves.

I've played POTD many times and never ran out of spells and the spells are more powerfull then this anyway.

 

Being limited to on crit is why you need the Priest's Painful Interdiction to debuff the enemy.

 

Personally, I much prefer using a Monk than a Barbarian. You're more durable, better defenses, better deflection, better single target damage and Torment's Reach can also clean up bunched up trash mobs. Monks are also more flexible on stats, as you've noticed Barbarians are stat starved.

 

Or use a Paladin with Sacred Immolation you clear trash as well.

What the hell does a priest buffing the barbarian have to do with this? You are completely ignoring me when I say that a priest could also buff a fighter or a rogue with a more powerful spell or if you want to say " what can one class do for another" then a cipher can knock down an entire screen with amplified wave and any melee class would have a field day

 

We are not talking about other classes interfering with other classes potential we are looking at classes on there own. If we where to look at all those option this thread would be 50,000 pages long

[brindle88]

how can i make a barb succesfully on-crit on potd?

weapon focus

gallant's aura

accurate carnage

that's +15 ACC to their Carnage right there :D

if we add gear then it just becomes ridiculous:

gauntlets of +5 ACC

lilith's shawl +3 PER

barbs have Low Def / Med ACC

fighters have Med Def / High ACC

monks have Med Def / High ACC (same as fighter)

rogues have Low Def / High ACC

rangers have Low Def / High ACC (same as rogue)

paladins have Med Def / Med ACC

Fighters have high def high accuracy after patch 2.03 that came out yesterday

[aweigh0101]

indeed, i forgot!

that +5 to their base Def is really good. now they're the only martial class with high def / high ACC AND high health / high endurance. that's pretty crazy when you think about it.

[KDubya]

Its a team game. Team synergy makes a big difference.

 

Without using the debuff from the Priest's per encounter Painful Interdiction AND the Brute Force + Threatening Presence you will not have much success getting large scale stuns or prones. If you won't be using the Priest to assist the plan is not going to work well.

 

You'd be left with just interrupts, which can also serve a purpose if using a weapon like mabec's or Strike Hard you have a 1 second interrupt which also will hit the carnage victims and does not require a crit. With the interrupt boosting talent you can consistently interrupt everyone nearby for one second every (approximate) three second attack cycle.

[Teioh_White]

 

 

 

^ That's pretty much it, unless you're rest spamming (or a Wizard) total battlefield control isn't feasible every fight. And that's where the barb comes in, essentially tossing out 35~ damage interrupting+stunning 2.15m ~ aoe every round, forever and ever.

 

Actually goes very well with those above caster moves, as the caster can spend one spell slot to open a fight and CC a bunch of things, then the rolling wave of stunlock cleans everything up.

What the hell is rest spamming? You mean resting very now and then at an inn or camping? You make it sound like its a sacrificial sin

It's official everyone wizards suck because you have to rest

 

That's a pretty big reading comprehension fail right there, considering I said the exact opposite. Wizards lock down a battlefield currently, no matter one's approach to resting.

 

 

As for getting those on-crit weaposnt o work, If using a Priest and a Wizard/Cipher/Druid, it's pretty trivial to get down into high crit range, even for carnage hits with its -10 acc. Everyone gets +13/18 acc from weapon+focus, depending on Savage Attack, plus another 5~ from one of the 3 blessing effects. Add in 5 from Gauntlets, 2 from a perception enchantment, and we're at 25 free acc over the base.

 

Add in +20 acc from a caster tossing a blind with a level 1 spell, and a priest tossing in a Blessing, and suddenly we're in the 50% crit range with minimal cost and effort. And the Stuns don't need to crit, as they'll get reapplied so fast, and  it won't outright miss very often on a status effect.

 

Works for everyone, no need for the 15 seconds of power to start off every fight, that costs 2 +X Barbs in talents, and only applies to the barbs. And can pile Flanking/Stuck/Para/Prone/Petrify onto the blind as well to really work the formula if needed, as well.

Edited November 1, 2015 by Teioh_White

[brindle88]

Seeing as I'm the op on this thread I want to CLEARLY state that this thread is intended for " most over powered build post patch 2.02"

 

NOT INCLUDING any buffs from other casters, paladins whatever.

 

We are talking about builds not synergies.

 

If people want to talk about most over powered synergies go start another thread and state it on there.

