Legalize Pot

[EnderAndrew]

Commisar said a few weeks ago we don't have enoug heated debate.

 

The Gaza Strip thread was largely succesful, but ended getting closed regardless. Here is a topic that should fire up some heated debate, but perhaps not as heated as the Gaza Strip.

 

Should a bloke get to toke up?

[Reveilled]

Course. What I put in my body is no one's business but my own.

[Darth Sirius]

I reserve the right to kill myself in any which way I choose!

 

So yes.

 

Alcohol kills tens of thousands of people (in England alone) a year, and the biggest argument about pot they can come up with is........It gives you man boobs! WTF? So does McDonalds!

[kumquatq3]

poll?

 

and sure, why not.

 

I'd have a problem with it if it was allowed in bars and resturants tho.

[Calax]

what the heck. as long as you have the same rules about smoking as you do with pot.

[julianw]

What are the benefits of legalizing it though? Making pot more readily available to everyone?

[Kitch]

I'd never smoke marijuana and I'm big health advocate, so I don't have too much of a personal opinion on it. But if it is legalized, it'll be taxed to hell. I also don't want to see more strong judgement altering drugs so easily available. Alcohol and the bajillion deperession medications are bad enough I'd rather not see it legalized, but it is ultimately your choice to decide what to ingest so I guess I have 'mixed feelings'. I am horrible at debate

[Commissar]

I'd never smoke marijuana and I'm big health advocate, so I don't have too much of a personal opinion on it. But if it is legalized, it'll be taxed to hell. I also don't want to see more strong judgement altering drugs so easily available. Alcohol and the bajillion deperession medications are bad enough I'd rather not see it legalized, but it is ultimately your choice to decide what to ingest so I guess I have 'mixed feelings'. I am horrible at debate

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Anyone who has been extremely high and extremely drunk will tell you that you're a hell of a lot more dangerous to society when extremely drunk rather than extremely high.

[Gabrielle]

Weed never did anything for me other than make me hungry. Legalize opium.

[Darth Sirius]

I'd never smoke marijuana and I'm big health advocate, so I don't have too much of a personal opinion on it. But if it is legalized, it'll be taxed to hell. I also don't want to see more strong judgement altering drugs so easily available. Alcohol and the bajillion deperession medications are bad enough I'd rather not see it legalized, but it is ultimately your choice to decide what to ingest so I guess I have 'mixed feelings'. I am horrible at debate

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Anyone who has been extremely high and extremely drunk will tell you that you're a hell of a lot more dangerous to society when extremely drunk rather than extremely high.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not to mention a hell of a lot more likely to die.

[EnderAndrew]

Cigarette maker, Liggett Group Inc., admitted that they lied to Congress about intentionally marketing to children and their knowledge about the addictive nature of tobacco.

 

Understand that if pot were legalized, it would fall in the hands of an industry where you can lie to Congress, get away with it, and continue business as normal.

 

You can market to kids.

 

You can lie about the side-effects of your product.

 

You can tell people your product isn't addictive, stand behind it and lie through your teeth.

 

And at the end of the day, Congress will happily accept their tax dollars and move on.

 

Given that both alcohol and tobacco are legal, and given the abundance of drug company lobbyists, I imagine there will be a day (perhaps soon) where pot is legalized.

 

Pot's uses for medicinal purposes are weak, but who cares? Drug companies are in the business of making money.

 

The major arguement against the legalization of pot stems from the addictive qualities of pot. But what legal precedent are we talking about?

 

Addictive substances are governed by the FDA, but in 2000 the Supreme Court ruled that Congress had not given the FDA proper authority to regulate tobacco. That war is still really being fought today with victories and losses on both sides.

 

I've seen lives destroyed first hand by addictions, all started via pot, yet tons of people swear up and down that it isn't a gateway drug. Every single person I know that has had addictions to harder drugs have told me firsthand pot was their gateway.

 

Should I believe users who defend pot, and who may be victims of addiction currently and thusly incapable of logic and objectivity on the subject, or those who have overcome their addictions and look back in hindsight?

 

Addiction is a mental condition that we don't fully understand, but what we do know if it is scary. Somewhere addiction has to enter the arguement.

 

Again, that brings us back to other addictive substances. Do two wrongs make a right? Tobacco is the leading killer in this country that can be prevented, but most smokers will tell you that it will "kill you when you're 70 so who cares"?

 

We are a society where millions believe smoking isn't that bad for you, despite the smoker's cough or various health problems that arise in a few short years of smoking.

 

And now people want to legalize pot, ingesting smoke for medicinal purposes. I was under the impression that doctors said inhaling smoke was never healthy on any level.

