OBS-4 Discussion (game and roll call)

[metadigital]

I agree - English rules, German board.

 

As for the Dominion thing, I believe its handled similar to borg unit assimilations.  So even though you're allowed to have more units (due to assimilation) than supply centres, unless you make up the difference (by capturing supply centres), the following year...you lose them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So the Dominion overrule another players units (randomly at the beginning of each year), and if they don't make up a SC that year, then they lose the control of that piece and cannot take it over again ... Yes?

[jaguars4ever]

I had assumed we would cement our choice of variants before sending in preferences? Are we definitely playing the ST version then?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you have a preference?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think I speak on behalf of everyone when I say,

 

Let's get this party started!

 

:D

[EnderAndrew]

I haven't read over the variant rules but I will tonight and let you know if I am in or not.

[metadigital]

I have to get confirmations:

Status:

• Archie,
  
• Jags,
  
• Ender,
  
• Lancer,
  
• Kaftan,
  
• Calax, and
  
• Alanschu.
  

Legend

Chaffing at the bit

Unconfirmed

No idea we're playing ST

[jaguars4ever]

I agree - English rules, German board.

 

As for the Dominion thing, I believe its handled similar to borg unit assimilations.  So even though you're allowed to have more units (due to assimilation) than supply centres, unless you make up the difference (by capturing supply centres), the following year...you lose them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So the Dominion overrule another players units (randomly at the beginning of each year), and if they don't make up a SC that year, then they lose the control of that piece and cannot take it over again ... Yes?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm gathering control over the infintrated unit is reliquinshed at the end of the season regardless. But given that any player cannot be victim of an infiltration 2 years in a row, the Dominion player would have to infiltrate a different player. Also, upon re-reading it, I suspect only ONE infiltratoin is allowed per season regardless of supply centre numbers.

 

Important points:

• At the end of each Spring and Fall season, the shapeshifters of the Dominion infiltrate one unit of the opposing players.
  
• The Dominion player's control of an infiltrated unit he orders lasts for one season, including both the movement phase and the retreat phase.
  
• At the end of the retreat phase, subordinate officers in the unit realize their command structure has been infiltrated and retake control of the unit for its original government.
  

[Archmonarch]

This seems quite interesting! Though Ive never been a huge fan of Star Trek, I am certainly up for this!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

So the Dominion overrule another players units (randomly at the beginning of each year), and if they don't make up a SC that year, then they lose the control of that piece and cannot take it over again ... Yes?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Looking over the rules, I have a slight disagreement in interpretation. From what I understand: at the end of each Spring and Fall, the GM randomly selects a unit from another power and secretly gives it Dominion control. After that point, the Dominion can, at any time in the future, override its original command and give its own orders to the unit. The same power can not have a unit infiltrated two seasons in a row and Borgs cannot be infiltrated. This way, the Dominion continually gains more units and would only lose them once he has ordered them through an entire season (either Spring or Fall).

 

I base this interpretation upon the following quotes:

 

The Dominion player may wait any length of time he chooses before asserting this control.  The Dominion can not assert control of an infiltrated unit before or during a retreat or build phase.  It can only do so with orders submitted for a season's movement phase.  The game master must make sure that any units ordered by the Dominion player were actually infiltrated earlier.  There is no limit to the number of infiltrations stored up that the Dominion player may activate in any one turn.

 

 

The Dominion player's control of an infiltrated unit he orders lasts for one season, including both the movement phase and the retreat phase.  At the end of the retreat phase, subordinate officers in the unit realize their command structure has been infiltrated and retake control of the unit for its original government.

[metadigital]

I'm gathering control over the infintrated unit is reliquinshed at the end of the season regardless.  But given that any player cannot be victim of an infiltration 2 years in a row, the Dominion player would have to infiltrate a different player.  Also, upon re-reading it, I suspect only ONE infiltratoin is allowed per season regardless of supply centre numbers.

 

Important points:

• At the end of each Spring and Fall season, the shapeshifters of the Dominion infiltrate one unit of the opposing players.
   
  
• The Dominion player's control of an infiltrated unit he orders lasts for one season, including both the movement phase and the retreat phase.
   
  
•   At the end of the retreat phase, subordinate officers in the unit realize their command structure has been infiltrated and retake control of the unit for its original government.
  

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Looking over the rules, I have a slight disagreement in interpretation. From what I understand: at the end of each Spring and Fall, the GM randomly selects a unit from another power and secretly gives it Dominion control. After that point, the Dominion can, at any time in the future, override its original command and give its own orders to the unit. The same power can not have a unit infiltrated two seasons in a row and Borgs cannot be infiltrated.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So to reconcile these two points: the infiltration can be at any time, but only lasts for that one time? Then the control reverts back to the owner? (Except for the Enterprise )

[Archmonarch]

No. Infiltration can only occur at the end of Spring or Fall. The unit will remain as if under the orders of its original government until ordered to the contrary by the Dominion. There is no limit to the number of units that can be infiltrated at one time, or how long the Dominion can wait to use their infiltration advantage. Once the Dominion has given orders for a unit throughout a season (the entirety of Spring or the entirety of Fall), subordinate officers of the infiltrated unit regain control for the original government.