[Boeroer]

It's a build! The items are essential as is the Painful Interdiction. What use is it to plan individual OP-builds that don't work well in a party? It's a party based rpg. And who said he's a glass cannon? With shod in faith that are the perfect item for a in-the-fray barb and a heavy armor he becomes very tanky. I don't drop resolve (which would be stupid because of Gattung interrupted) and I don't max might and dex. Only PER and INT should be maxed because it makes you hit and interrupt more often and also influences the radius of carnage plus causing longer disables. Only things that could stop him were disables like stun/prone/paralyze. He hasn't superhigh defenses so these afflictions will hit him from time to time. But everything else he just shrugs off. Because of his immense health pool he never runs out of health before the others have ro rest. Both spell holdings of Consecrated Ground will be activated in most fights because he will receive crits but that doesn't stop him because of bis thick armor. After that happens, he just can't get down because 2 parallel Consecrated Grounds to a ton of healing (him and allies around him). The good part of him is not only his CC capability (remember - most hits interrupt anyway, a lot of crits will occur after debuffing) but also that he can do decent (not superhigh) aoe damage while tank a whole horde of mobsters and having the chance to disable them completely for the whole fight plus provide aoe healing. He does that all at the same time and once positioned and set up he doesn't need any more micro. He is abolutely great and requires no resources like focus or spells per rest. And the Painful Interdiction isn't even for him. The -40 fort and will are absolutely great for ciphers, mages, druids, monks etc. in your party. He is of course not the best 1:1 DPSer but that's not the point. You can buff his DPS extremely when you use Firebrand from time to time or switch to more tankyness plus aoe wounding with Tidefall. You can do a lot with this guy - but not soloing. One of the most "powerful" builds I ever discovered. Maybe I should just do a video and post it in an extra thread with a detailed build description.

I'm not saying that rogues are weak. They just do completely different things.

[Boeroer]

I was replying to your anti-barbarian rant. You stated that barbs are bad and of course rogues are better - as always.   

 

That build is even good when you don't use a priest. Interruping also occurs without crits. You can also use the grey sleeper if you want to proc on-hit effects more often with carnage - also works nicely. This build just goes from good to superb when you have a priest in your party, that's all.
 

And it depends what you mean by "overpowered". This build is overpowered because it does four things at once: tanking, aoe CC, aoe damage, aoe healing. Even without stunning it's still more powerful in terms of how it influences mob encounters as a single rogue. The rogue is better at killing one tough enemy and is overpowered in that regard.

 

Maybe you should rename your thread into "highest DPS build", then we all agree its Rogue for melee, pat your shoulder and go on - if it is that what you want to happen for your own personal thread. May that's a little boring though...

[brindle88]

I Was going to create a new thread for this but I felt It relevant to leave it in here as this thead already will be a good read and helpful looking for people to build viable builds.

 

BARBARIANS ARE VASTLY INFERIOR TO FIGHTERS/ AND ROGUES

 

I have just spent the last few hours creating different barbarian builds from a save I made late game where I was able to hire henchman and build them up to level 13. I also had kept all the good items and weaponry throughout the game so I was able to give the barb the appropriate goodies to suit the different build paths I found viable.

 

I discovered a lot of interesting, obvious and blaringly fatal build paths and there are no strong builds for this class. Though obviously you would still be able to build a barb and finish the game on potd, a rogue or a fighter will be just be far stronger.  

 

Im only going to point out some the more obvious fatal weaknesses of the barb. There are far more though

 

1. THE FRENZY BUILD. This is flawed in so many ways I cant even begin where to start.

 

First of all it is not a passive ability like the rogues reckless assault (which is far stronger compared to frenzy anyway),

 

Secondly the frenzy has a surprisingly short time limit on it before it expires 12 seconds, (can be increased with INT)

 

Thirdly to activate this ability you need to do the equivalent of casting an average speed spell. The opportunity cost to this is that your Barbarian has to stand there and have a hissy fit at the start of combat while your other melee characters start to position. By the time the barbarian has positioned you would have lost probably 30% off the time from you frenzy duration.

 

Fourthly, you loose ten deflection from already a very deflection prone frontline character anyway. On path of the dammed this deflection is essential due to the enemies having higher accuracy and therefore being able to crit you more often. The Rogue loses 2 deflection from reckless assault (once upgraded) and as I have mentioned above the RA is vastly superior in the fist place even before taking this deflection penalty into consideration. 

 

2 MIN MAXING AND RAW STATS LATE GAME

 

1. You are absolutely forced to max your barbarians Intelligence even if you don't take the frenzy build, the barb is a frontline character so these are less points you can spend on str, dex, perc. These stats are essential to melee characters.

