A Cruel Party of Martial Dominants

[MalVeauX]

Heya,

 

So I've completed another enjoyable play through with a primary all caster party and it was fun, definitely got into the whole spell slinging thing.

 

I'm thinking of doing it again, a fast run, but knowing most of the game fairly well, I can do completionist type campaigns pretty quick now. I don't find the game terribly difficult, but I enjoy casually playing so no Expert Mode (hey, I like maimed as an option!) and no Path of the Damned (though I'm tempted to attempt this with a well thought out party, just not yet, want to do a few more play throughs with different approaches to the game first). So I'm thinking of doing what I haven't done yet, and that's a melee based party.

 

I'm also imposing that my character's choices are going to be cruel where possible, and likely kill anyone and anything I can get away with. Will probably steal as often as possible. Will choose aggressive stances in dialogue where cruel is not available.

 

So melee... and cruel. No talking out of things. Just straight up horrible attitude. And I'd like to do it with martial characters since that's not my norm at all.

 

Here's what I'm thinking (feel free to suggest something else!):

 

PC, Paladin (Bleak Walker, Cruel) - Melee DPS (two hand, Mig, Int, Dex; Athletics & Lore)

*** Faith & Conviction, Fighting Spirit, Lay on hands, Liberating Exhortation, Reviving Exhortation, Righteous Soul, Zealous Focus

*** The Black Path, Critical Focus, Two hand style, Weapon Focus Adventurer

 

Fighter - Primary Tank (Per, Res, Con and some Int; Althetics & Lore)

*** Constant Recover, Defender, Knock Down, Vigorous Defense, Unbending

*** Rapid Recovery, Wary Defender, Weapon & Shield Style, Superior Deflection

 

Fighter - Melee DPS (two hand, estoc probably for DR; Mig, Int, Dex; Athletics & Lore)

*** Armored Grace, Confident Aim, Constant Recovery, Knock Down (2), Fighting Spirit, Weapon Spec Adventurer

*** Two hand style, Vulnerable Attack, Weapon Focus Adventurer, Weapon Mastery Adventurer

 

Barbarian - Melee DPS (two hand, reach weapon, AOE; Mig, Int, Dex; Athletics & Lore)

*** Blooded, Brute Force, Carnage, Fighting Spirit, Frenzy, One Stands Alone, Savage Defiance

*** Barbaric Blow, Greater Frenzy, Accurate Carnage, Two hand style

 

Rogue - Melee DPS (primary mechanic, condition & sneak attacks; Mig, Int, Dex; Mechanics & Lore)

*** Crippling Strike, Deep Wounds, Dirty Fighting, Fighting Spirit, Reckless Assault, Sneak Attack, Withering Strike

*** Backstab, Viscous Fighting, One-handed style, Bloody Slaughter

 

From here, I'm wondering.... off-tank Priest or melee reach Priest? Or a 2nd Rogue?

 

Interested in some thoughts.

 

Very best,

 

[Fardragon]

Cleric of Skaen for RP reasons, but clerics of Wael are good with staves, and without ranged weapons you will need a lot of reach weapons, or most of your party wont be able to reach a target.

[gkathellar]

I'm not gonna lie, I saw your thread title and started thinking of BDSM jokes.

 

I'd really use the party's paladin as its main tank, since that's the only thing that Paladins do well. Besides, you should try running a Paladin full tank before 2.0 destroys that concept forever. Of course, since you're not doing PotD, you'll be fine either way.

 

For the Fighter tank: last I checked Rapid Recovery was kind of awful? That might have changed, it's been a while. Also, remember that Fighters in particular probably get at least as much from Might as from Con in tankiness, due to their recovery mechanics.

 

For the melee DPS, you probably want both Savage Attack and Vulnerable Attack. You can use both because of reasons. I'm not sure Armored Grace is worth it, but eh?

 

You might want to go two-weapon with the barbarian, if only because you already have a bunch of two-handers and you might as well get some mileage out of the game's prolific one-handed implements of destruction. Weapon Focus Ruffian is especially good for barbarians (which makes sense), as is Noble (which doesn't).

 

As for the Rogue? Personally, I'd go either full ranged or mixed ranged/melee, with quick switch and guns (ruffian, again, is very good for this). But that's just a matter of personal preference.

 

Monk could make for an interesting sixth man. Monks are fabulous off-tanks.

[Torm51]

Why would 2.0 destroy paladin tanks?

[Fardragon]

You can make much more effective use of Carnage if Barbarian has a reach weapon.

 

Since you can really only fight two abreast in doorways and corridors, four party members are going to need reach weapons or ranged weapons.

 

I agree with making the paladin the main tank, and perhaps switching the tank fighter for a monk. With a party like this, you don't need to be as worried about tanking, since no one will be all that squashy.

Edited July 6, 2015 by Fardragon

[MalVeauX]

Hrm,

 

Food for thought.

 

I'm wondering if this will be do-able, with a less than 6 man party. Maybe 4 man party? Barb, Fighter, Rogue, Priest? Or substitute Fighter for Paladin (self healing tank?).

 

I'm just thinking through the game and how this party might even begin to approach certain fights (the big fights, not just normal trash mobs).

