A NEW Type of Class

[Frenetic Pony]

So, in fictional works there's an archetype of character that is very popular, but has never been a class for an RPG. Probably because it would be hard to do so, especially as so many things are combat focused. And that's the clever archetype. A character that uses their charm and wits more than bashing heads.

 

Think of Jack Sparrow, or Tyrion Lannister. Or how much Gandalf and Dumbledore just use their wits rather than any magic in particular.

 

Now, granted, this is all non combat stuff. But as non combat mechanics they could be fascinating to use. Imagine a character that can distract intelligent enemy types while the rest of your party sneaks past (or get into position...). Or being able to convince a band of ugly little goblin like critters (goblins?) to just join on your side of the fight.

 

And, I know, combat is a huge part. So what combat mechanics could this class bring? I'd imagine something described as a "Captain" type class, that gives non magical buffs for your party and de-buffs against enemies would work. Mark an enemy and your party gets plus to hit against them. "Encouragement" could give bonus damage and/or a better chance to dodge enemies. Some string of distracting insults could make the Captain, or whatever class this is called, the target (aggro) for a lot of enemies.

 

Imagine using the aggro draw ability "your mother smells like elf in heat!" and then running back to your trap laden corridor, drawing an entire room full of enemies in behind you. Or just drawing them behind you, swallowing an invisibility potion, and then getting your party past to that cave your supposed to go into, all without starting a fight.

 

Meaning, overall, there's a possibility I see here for a class that hasn't been done before. I'm sure others see it to.

[ogrezilla]

So, in fictional works there's an archetype of character that is very popular, but has never been a class for an RPG. Probably because it would be hard to do so, especially as so many things are combat focused. And that's the clever archetype. A character that uses their charm and wits more than bashing heads.

 

Think of Jack Sparrow, or Tyrion Lannister. Or how much Gandalf and Dumbledore just use their wits rather than any magic in particular.

 

Now, granted, this is all non combat stuff. But as non combat mechanics they could be fascinating to use. Imagine a character that can distract intelligent enemy types while the rest of your party sneaks past (or get into position...). Or being able to convince a band of ugly little goblin like critters (goblins?) to just join on your side of the fight.

 

And, I know, combat is a huge part. So what combat mechanics could this class bring? I'd imagine something described as a "Captain" type class, that gives non magical buffs for your party and de-buffs against enemies would work. Mark an enemy and your party gets plus to hit against them. "Encouragement" could give bonus damage and/or a better chance to dodge enemies. Some string of distracting insults could make the Captain, or whatever class this is called, the target (aggro) for a lot of enemies.

 

Imagine using the aggro draw ability "your mother smells like elf in heat!" and then running back to your trap laden corridor, drawing an entire room full of enemies in behind you. Or just drawing them behind you, swallowing an invisibility potion, and then getting your party past to that cave your supposed to go into, all without starting a fight.

 

Meaning, overall, there's a possibility I see here for a class that hasn't been done before. I'm sure others see it to.

 

I love the idea of being able to play the game like that, but I don't think that needs to be a separate class. Every class should have the ability to do a lot of work through non-combat options if properly built for it. Tyrion Lannister, for example, would be a fighter with very low combat stats but very high non-combat stats. He doesn't fight often, but when he does fight, he does so like a fighter. Jack Sparrow doesn't really fit any class of this setting, but in a world of that type he'd be a swashbuckler just focused on non-combat skills. Gandalf and Dumbledore are obviously wizards or mages in this case.

 

So I like the general idea of that playstyle. I just disagree with it being its own class. I mean, what you described in the combat paragraph could work for a class, but the rest of the stuff shouldn't be locked to a specific class.

Edited October 11, 2012 by ogrezilla

[Ieo]

Sounds like you combined the captain and burglar classes of LotRO.

 

I don't like many aspects of MMO threat/aggro mechanics in an SP party game, though (details in the aggro thread).

 

And to be honest, I think we have enough classes now (with paladin and chanter). They have to work on all the combat mechanics and class skills and balance everything....

[Jarmo]

Sparrow and Tyrion are rogues.

 

Sparrow might be 2nd edition one, with a swashbuckler kit.

 

Tyrion is not high level and has put all points on knowledge and speech skills,

a bit on acrobacy but nothing to traditional thievery (a diplomat build).