 

2. You absolutely must have high Perception on POTD. The barbarian has lower starting accuracy to fighters and rogues and the only strong point of the barbarian build is carnage which can apply afflictions with certain weapons on crits to mobs. You need the high Perc to land these crits.

 

3. Dexterity is the third most important stat to put points into,

 

3. Let me compare some raw stats from my late game fighter (after patch 2.03 to my late game barb) both builds with no weapons or armor equipped or any buffs activated, that's why I call them raw stats. To make my barbarian both survivable and able to deal damage on POTD I had to min max by barb as above and slightly dump some other stats. My fighter has min maxed in a melee classes strong points eg perception, might, resolve, dexterity

 

level 13 fighter deflection 79

level 13 barbarian deflection 49

 

level 13 fighter accuracy 69

level 13 barbarian accuracy 68 (remember I think PERC is the most important stat on POTD, may barbs perception here has been maxed to 20 and my fighters is 15) 

 

level 13 fighter health/ endurance  1008/202

level 13 barb health/ endurance  936/ 156 (this is with completely dumping the barbs con and leaving the fighters at 7, only 4 points difference. I was forced to do this to give the barb the other high stats it requires to be a viable melee character.

 

3. THE SUPPOSESED POWERFULL FORTIDUDE TARGETING CARANAGE CRITTING BUILD THAT WILL APPLY AFFLICTIONS TO MOBS.

 

1. This ability got nerfed to not include spell striking so jolt of touch will not work on it anymore

2. on POTD it is far harder to crit enemies then on lower difficulties. Even with Perc maxed and remember the barb has a lower accuracy compared to fighters and rogues

3. The carnage attack is made with a lowered accuracy, therefore making it even harder to apply cits and afflictions from these weapons

4. even if the crit is landed the mob will still get an opportunity to avoid the affliction by making a save and saves are increased on POTD.

5. Any wizard, cipher, druid, chanter, preist can apply a more powerful affliction eg stun, petrify , dominate to a mob when they are postioned out of melee combat. Guys seriously this is a STUPID STUPID build.

 

4. THE OPPORTUNITY COST OF MAKING A BARBARIAN.

 

1. Just to compensate for all the barbs weaknesses compared to fighters and rogues I had to select talents and abilities upon level just to make my barb able to do what a fighter and rogue can do anyway. Fighters and Rogues are able to select far more talents that  ADD to there abilities not ones that are selected to simply make up for major weaknesses

This quote above answers all the above barbarian lovers question. Like I have said on this you can still use a barbarian but a rogue or a fighter will be stronger. Just read the above and do your own trials like id. And this thread ClEARLY is not intended to include buffs from priests, wizards whatever , I should no I did the op

[Livegood118]

I'm kind of confused with this thread. If we can't take buffs from other classes in to consideration then is this for builds to solo the game? Why would you play a character in a party and not buff them with other chars?

Edited November 2, 2015 by Livegood118

[Zenbane]

brindle is really jaded by Barbarians lol

 

If anyone would like to read a more properly thought out Barbarian analysis, take at the work done by nerdcommando.gamestudios:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=416939844

[brindle88]

I'm kind of confused with this thread. If we can't take buffs from other classes in to consideration then is this for builds to solo the game? Why would you play a character in a party and not buff them with other chars?

Well for reasons of being able to compare classes adequately without taking into thousands of other combinations we are just looking at each class on its own merits. For synergies involving a multiple of classes that is a topic imam greatly interested in and I will start another thread on it soon.

 

The strongest synergy I have found I a cipher amplify waving, a druid relentless storming at the same time and then you melee classes having a field day. But let's try not to talk about that on this thread

[aweigh0101]

patch 2.03 makes fighters undisputed king of single-target DPS imho

-20% recovery from armored grace
-16% recovery from pilferer's grip

second chance scale mail (thanks eder!)

= 1% recovery time without taking into account any DEX bonuses. Straight up broken! LOVE IT.

gee, i think i'll use my base 1% recovery high deflection / high accuracy / high health / high endurance fighter to dual-wield purgatory and resolution, or hey, maybe i'll use the speed and durgan steel enchanted blade of the endless paths instead just for laughs while he plays Lawnmower Man with his spinning motor-arms.

Sure, the rogue might achieve slightly higher dmg numbers per swing ON CRITS, but he has low deflection / low health / endurance, and with the same gear will have 21% recovery time.

dunno bout you but i know who'll i'll be using.

