Rostere Posted March 3, 2015 Posted March 3, 2015 Sure, he is popular in Russia buts because Putin controls the narrative within Russia and the media. So Russians see what he wants them to see, I find it amazing that your definition of a popular leader is someone who decides that censorship and propaganda are the way to control political support to ensure his popularity ratings It might not make him "genuinely" popular, but it sure counts as popular in every practical way. Plus, all media have degrees of bias so nobody is completely innocent here. The fact that Russia looks like it does today is a product of a political climate which has morphed into it's current form during decades. We might think it's inexplicable that there is not any other political actor who manages to get a share of Putin's vote. In a Western country, another party would quickly rise which is a closer match to outlying segments of Putin voters. You would get roughly the same political views, but a clearer opposition. Russia are still stuck in the leader cult phase, which most European countries left during the 1900s. Personally, I blame it all on the Yeltsin era and the failure of Western countries to provide some kind of Marshall Aid package to post-Soviet countries (sadly, that would never happen without two competing global ideologies...). 1 "Well, overkill is my middle name. And my last name. And all of my other names as well!"
obyknven Posted March 3, 2015 Posted March 3, 2015 Nemtsov was banging an Ukrainian model, his wife maybe just hired a hitman. This Russian fat/senile political loser has a better escort girl than Western high-ranked reptiloids.
HoonDing Posted March 3, 2015 Posted March 3, 2015 You deliberately left out Berlusconi. 1 The ending of the words is ALMSIVI.
Zoraptor Posted March 3, 2015 Posted March 3, 2015 Personally, I blame it all on the Yeltsin era and the failure of Western countries to provide some kind of Marshall Aid package to post-Soviet countries (sadly, that would never happen without two competing global ideologies...). Just blame it on Yeltsin, really. The west didn't help, but Yeltsin was just terrible and poisoned the well for any 'liberal'* successor. The neoliberal privatisations and kleptocratic oligarchs were stupid and stupidly implemented at least partly on western advice, but he could have said no. And he picked Putin as successor. The west wasn't obligated to help, their worst contribution was contributing deliberately to the sense of humiliation, triumphalism and then being such narcissists as to be surprised at the revanchist response. Which is ironic really, ask any western leader and they'll say that Putin has squandered/ subverted the Russian democracy Yeltsin bequeathed him, but they gleefully humiliated Yeltsin at every step and made him a laughing stock themselves. Which is partly why Nemtsov himself was such a footnote, too much association with Yeltsin, and too many western politicians trying to big him up as if western endorsement isn't politically counter productive in Russia. *except Zhirinovsky's incredibly inaptly named Liberal party.
obyknven Posted March 4, 2015 Posted March 4, 2015 High-ranked reptiloids You deliberately left out Berlusconi. Italy?! lolwut?
HoonDing Posted March 4, 2015 Posted March 4, 2015 Stop photoshopping. The ending of the words is ALMSIVI.
Malcador Posted March 4, 2015 Posted March 4, 2015 (edited) I think the real problem with showing Berlusconi's is that the forum can't support photos of that many women. But anyway, he has better taste than Clinton (he really chose them for personalities I guess) - http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-11982228 Edited March 4, 2015 by Malcador Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra
obyknven Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 I think problem in different beauty standards of reptiloids. \ Or they just too jealous to anyone who is more beautiful than they are. Actually this is looks like modern Western elites become a closed society of neo-Aristocracy and their genetic degradation due inbreeding can be noted even by their appearance. Because of this war of reptiloids against all non-reptiloids is a war of ugliness against beauty also, http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=da&u=http://konservativungdom.dk/kandidatdatabase/nikita-klaestrup&prev=search
HoonDing Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Nice cherrypicking. 2 The ending of the words is ALMSIVI.
obyknven Posted March 6, 2015 Posted March 6, 2015 Ukrainian model fly away from scary Russia into Kiev where she become threatened by unknown people, her life in danger now. Western involvement in murder of Russian opposition leader looks not so laughable now.https://translate.google.ru/translate?hl=ru&sl=uk&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gp.gov.ua%2Fua%2Fnews.html%3F_m%3Dpublications%26_c%3Dview%26_t%3Drec%26id%3D152058
Gromnir Posted March 7, 2015 Author Posted March 7, 2015 http://www.npr.org/blogs/parallels/2015/03/05/390754346/boris-nemtsov-he-directed-his-words-against-putin-himself "I haven't seen any real hypothesis. Lets face it: Boris Nemtsov was shot on one of the main bridges of Moscow just 100 meters from Kremlin, which is heavily surveilled by the security cameras, which is under control of the Russian power institutions. If you try to do a photo op at the Moscow bridge where Boris was shot you would immediately face a policeman. "By now we know that for four days, nonstop, he was followed by different cars. We know whoever conducted the killing told his driver to go home, and he was going back to his apartment on foot. We know there were four bullets — one went directly into the heart, another directly into his head, another one in the liver, and another one in the stomach. All shot from the back. "Police came to the place of the killing in 12 minutes. They immediately announced a special measure to get the car with the killer inside. They managed not to get this car, and several days after Nemstov's murder no one [has been] caught. "They don't know, or pretend they don't know, or don't want to catch anyone. So really, you know, it's just a joke. "So there are two hypothesis: Either the so-called Russian law enforcement can't do their job — except for following the opposition, tapping their phones and putting peaceful opposition leaders into jail — or they don't want to do their job, and that suggests that they were part of this plot to kill Boris." "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Zoraptor Posted March 7, 2015 Posted March 7, 2015 Man, I can't be the only person getting sick of all these tinfoil conspiracy theorists running rampant in the forums, can I? :smug: Russians, always exactly as competent/ incompetent as required by the desired narrative. If it were a fiction novel all the Dei Ex Machinae would make it an extraordinarily bad fiction novel.