[jaguars4ever]

So to reconcile these two points: the infiltration can be at any time, but only lasts for that one time? Then the control reverts back to the owner? (Except for the Enterprise )

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Right. The Dominion get one infiltration every season (and lose control of that infiltration at the end of the season). This is providin the use that infiltrated unit at the end of the season.

 

If they don't they do if fact get more infiltrated units as previously said.

[metadigital]

No. Infiltration can only occur at the end of Spring or Fall. The unit will remain as if under the orders of its original government until ordered to the contrary by the Dominion. There is no limit to the number of units that can be infiltrated at one time, or how long the Dominion can wait to use their infiltration advantage. Once the Dominion has given orders for a unit throughout a season (the entirety of Spring or the entirety of Fall), subordinate officers of the infiltrated unit regain control for the original government.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So the Dominion could wait for ten turns and then turn everyone against each other ...? (Except the Borg, and the Enterprise ...)

[jaguars4ever]

So the Dominion could wait for ten turns and then turn everyone against each other ...? (Except the Borg, and the Enterprise ...)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I guess so. :D

[Archmonarch]

Im just repeating the contents of the rules.

[metadigital]

Do we agree with that interpretation?

 

Also, what is your interpretation of access to Borg Space?

 

Is it just any territory adjacent, or is there a bottleneck, or what?

[Archmonarch]

I do, and by the way, dibs on Dominion!

[jaguars4ever]

Do we agree with that interpretation?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yup - in fact the infiltration can get passed along (via dislodgement)!

[Archmonarch]

Also, what is your interpretation of access to Borg Space?

 

Is it just any territory adjacent, or is there a bottleneck, or what?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Im not sure I understand your question.

[metadigital]

Do we agree with that interpretation?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yup - in fact the infiltration can get passed along (via dislodgement)!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

...

11. A Dominion player who has infiltrated a cloaked fleet or army is informed of its location and orders every turn until he "uses up" his infiltration of that unit.

...

[Archmonarch]

...

9. If an infiltrated unit is dislodged and destroyed, the infiltration passes to the dislodging unit. If the infiltrated unit is dislodged and retreats, then the infiltration remains in this dislodged unit.

...

[metadigital]

Also, what is your interpretation of access to Borg Space?

 

Is it just any territory adjacent, or is there a bottleneck, or what?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Im not sure I understand your question.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

On the map, the Borg have "Borg Territory", which is supposedly in the Delta Quadrant. To get to the Gamma Quadrant, there is a convenient wormhole at DS9, Bajor and Antares. There doesn't appear to be a similar wormhole-thing to get to the Delta quadrant ...

...

The map is divided in resource-rich areas (corresponding to land) and resource-poor areas (corresponding to sea). There is no common boundary between the gamma quadrant and the remainder of the galaxy. The only connection is represented by the wormhole, which is not a space itself, but consists of the spaces of the alpha quadrant (DS9, Antares and Bajor) and spaces of the gamma quadrant (Gemma and Idran). There are 36 supply centres (SC), so the victory crieteria is 19 SC.

...

[jaguars4ever]

Ah, the Borg Space.

 

It's not a wormhole separated Quadrant like the Gamma Quadrant. Instead, it merely designates where the Borg Movement Bonuses apply.

 

Also: Check your mail!

[Archmonarch]

Hmm...not sure. Either the creators left off the wormhole or the Borg have another mechanism to leave their area of space.

 

Also, I have a comment on the Klingon advantage:

 

Perhaps we can interpret it like this:

 

When the Klingons attack the SAME space with 3 or more units, the attacks ALWAYS succeed providing all the attacks go through and the support isn't cut. 

 

This makes a successful 3 prong Klingon attack capable of beating a defense of 3 or greater. 

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

My interpretation is that set out in the rules: each Klingon unit has the strength of 1 1/2 normal units when attacking only. The unit has normal strength when standing or defending. Thus, one Klingon unit may always dislodge one unit of any other government. However, this bonus strength only applies when the Klingon move is not being supported by any unit, including other Klingons.

[jaguars4ever]

Hmm...not sure. Either the creators left off the wormhole or the Borg have another mechanism to leave their area of space.

 

Also, I have a comment on the Klingon advantage:

 

Perhaps we can interpret it like this:

 

When the Klingons attack the SAME space with 3 or more units, the attacks ALWAYS succeed providing all the attacks go through and the support isn't cut. 

 

This makes a successful 3 prong Klingon attack capable of beating a defense of 3 or greater. 

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

My interpretation is that set out in the rules: each Klingon unit has the strength of 1 1/2 normal units when attacking only. The unit has normal strength when standing or defending. Thus, one Klingon unit may always dislodge one unit of any other government. However, this bonus strength only applies when the Klingon move is not being supported by any unit, including other Klingons.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ah, we're talking about different rulesets. I'm referring to German & you're referring to English.

[metadigital]

My interpretation is that set out in the rules: each Klingon unit has the strength of 1 1/2 normal units when attacking only. The unit has normal strength when standing or defending. Thus, one Klingon unit may always dislodge one unit of any other government. However, this bonus strength only applies when the Klingon move is not being supported by any unit, including other Klingons.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Um, yeah, that's true. The bit you quoted is from the German rules, which we aren't using.

[Archmonarch]

It applies to either ruleset equally well.

[metadigital]

Yes, but we aren't using the German ruleset, which is the one with the 3:1 ration wierdness.

 

We are using the English ruleset, which has the 1.5 superior attack advantage.