PS: This also means fighters will make EXCELLENT gunners and bow-men, btw. With 20 DEX (godlike, dex-Land), actually, make that 23 dex once you slap finneah's grace on him, i'm p. sure he's gonna out-DPS a ranger.

Hell, if you can't be bothered to go get pilferer's grip (a TWM unique that doesn't require combat besides killing the initial ogres attacking stalwart), you can just slap a Hide Armor on him and achieve 0% recovery time.

Edited November 2, 2015 by aweigh0101

[brindle88]

patch 2.03 makes fighters undisputed king of single-target DPS imho

-20% recovery from armored grace

-16% recovery from pilferer's grip

second chance scale mail (thanks eder!)

= 1% recovery time without taking into account any DEX bonuses. Straight up broken! LOVE IT.

gee, i think i'll use my base 1% recovery high deflection / high accuracy / high health / high endurance fighter to dual-wield purgatory and resolution, or hey, maybe i'll use the speed and durgan steel enchanted blade of the endless paths instead just for laughs while he plays Lawnmower Man with his spinning motor-arms.

Sure, the rogue might achieve slightly higher dmg numbers per swing ON CRITS, but he has low deflection / low health / endurance, and with the same gear will have 21% recovery time.

dunno bout you but i know who'll i'll be using.

The rogue would beat it mate, the fighter would be more tanky though,

 

And what do you mean by 1% recovery time without taking into cons dex?

[Parasol_Syndicate]

As someone who likes the lore and feeling of playing a barbarian, I have to say I agree with the issues posted so far about the class. 

The fighter should be a better tank: This is achieved in spades. 

The barbarian should have higher dps rate: this largely isn't. Certainly not in the harder fights in the game (dragons, ogres, bosses)

 

Of course, with any semblance of balance, the barbarian would have the potential for higher single-target damage, too, because he's incapable of tanking. 

Nevermind the huge gulf in defences, and the fact that the fighter essentially gets heavier armor for free twice (through talents and less attribute dependency)

A frontline barbarian should not just be a rogue with muscles. 

Not precisely on topic, but I'd really love if the game provided for an OP barbarian. As it stands, not so much. 

Edited November 2, 2015 by Parasol_Syndicate

[aweigh0101]

well, we know attacks consist of two phases, melee attacks i mean: attack phase, which can ONLY be sped up by the DEX bonus, and the recovery phase (the yellow bar) which is the part affected by the recovery penalty on armors and such. a fighter can pick the armored grace ability for -20% recovery time, and this is substracted directly from the recovery penalty on whatever armor they're wearing. if you add the pilferer's grip item then it's an extra -16% on the armor's recovery time penalty.

a fighter wearing full plate for example, which has -50% recovery time penalty would then have -24% penalty instead, or in other terms have the same recovery as someone wearing Hide Armor (the one right before leather armor), but have 12 DR instead of 5 DR. 

now we take into account DEX bonus, which speeds up both phases, the attack AND the recovery, and it literally makes the fighter the fastest unit at the moment. you can give him full plate and have him be faster than someone wearing a robe, for example, give or take 5%, or give him a hide armor and have him attack at the same speed as someone NAKED.

when we take guns into account they have 3 phases, attack/recovery/reload, and their longest phase is by far the reload one which is only affected by DEX, same as the attack phase. bows on the other hand don't have a reload phase. 

in any case, you're right of course rogue will out-damage this speedy fighter on crits, but the fighter will be EXACTLY %50 tankier (rogue base deflection is 15, fighter's new base deflection is 30), with equal Accuracy as the rogue, 25% more  base endurance and 50% more base health and with access to two ability picks that give total of +25% dmg (weapon spec and weapon mastery). sure, not as crazy as the +55% the rogue's class abilities tack on but hey, still good!

obv. not mentioning the +20% from savage attack or the vulnerable attack since those two talents are universal. he'll crit less, as well, but will hit more often, and be even further tankier thanks to critical defense, unbending and unbroken. remember he can instant-cast +15 ACC for base duration of 15 seconds per-encounter too.

dual-wielding carries the least recovery out of all melee setups, being a base 20 frame of attack and 20 frame of recovery if using two fast weapons, and 30 attack / 30 recovery frames if using two average speed weapons. this means the armored grace + pilferer's grip fighter with 18-20 DEX dual-wielding Scimitars will out-DPS the Rogue on HITS, guaranteed, due to being faster overall than the rogue, so even if the rogue has more +DMG modifiers it'll even out, UNLESS the rogue starts critting. The rogue crits will put him ahead in the damage-per-swing race then. It all depends on the roll of the dice, then, since both have comparable ACC.