 

I'm thinking a priest will be pretty important though.

 

The alternative, is to make a *gasp* balanced martial group that isn't just a bunch of min/maxed specialists, all wearing plate, all with self-heals where possible, and focus on consumables and scrolls and potions for each character, and just have everyone capable of minor tanking and decent melee output. But this seems less fun to me in general if not in a real RPG where that matters, instead of a linear cRPG where you already know what's needed and what's not. Con for example, in the current game, seems near pointless for any character and I've played through with tanks, casters, etc, all kinds, 3 times now, and none of them had a Con higher than 3 or 5.

 

Very best,

[MalVeauX]

Heya,

 

So it has begun...

 

 

So far, here's my party:

 

PC - Barbarian (Mig, Dex, Int), will focus on skills for damage increase, speed increase and accuracy increase, AOE & Reach, no armor other than enchanted clothing.

Paladin (Int, Per, Res), focusing on heals and support skills, defensive talents that increase tankiness. Will take a single offensive talent for a weapon swap when not tanking.

Fighter (Mig, Per, Res), off-tank, focusing on a mix of offense & defensive talents and skills.

Rogue (Mig, Dex, Int), focusing on high accuracy, high speed, will sneak attack and crit as often as possible. Will have a reach weapon as 2nd switch.

Priest (Mig, Int, Res), focusing on support, but taking some talents to be able to hit things with a reach two hander and do some damage.

 

I'm mixing in a lot of reach, so it's 2 non-reach, the rest with reach as a swap where I can. I know I can run into issues with this if I choke some areas and I'm ok with that for now. I'm more interested in how it will be when I don't have an obvious choke point and things scatter and being able to destroy anything that passes my tank(s) quickly, instead of a caster that gets swatted around.

 

I've yet to get that 6th member. I'm trying to figure out where to go from there. My natural instinct is to add a Wizard for the awesome support spells I could get, but I don't want a dedicated caster and will focus on scrolls. It's bad enough I caved and added a Priest, but I just like how wicked they are and their support spells are massive for a party like this and I will no doubt need the revives & heals later on. My second go-to was a Chanter, but I always play with Chanters and want to avoid that this time for variety. I'm still not sold on a monk. I just don't like their overall class I guess. Won't include a Druid, since I already have a Priest (too bad Druids cannot specialize in melee and stay shapeshifted indefinitely in encounters... otherwise, a werewolf druid would be in my party right away, let alone an entire party of wolf druids, how cool would that be). I thought about another Barb or Rogue. And I'm thinking about a Ranger. But I'm not sure what a Ranger will really add, since I wanted to focus on melee mostly. I might have to build a Ranger and see what it looks like from a melee perspective.

 

Onwards to slapping servants!

 

Very best,

Edited July 7, 2015 by MalVeauX

[MalVeauX]

Heya,

 

So maybe I'll swallow it and just go with a Ranger. Still a martial character. Primarily for singling out a target, like anti-wizard/priest duty. I'll let him use a bow primarily, with a nasty companion animal based on DPS as well, utilizing Mark and other high speed, high accuracy, high damage output methods at range to nuke something. Will focus on Lore for him since he will have little need of anything else (stealth in the current game is a joke really, the 2.0 changes on stealth are very welcome and invite an interesting party of Rogues & other characters that build around that concept, so I'll do that then) beyond athletics splashed in.

 

So... Ranger it is.

 

Very best,

[MalVeauX]

Update:

 

On an interesting note, now already facing the challenges of choke points and not being able to reach an opponent some times, and having used the Paladin, Fighter, Rogue, Ranger, Barbarian, etc, I'm starting to think of something. I like how Zealous Focus works with the Rogue with single weapon style for the accuracy bump and graze conversion, he's critting non-stop, so he's dropping lots of wonderful DPS (he's currently naked with max Dex). The Barb with a reach weapon, also naked with high Dex, is also doing loads of damage and his AOE helps against the trash mobs from behind the two front line tanks. Ranger does pretty nice damage too, and the aura from the Paladin actually reaches him often due to that big Int.

 

I had to pull the Priest back, and resort to a ranged weapon on him. Which works out well anyways so he can keep alive to support everyone with his spells.

 

But I have to wonder... does a high dex, high accuracy based, AOE barb with a reach weapon end up doing more single and mob damage, than a rogue who single targets only? Kind of curious on that and will see how it plays out I suppose.

 

Very best,

[Fardragon]

The Rogue would do more damage, unless you are fighting hordes of wimpy enemies. Barbarians are for clearing out the trash.

[MalVeauX]

The Rogue would do more damage, unless you are fighting hordes of wimpy enemies. Barbarians are for clearing out the trash.

 

Thanks,

 

So far, my Rogue is definitely single target destroying quite nicely with all the accuracy and crit modifiers and the paladin's zealous aura focus with more crit help. The barbarian is cleaning out the weenies nicely. The Ranger & Rogue are doing well at picking off, quickly, the casters. So far so good.

 

Kind of weird for me to play all these martial characters, as I'm so much more used to casters.

 

But, oh, it's great to be cruel...

 

 

Very best,

Edited July 7, 2015 by MalVeauX