 

Gandalf has to use mainly his wits because that's all he has.

The guy is a badly built 1st level wizard, who's put all his points into WIS instead of INT.

He knows a single cantrip, a zero level light which he can maintain for a couple of seconds once a day.

He also has a magic staff he relies on, the one that casts a weak 1st level burning hands.

 

Dumbledore is just a cheat. Leveled up and all stats maxed by a console hack.

Not quite as blatantly as Elminster, but enough to be banned from all servers.

Edited October 11, 2012 by Jarmo

[rjshae]

I've seen this implemented as an "Adventurer" class. IIRC, it's basically the combat skills of a cleric combined with many of the non-combat skills of the rogue, but with little or no spell-casting ability. You could get something similar by multi-classing as a Fighter/Rogue.

[ogrezilla]

Sparrow and Tyrion are rogues.

 

Sparrow might be 2nd edition one, with a swashbuckler kit.

 

Tyrion is not high level and has put all points on knowledge and speech skills,

a bit on acrobacy but nothing to traditional thievery (a diplomat build).

 

Gandalf has to use mainly his wits because that's all he has.

The guy is a badly built 1st level wizard, who's put all his points into WIS instead of INT.

He knows a single cantrip, a zero level light which he can maintain for a couple of seconds once a day.

He also has a magic staff he relies on, the one that casts a weak 1st level burning hands.

 

Dumbledore is just a cheat. Leveled up and all stats maxed by a console hack.

Not quite as blatantly as Elminster, but enough to be banned from all servers.

I'm going to be nerdy enough to tell you that your gandolf discription is no good. He clearly has a LOT of magical power backing his fighting abilities. He didn't kill the Balrog in a head on fight with nothing but wisdom. Simply put, he was one of the most poweful beings in middle-earth. </nerd>

[Elerond]

Gandalf cheated against that balrog, because he carried Narrya (ring of fire), one of the three rings with him. That is not just fair fight

[Jarmo]

Sparrow and Tyrion are rogues.

 

Sparrow might be 2nd edition one, with a swashbuckler kit.

 

Tyrion is not high level and has put all points on knowledge and speech skills,

a bit on acrobacy but nothing to traditional thievery (a diplomat build).

 

Gandalf has to use mainly his wits because that's all he has.

The guy is a badly built 1st level wizard, who's put all his points into WIS instead of INT.

He knows a single cantrip, a zero level light which he can maintain for a couple of seconds once a day.

He also has a magic staff he relies on, the one that casts a weak 1st level burning hands.

 

Dumbledore is just a cheat. Leveled up and all stats maxed by a console hack.

Not quite as blatantly as Elminster, but enough to be banned from all servers.

I'm going to be nerdy enough to tell you that your gandolf discription is no good. He clearly has a LOT of magical power backing his fighting abilities. He didn't kill the Balrog in a head on fight with nothing but wisdom. Simply put, he was one of the most poweful beings in middle-earth. </nerd>

 

Buah, he didn't fight the balrog.

He just tricked it into a crossing which broke under balrogs weight. The poking of the bridge with the stick was just for show.

Even that he fumbled though, faelling alongside the monster and had to be saved by the railroading DM.

"Fighting all the way down while falling" was just his embellishment, the old coot was probably shrieking in terror.

Edited October 11, 2012 by Jarmo

[eimatshya]

Gandalf fights primarily with a sword, so he'd be more like a multi-class fighter/mage. Although, since he isn't actually a member of a playable race (the Wizards, or Istari, are all Maiar, that is, minor deities (or angels depending on how you want to view Tolkien's cosmology)), it would be more accurate to name him Istari class; available to Maiar only.

 

Anyway, pedantic nerdery out of the way, I agree that OPs suggestion doesn't really have to be a unique class. It would be easier to just allow players to buy feats focused on charisma or cunning. I played an Iron Heroes campaign in which one of the other players used feats and starting traits to build a charisma-based Man-at-Arms. He was very effective in some situations, but in others he was somewhat gimped because many fantasy monsters aren't really aware of things like charisma. His charisma based powers didn't work to well against flesh-oozes (although since the use magic device skill is, for some reason, charisma based, he did save us when we got swarmed by hell-wasps by activating this magic staff that we had found in some dungeon that shot out area effect cold bursts).