footnote: enemy immunities will put a legitimate dent in the rogue's reliance on sneak-attacks by the way, which is why i'm not taking into account the huge sneak attack dmg modifier when talking about this. a lot of mob types now are immune to blindness, hobbling, weakening, poison and sickening. watch the video posted in the 2.03 patch news announcement thread.

basically any mob that doesn't have eyes can't be blinded, any mob that doesn't have a biological system is immune to sickening/weakening, any mob that doesn't need to rely on their legs or floats can't be knocked prone, and any mob that doesn't have either corporeal form or is generally bipedal in nature is immune to almost everything; also enemy types that lack things such as a brain, for example a primordial ooze, or a dank spore, can't be charmed or confused, so on and so forth. the immunities are actually fairly logical IMHO, although the guy in the video is whining non stop about them.

flanking will still enable rogues to out-DPS anything of course, but this means rogues will require even more micro than before to guarantee sneak attacks, or relying on ciphers flanking spell. i dislike too much micro but that's personal state.

Edited November 2, 2015 by aweigh0101

[brindle88]

well, we know attacks consist of two phases, melee attacks i mean: attack phase, which can ONLY be sped up by the DEX bonus, and the recovery phase (the yellow bar) which is the part affected by the recovery penalty on armors and such. a fighter can pick the armored grace ability for -20% recovery time, and this is substracted directly from the recovery penalty on whatever armor they're wearing. if you add the pilferer's grip item then it's an extra -16% on the armor's recovery time penalty.

a fighter wearing full plate for example, which has -50% recovery time penalty would then have -24% penalty instead, or in other terms have the same recovery as someone wearing Hide Armor (the one right before leather armor), but have 12 DR instead of 5 DR. 

now we take into account DEX bonus, which speeds up both phases, the attack AND the recovery, and it literally makes the fighter the fastest unit at the moment. you can give him full plate and have him be faster than someone wearing a robe, for example, give or take 5%, or give him a hide armor and have him attack at the same speed as someone NAKED.

when we take guns into account they have 3 phases, attack/recovery/reload, and their longest phase is by far the reload one which is only affected by DEX, same as the attack phase. bows on the other hand don't have a reload phase. 

in any case, you're right of course rogue will out-damage this speedy fighter on crits, but the fighter will be EXACTLY %50 tankier (rogue base deflection is 15, fighter's new base deflection is 30), with equal Accuracy as the rogue, 25% more  base endurance and 50% more base health and with access to two ability picks that give total of +25% dmg (weapon spec and weapon mastery). sure, not as crazy as the +55% the rogue's class abilities tack on but hey, still good!

obv. not mentioning the +20% from savage attack or the vulnerable attack since those two talents are universal. he'll crit less, as well, but will hit more often, and be even further tankier thanks to critical defense, unbending and unbroken. remember he can instant-cast +15 ACC for base duration of 15 seconds per-encounter too.

dual-wielding carries the least recovery out of all melee setups, being a base 20 frame of attack and 20 frame of recovery if using two fast weapons, and 30 attack / 30 recovery frames if using two average speed weapons. this means the armored grace + pilferer's grip fighter with 18-20 DEX dual-wielding Scimitars will out-DPS the Rogue on HITS, guaranteed, due to being faster overall than the rogue, so even if the rogue has more +DMG modifiers it'll even out, UNLESS the rogue starts critting. The rogue crits will put him ahead in the damage-per-swing race then. It all depends on the roll of the dice, then, since both have comparable ACC.

footnote: enemy immunities will put a legitimate dent in the rogue's reliance on sneak-attacks by the way, which is why i'm not taking into account the huge sneak attack dmg modifier when talking about this. a lot of mob types now are immune to blindness, hobbling, weakening, poison and sickening. watch the video posted in the 2.03 patch news announcement thread.

Mate we have to leave the magic items out of it or we will be ranting on for ever, forget the pilferers grip or boots of consecrated ground or whatever.

 

But yes a fighter would wup a barbs arse

[aweigh0101]

the one thing the guy in the video says i 100% agree with is the new immunity clauses for most enemys really put a dent on barbarians. they're now even less useful, both their shout abilities are compromised and also their AoE-disabling. instead of prone-on-crit i think the most reliable/effective enchantments on uniques now are draining and the -5 defenses one, as no enemies are immune to those.

barbs are really getting shafted. time to start the buff barbs campaign i suppose.