 

What is the real agenda and what is the real issue?

[mkreku]

I say no. Does society really need yet another personality changing chemical?

 

The reason alcohol is allowed while pot isn't is easy. There are three criterias that all drugs are rated in: how poisonous they are to the system, how easy it is to become addicted and if they change one's personality (the most dangerous criteria). Alcohol scores high on poisonous, scores very high on personality changing effects but scores very low on addictiveness. Not everyone can become addicted to alcohol (some say it's genetics) and considering how many people drink alcohol, the ratio of alcoholics is actually very low. Pot on the other hand.. It scores high on poisonous, it scores high on personality changing effects and it scores medium on addictiveness. It fills every criteria for being narcotics.

 

Useless knowledge: which substance is one of the easiest to become addicted to, gives one of the most difficult addictions to break free from and is still legal?

 

Answer:

Nicotine. It is more difficult to stop smoking than it is to stop shooting heroine. Weird!

 

[Darque]

I vote no.

 

there are plenty of reasons for people to act/be stupid without adding chemicals to the list.

[Child of Flame]

Cigarette maker, Liggett Group Inc., admitted that they lied to Congress about intentionally marketing to children and their knowledge about the addictive nature of tobacco.

 

Understand that if pot were legalized, it would fall in the hands of an industry where you can lie to Congress, get away with it, and continue business as normal.

 

You can market to kids.

 

You can lie about the side-effects of your product.

 

You can tell people your product isn't addictive, stand behind it and lie through your teeth.

 

And at the end of the day, Congress will happily accept their tax dollars and move on.

 

Given that both alcohol and tobacco are legal, and given the abundance of drug company lobbyists, I imagine there will be a day (perhaps soon) where pot is legalized.

 

Pot's uses for medicinal purposes are weak, but who cares?  Drug companies are in the business of making money.

 

The major arguement against the legalization of pot stems from the addictive qualities of pot.  But what legal precedent are we talking about?

 

Addictive substances are governed by the FDA, but in 2000 the Supreme Court ruled that Congress had not given the FDA proper authority to regulate tobacco.  That war is still really being fought today with victories and losses on both sides.

 

I've seen lives destroyed first hand by addictions, all started via pot, yet tons of people swear up and down that it isn't a gateway drug.  Every single person I know that has had addictions to harder drugs have told me firsthand pot was their gateway.

 

Should I believe users who defend pot, and who may be victims of addiction currently and thusly incapable of logic and objectivity on the subject, or those who have overcome their addictions and look back in hindsight?

 

Addiction is a mental condition that we don't fully understand, but what we do know if it is scary.  Somewhere addiction has to enter the arguement.

 

Again, that brings us back to other addictive substances.  Do two wrongs make a right?  Tobacco is the leading killer in this country that can be prevented, but most smokers will tell you that it will "kill you when you're 70 so who cares"?

 

We are a society where millions believe smoking isn't that bad for you, despite the smoker's cough or various health problems that arise in a few short years of smoking.

 

And now people want to legalize pot, ingesting smoke for medicinal purposes.  I was under the impression that doctors said inhaling smoke was never healthy on any level.

 

What is the real agenda and what is the real issue?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

On the other hand, rather than being a financial drain on society (via illegal, non-taxed grows, and prosecution of users/sellers) it can be taxed, and most, if not all of the Tobacco crops can be readily replaced with marijuana. It is cheaper to grow, can be taxed to death, and as a newly legalized substance, you can bet it'll be regulated by the FDA.

 

Also, most kids from the ages of 13-14 (at least here) are using, or have used, and their parents sometimes even light up with them.

 

I say yes, it'll be financially good, and we could criminalize tobacco which I see as having worse health effects than marijuana, even when smoked.

[EnderAndrew]

Most states aren't down with legalizing gambling or prostitution, and I can argue in both of those cases that there isn't a victim. People say with pot there is no victim as well, but again addiction enters the picture. One can argue the user is a victim of addiction and doesn't realize it.

 

I work for a chain of casinos, and trust me, we have to jump through alot of hoops when it comes to watching for gambling addictions. If someone has a problem, we ban them from our properties and refuse to take their money.

 

We spend tons of money on education and advertising. We have employees whose job it is to watch the floor and look for warning signs.

 

Given the drug industry today, I doubt they would treat pot nearly as responsibly as we do gambling.

 

There is an acne medication accutane that has been linked to a bunch of deaths since it causes depression. Several of its users have been comitting suicide. It also causes massive birth defects.