Gromnir Posted March 7, 2015 Author Posted March 7, 2015 unintended irony is always best. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Zoraptor Posted March 7, 2015 Posted March 7, 2015 And as if on cue, arrests made, two men of Caucasian origin if my knowledge of Russian surnames is accurate.
Gromnir Posted March 7, 2015 Author Posted March 7, 2015 yes, it is "as if on cue," isn't it? HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Malcador Posted March 7, 2015 Posted March 7, 2015 Not sure why they would bother bumping him off, at least with respect to Ukraine, Russia's enemies are already convinced that Russia is involved enough so this proof in his report is rather redundant at this point, no ? Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra
Gromnir Posted March 7, 2015 Author Posted March 7, 2015 http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2015/03/01/world/list-grows-of-putin-critics-who-met-violent-deaths/#.VPsvIPnF9j4 sadly, the same reasoning can be used for virtual all folks on the linked list. one need only study the methodology o' other police states to understand why such regimes is so concerned with controlling the dialog. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Malcador Posted March 7, 2015 Posted March 7, 2015 Eventually they may learn character assassination via media is much better, really. All States are about that I guess Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra
Gromnir Posted March 7, 2015 Author Posted March 7, 2015 police states is fragile. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Zoraptor Posted March 7, 2015 Posted March 7, 2015 yes, it is "as if on cue," isn't it? Well yes, as a way of refuting someone who was quoting "So there are two hypothesis [sic]" it was perfectly on cue since it didn't fit either of the two hypotheses. The whole situation is, of course, perfectly set up for anti Russian bigotry, fanned by the usual suspects in the press. Arrests not made: well now, that's convenient! Arrests made: well now, that's also convenient! Anything and everything is indicative of conspiracy, working back from the premise that Putin controls everything that happens in Russia. Yes, and Obola deliberately tried to get the US infected with Ebola to further his lieberal agenda despite it having no purpose whatsoever. If Putin wanted Nemtsov out of the way he could have given him the Navalny or Khordokovsky treatment, indeed Nemtsov did exactly what got Navalny thrown into jail recently as well. Simply put, Nemtsov was far too unimportant to warrant assassination when easy judicial remedies existed. (There's a plethora of other 'as competent/ incompetent as needed for the narrative' examples around too. eg the whole Russian soldiers in Ukraine thing where everything is used as 'proof', even mutually exclusive stuff. There's 1000 of them. No, 8000!, No, 18000 soldiers there!!! What's that you say? Only 2% of captives/ pows have been Russian citizens (let alone soldiers)? Well, that's because the Russians are sending in all their modern equipment and slaughtering Ukrainians who cannot fight back! But, we also estimate we've killed 4000 Russian soldiers, because they're being used as expendable cannon fodder! Well, the Russians must be... using radio controlled suicide capsules to explain how only 2% of captives are Russian citizens but 66% of those who have died in the entire war are Russian soldiers, it's Putin so you know he'd do it! Though of course, to some it's pointing out those inconsistencies that is the 'conspiracy theory', not the spouting of the mutually exclusive/ implausible 'evidence' itself.)
Fighter Posted March 7, 2015 Posted March 7, 2015 (edited) Eventually they may learn character assassination via media is much better, really. All States are about that I guess Russian media wiped the floor with opposition to the point where their popularity is barely a bleep. yes, it is "as if on cue," isn't it? HA! Good Fun! Actually regardless of whatever your favorite theory is it is fully believable they got the people who pushed the trigger. Edited March 7, 2015 by Fighter
Gromnir Posted March 7, 2015 Author Posted March 7, 2015 (edited) yes, it is "as if on cue," isn't it? The whole situation is, of course, perfectly set up for anti Russian bigotry, fanned by the usual suspects in the press. Arrests not made: well now, that's convenient! Arrests made: well now, that's also convenient! Anything and everything is indicative of conspiracy, working back from the premise that Putin controls everything that happens in Russia. for a guy s'posed tired of the conspiracy theories, you sure do like to indulge. muslims, oligarchs, and o' 'course, the yellow journalists... oh my. is funny. HA! Good Fun! ps we thought it were obvious that the criticism were that the russians were either not investigating genuine or that they were incompetent. simple observing the making of arrests doesn't change the validity o' the criticisms... or it shouldn't. Edited March 7, 2015 by Gromnir "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Malcador Posted March 7, 2015 Posted March 7, 2015 Hm wouldn't say suspecting a narrative in the media is a conspiracy. Certainly have noticed a lot of "Russia is bad" in the news here, before no one cared but with Canada's..ahem, saber rattling of late... Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra
Gromnir Posted March 7, 2015 Author Posted March 7, 2015 disbelief o' western journalism because it is western journalism? sorry, but that sounds like conspiracy to us. suspicion o' US satellite imagery that convinced western leaders to impose sanctions in spite o' the billions o' dollars such sanctions would cost germany and france and others? ok, just a suspicious guy. we can respect that. suspicious o' the former head o' russian treasury regarding the impact o' western sanctions on the ruble and russian economy? well, that makes tougher. sure, he gots the conspiracy theory that makes all western new sources suspect (convenient), but suspicious o' Alexei Kudrin and other russians? such suspicion is particularly odd in light o' the number o' putin critics that has died violently since 1998. Not suspicious o' the growing pile o' corpses? Not suspicious o' the recent arrest? doesn't seem like zor is a natural suspicious guy after all. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)
Malcador Posted March 7, 2015 Posted March 7, 2015 Heh, ok, if being untrustworthy of western media is being conspiracy theorist. Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra
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