Well my intrest in NWN2 just tripled =)

[EUIX]

Is Warlock a prestige class?

[Volourn]

"Off topic, but holy crap do you play NWN a lot Volo."

 

Yes, yes I do.

 

 

"A red dragon is not weak. It would seem that the game is flawed ithen if a familiar can survive."

 

Not really. As I have been trying to point out through this entire thread, familiars are no longer the weaklings of 2E. In 3E (and 3.5) they ar every useful at all levels. That said, breath weapon or no, an ancient red dragon would completely oblireate a familiar. Or animal companion. Or fighter. Or cleric. Or mage. or rogue. You get the idea. LOL

 

Just because the familiar cna survive one aspect of the red dragon offensive repetoire doesn't mean it actually has a chance.

 

 

P.S. NWN RULES ALL! NWN2 SHOULD RULE ALL X2!!!

 

 

edit: Euix, no, it's a Base Class in 3.5 supposedly.

Edited January 18, 2006 by Volourn

[Weiser_Cain]

Is Warlock a prestige class?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No, it's a new base class.

[Deraldin]

Errr...is your math sound?

 

Why would you take max damage and divide it by the total HP?

 

 

I mean, if Max damage = min damage = 120, then the only chance it has for survival if its HP is less than or equal to 120 is if the evasion roll succeeds.

 

You'd need to do a whole schlock of work, determining the probabilities of each damage time and all that for yours to work.  I mean, a guy with 1 HP and a Reflex save of +23432 is probably going to survive more often than not.

 

 

Though you did comment that you didn't want to calculate the reflex save.

 

Even then, if it takes 120 damage and has no reflex save...then how does it surivive 1/3 of the time if it has 40 HP?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I wasn't trying to say that the dragon will always do 120 damage. I was referring to how 120 is the maximum damage that a dragon can do and not always what it will do. Most of the time it will do less. About a third of the time it will do 40HP or less.

 

EDIT: It makes sense to my sleep deprived brain. Yay exam time. <_<

Edited January 18, 2006 by Deraldin

[alanschu]

It would do less than 40 damage 1/3 of the time, if it had an equal probability of doing 1-120 damage.

 

But the damage is 12-120, with an expected value of 60.

 

Using your equation, if the Familiar had 12 HP, then 120/12 would mean a 10% chance of survival. But, the minimum damage is actually 12, which means that the familiar would die 100% of the time it fails its reflex save.

 

 

Get some sleep

Edited January 18, 2006 by alanschu

[Deraldin]

It would do less than 40 damage 1/3 of the time, if it had an equal probability of doing 1-120 damage.

 

But the damage is 12-120, with an expected value of 60.

 

Using your equation, if the Familiar had 12 HP, then 120/12 would mean a 10% chance of survival.  But, the minimum damage is actually 12, which means that the familiar would die 100% of the time it fails its reflex save.

 

 

Get some sleep

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah, I thought about that after I posted everything else, but it didn't click that I had to go back and edit. I think maybe I'll do that later.

 

I wish I could get some sleep. <_< I've got less than 5 hours during which to finish project/presentation that is worth 15% of my final grade and I'm only about half done. I need more caffeine... It's going to be a long day today.

[Diamond]

But the damage is 12-120, with an expected value of 60.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If it would be Gaussian distribution. But it is uniform, so you can expect any value between 12 and 120 with same probability.

[Ellester]

We're discussing D&D 3.0 as Ellester has saw fit not to even say what version he is talking about. Afterall, we're comapring a bunch of things - NWN1 to NWN2 to 3.0 to (possibly) 3.5

 

LMAO

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

beofre even reading the last three pages of this post, I'll make it clear I'm talking about 3.5 rules. I no longer own a 3.0 PHB. Everything I'm posting is in the 3.5 PHB.

 

EDIT: cool Deraldin showed the facts.

Edited January 18, 2006 by Ellester

[Gabrielle]

Not if it was immune to fire somehow.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nonsense. A familiar isn't that strong. Unless it was a fire mephit than it may be immune to fire damage, but all the dragon has to do is step on it.

Edited January 18, 2006 by Gabrielle

[Judge Hades]

I tested this out in the Toolset. I made a proper ancient red dragon in the toolset. basicically a 40 HD critter. 21 Dragon levels and 19 sorcerer levels. Gave him the basic AI for both and had him go against a wizard and his familiar.

 

The wizzie and the familiar died rather quickly.

[Kaftan Barlast]

I wonder if the enemy will use nasty metamagic feats like Maximise? and.. I was about to say quicken but thats useless in relatime.