 

The only positive is that the drug curses acne. Does the drug save lives? No.

 

Has the drug killed people? Yes.

 

Will the drug be taken off the market? No.

 

I don't trust the drug industry, tobacco companies, or the FDA to handle pot.

[Child of Flame]

Note: The only reason I would be for marijuana legalization, is if cigarrettes and chew were criminalized.

 

While I realize pot has negative side effects too, I consider it to be the lesser evil.

[Magena]

There are a lot of positives for pot... medicinal and all.

 

In all honesty considering how many drugs are available on the market and how long the warnings are getting for them, I see no problem with legalizing pot. - after all, the side effects on occasional use aren't nearly as bad as many of the drugs that the pharmacutical companies are pushing in their commercials.

[EnderAndrew]

What medicinal uses does it have?

 

It causes cancer. That we know.

 

We don't normally hand out drugs that cause cancer.

[Magena]

What medicinal uses does it have?

 

It causes cancer.  That we know.

 

We don't normally hand out drugs that cause cancer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

yeah, amazing how we will hand out drugs because they will help men keep it up, but yet we won't hand out stuff for cancer which can be very painful.

[Kitch]

I recall reading an article claiming that Canada had extracted the chemical that is used to justify the medicinal aspects of marijuana and planned on distrubuting it. It also said the US government was interested. I can't seem to find anything at the moment though.

[Cantousent]

I've never done marijuana (or any other illegal drug) but I would agree to legalize it.

[EnderAndrew]

yeah, amazing how we will hand out drugs because they will help men keep it up, but yet we won't hand out stuff for cancer which can be very painful.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We had tons and tons of painkilling drugs. THC isn't much of a painkiller, but pot does have thousands of carcigens.

 

It doesn't make sense to smoke pot, and get lung cancer while trying to treat the "pain" caused by your existing cancer.

[Laozi]

Marijuana of course, should be legalized. Everyperson on the planet has every right to do what they will to themselves.

 

One of the main reasons that I would beleive that marijuana isn't legalized is that people don't treat it like cigarettes. If marijuana was legal tomorrow, people wouldn't go in droves to buy packs of marijuana cigarettes, they'd grow there own. This would seriously limit how much money the government could make off it in "taxes". Really hemp is the "cash crop" that would really aid american manufacturing, I've never really understood why hemp isn't legal to grow within the U.S., something about making regulation too tuff, but anyone who's seen a pot plant and a hemp plant could easily distinguish the two.

 

I really don't believe though that marijuana will ever be legal in the U.S., which is a shame, because not only should it be legal, it should be mandatory

[EnderAndrew]

Because marijuana contains irritants and carcinogens, it can promote cancer of the lungs and other parts of the respiratory tract. A study comparing 173 cancer patients and 176 healthy individuals produced strong evidence that smoking marijuana increased the likelihood of developing cancer of the head or neck. The more marijuana that was smoked, the greater the increase in likelihood. Marijuana also produces high levels of an enzyme that converts some hydrocarbons into their carcinogenic form. These levels may accelerate the changes that ultimately produce malignant cells. Additionally, marijuana users typically inhale more deeply and hold their breath longer than tobacco smokers, increasing the lungs' exposure to carcinogenic smoke.

 

Users who smoke marijuana regularly may experience the same respiratory problems as tobacco smokers, including daily cough and phlegm, symptoms of chronic bronchitis, and frequent chest colds. Continued marijuana use can result in abnormal functioning of lung tissue injured or destroyed by marijuana smoke.

 

Within a few minutes after smoking marijuana, the user's heart begins to beat more rapidly and may increase by 20 to 50 beats per minute, or even double. Results of a study released in 2001 indicate that a person's risk of heart attack within the first hour of smoking marijuana is four times the usual risk.

[metadigital]

I reserve the right to kill myself in any which way I choose!

 

So yes.

 

Alcohol kills tens of thousands of people (in England alone) a year, and the biggest argument about pot they can come up with is........It gives you man boobs! WTF? So does McDonalds!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No, actually, there is considerable evidence that it can (in those individuals who have a predisposition to mental illness) bring out psychotic maladies (schizophrenia, personality dissonance, etc) especially on the minds of young adults who have not fully developed/b], i.e. under 25.

 

So there could easily be a societal health cost. Considering the woeful care available for the mentally ill in all our societies, I think this is worth more research before we create a health time-bomb like obesity (which causes multiple health complications, like hypertension, type II diabetes, heart disease, stroke, etc).

 

So there is evidence that an individual's behaviour may affect others in society, so that behaviour needs to be monitored, managed and controlled.