Multiclassing and Prestige classes.

[Sharrack]

There should be multiclassing but limited so that you have your main class but are able to add in a limited amount of pieces of other classes. Also you shouldn't be able to select specific traits of the others but only predifined sets of their feats and some sets are prerequisites of others, also not the whole set is chosen at once but everything in a set becomes available to chose from on later level ups.

 

For example let's say the fighter has a set of basic melee feats and a set of swordfighting feats and you as a mage want one or more of those swordfighting feats then first you would have to gain access to the basic melee and take a certain amount of feats, perhaps even some specific ones to unlock the ability to make the swordfighting feat-set part of your levelup choices. Also the amount of sets out of classes foreign to your chosen class should be limited.

 

Prestige classes should be handled the same, each prestige class gets one or more sets of feats, again with dependencies within and between sets and a limited amount of possible sets active at the same time. So let's say the amount of prestige sets is limited to 2 then you could either take the low tier sets of two PCs or specialize in one by making your second choice a high tier set of the same PC you choose first.

 

Also both, multiclassing and prestige classes, should have prerequisites within the main class, for example a cleric could a have a set of melee feats, which, if he puts enough choices into, would allow him to make a set of the warriors weapon specialization sets part of his multiclass choices. So your non-warrior has to go somewhat into the warrior direction before he can multiclass into it.

 

Now there is the problem of what to gain if i don't multiclass. My solution would be to add end tier sets to each class, which can only be taken if you mained into that class and take up several of your multiclass choices, for example the magic school of "utther destruction and world domination" could only be taken by someone who mained in mage and hasn't taken any multiclass choices while the school of "quite some destruction and nation subjugation" could be taken with 3 free multiclass choices but again only by a mage (only problem now is to make those high level abilities worthwhile without making multiclassing worthless). This way could even be employed for prestige classes, you have for example 6 multiclass choices and each prestige class set needs 3 of them. This would depend on, if prestige classing is something that is seen as a fixed part of progression or an option.

[Osvir]

I'm a fan of the Archetype system Pathfinder threw in, where you can adjust the default class template with a different flavored set of abilities. Here's the fighter ones for example. They also have one for Races and a pseudo-point buy of sorts for racial features, but I hear designing one from scratch is a little broken, although I don't know specifically why. It changes the Prestige Classes/Multi-class thought from a "must have" to a much more optional situation.

 

^This is kind of what I am going for in my wall of text (See signature).

 

Weapons = Alters Class.

 

A Fighter with a Bow would still be a Fighter, but gain Weapon Abilities from the Bow apart from the Fighter Class Abilities. A Ranger would still be a faster and more precise shot, whilst the Fighter would be a stronger shot, less accurate and slower. Mechanically you would have a Fighter/Ranger, but roleplayingly it would be a Fighter with a Bow. Same thing with a Fighter and a Grimoire, it'd be a Fighter, he'd just dabble in the Dark Arts (with limited/restricted Magic due to his Class).

 

A Chanter could pick up the Sword & Board, being able to fight close range and combine the Chanter's Class Abilities close range (Knockback Shockwave Sonic Scream a la Force Push to the Enemy Face? Yes.. yes.. *Mr. Burns* )

 

A Fighter with an Instrument would allow him to do some Bardic Songs and/or use it in battle somehow. He'd be a bad singer, but perhaps that could be an Ability in itself? (False Song)

 

As P:E is said to be a world where Magic is common, how is it common? Would weapons/items themselves be tied to various Elements? What are the Elements in P:E?

 

Fire, Earth, Water, Wind, Metal?

 

A Lantern = Fire

A Metal Staff = Vibration, the Chanter can tune his voice and use the staff to send out shockwaves of vibration, use it as a tool for abilities?

A Staff in the Hands of a Monk/Melee = Asks of the lands (hit Earth, rock barrage towards the enemy, never striking directly at the enemy. A Fighter wouldn't be able to send waves of Earth at the enemy but perhaps strike the enemy directly with an Elemental Effect)

A Staff in the Hands of a Druid = Takes & Gives to the land.

A Staff in the Hands of a Wizard = Only Takes from the land, not giving anything back.

 

I have pretty much thought out Weapon = Element/Usage for all Classes and different ways to do it. Should I post it or just drop it?

 

A Weapon Based System allows for so much more "specializaton". Instead of just magically press a "Multi-Class" button in the UI and you are suddenly a Fighter/Thief. If the Sword & Board benefits the Fighter somehow, making a Rogue more "Fighter-ish" is an easy task. Likewise, if the Two-Handed is more tied to the Barbarian, making a Wizard a Wizard/Barbarian is instantly more easier and logical.

 

Having Weapon Abilities and Class Abilities differ, be their own "Trees" if you will. Weapons being a Style and not just a "High Damaging Weapon" a la "This Sword is way stronger than my Mace so I got to switch!". Have the Mace actually be beneficial so the question of "Should I switch to this Sword that is stronger but at the price of loosing some Mace abilities??".

 

This is a 6 man party game, so you'd be able to cover many weapon styles over your entire group, being able to make One Body in Combat.

[lolaldanee]

what i would really like:

the starting class only defines your starting abilities, but every class can learn every skill there is, albeit they would have to invest a few levels only to get to the point where other classes start

[Osvir]

^I'm with you. Pretty much what I'm going for, though instead if weapons are tied to classes, that'd be one way to do it. You'd never be a Ranger because you chose a Fighter, but you'd still be able to use some techniques and abilities of the Ranger if you wield a Bow.

 

A Level 5 Ranger with Level 2 in Bows would have Ranger Abilities & Bow Abilities

A Level 5 Fighter with Level 2 in Bows would have Fighter Abilities & Bow Abilities

A Level 5 Wizard with Level 2 in Bows would have Wizard Abilities & Bow Abilities

etc. etc.

 

See what I'm getting at?

[Radwulf]

I really don't think there should be multi classing. I found when playing NWN2 that the fact that I had to research and prepare my multi class build before I played sucked a lot of the fun out of it, and it's almost like the entire system pushes you in that direction.

 

With separate classes they can focus all of their balancing efforts on create distinct roles and abilities that can complement each other whilst providing sufficient flexibility to accommodate different items (such as armour) and play styles within the theme of that character.

 

Whether to play as a traditional or armoured mage and other similar choices as well as appropriate feats and skills should be their equivalent of prestige classes. You could get a prestige class subtitle according to your sub class playstyle dependent on your feat loadout and achievements.

[teknoman2]

considering how the character progression will not be restricted by the class, save a few basic stuff, and by assigning skills you can have a stealthy warrior or wizard, or a wizard that fights in melee or a silver tongued barbarian or anything else you want, i'd say multiclassing is in but not in the conventional way.

now prestige classes, are classes that allow to combine characteristics of other classes in one to get a better result than taking levels in the 2 classes separatelly, or that allow for higher specialization in certain abilities. since there is no limit to how specialized the character can be in a certain skill or how to combine abilities from various classes, i dont see the point of having prestige classes