[Judge Hades]

What I like to know is can we double up on metamagic feats. Empowered Maximized Fireball is a must. I must I tell you!

 

BOOM!

[Diamond]

I wonder if the enemy will use nasty metamagic feats like Maximise? and.. I was about to say quicken but thats useless in relatime.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How so? A second or two can make difference between life and death.

[Atreides]

I wonder if the enemy will use nasty metamagic feats like Maximise? and.. I was about to say quicken but thats useless in relatime.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How so? A second or two can make difference between life and death.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, for Hades those seconds would (w00t)

[Kaftan Barlast]

Because being able to lob 2 spells the same round is useless if there are no rounds. But I suppose they could make it into some kind of turbo feature that enabled you to pop off a second spell right after the first instead of having to wait a second.

 

 

How is it that NWNs combat system works again? It has some kind of pseudo round/phase thingie doesnt it?

[Gabrielle]

What I like to know is can we double up on metamagic feats.  Empowered Maximized Fireball is a must.  I must I tell you! 

 

BOOM!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What are you guys talking about?

[Judge Hades]

Metamagic feats in DnD.

[Gabrielle]

Metamagic feats in DnD.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

All I have to say it must be a 3rd ed thing.

[Kaftan Barlast]

Metamagic feats in DnD.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

All I have to say it must be a 3rd ed thing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Its all built around boosting a spell some way at the cost of it taking a spell slot 1-4 levels higher than normal. For instance a maximised(does maximum damage for your level) fireball takes a lvl6 slot instead of a lvl3 slot. a maximized+empowered fireball would do max damage+another 50% of damage and take a lvl 8 spell slot.

 

 

Its really nasty.

[Judge Hades]

Yep.

 

Basically they are feats a wizrd can choose which augments their spell casting capabilities. SUch as Empowered spell, which will increase the level slot requirement for memerization, makes it that the spell can do 1.5 times the normal damage or lasts 1.5 times as long, and so forth. A Maximized Spell basically does maximum potential damage or last for the maximum possible duration, and so forth.

 

So a maximuized fireball with the caster 10th level plus will do 60 points, 30 if Reflex save is made, automatically.

 

In 3.5e it is really handy to do so because some wizards who don't have 1 16+ Intelligence could use the higher level spell slots they get with metamagic infused lower level spells.

Edited January 18, 2006 by Judge Hades

[Atreides]

Can't wait to see what vs party encounters Obsidz can set up. They probably can make legal non-cheese stuff that most people would find unbeatable, even with the benefit of reloading/preplaning. Well, maybe not if they do random combat scripts on key battles on each load.

[Spider]

Because being able to lob 2 spells the same round is useless if there are no rounds. But I suppose they could make it into some kind of turbo feature that enabled you to pop off a second spell right after the first instead of having to wait a second.

 

 

How is it that NWNs combat system works again? It has some kind of pseudo round/phase thingie doesnt it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

IIRC, NWN has the turns, it's just tha all involved in a fight act out their turn simultaneously. So if swing at your enemy (and only have one attack) you have to wait until the next turn before you can swing again. At least it works like this in the IE games.

 

As for quicken allowing you to cast two spells in one round, does it really work like that in D&D (and I really have no idea here)? I thought you only got one action during each turn regardless?

 

(if you have more than one attack, all attacks combined still count as a single action I guess)

[alanschu]

But the damage is 12-120, with an expected value of 60.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If it would be Gaussian distribution. But it is uniform, so you can expect any value between 12 and 120 with same probability.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

It's not Uniform. For instance, getting a 12 or a 120 means you have to roll the exact same value for all 24 dice (either all the highest or all the lowest). Since it's 24d10, your probability of doing either is (1/10)^24

 

Look at it with two regular dice. The probability of getting 2 or 12 is the lowest, with the probability of 1/36 (1/6 * 1/6). However, you can get a 7 by rolling 1-6, 2-5, 3-4, 4-3, 5-2, or 6-1. Your chances of getting a 7 are 6 times higher than getting a 7 than a 2 or 12.

 

Though I did just make an estimate about the expected value being 60. With rolling 24d10, between any two pairing of die, you'd reasonably expect 11 to be the highest probable value. With 12 pairings, that's 132 damage. 132/2 is 66. With some quick math, I'd say the expected value is closer to 66.

 

But it is certainly not a uniform distribution.

[Diamond]

Oh, yes. I totally forgot, it's dice.

[Judge Hades]

Brainhurts. Too much probability mathematics in too early in the morning...