Human Sexuality

[Lucius]

Right, I thought so. "

[alanschu]

You're just being silly.

 

And you're also naive and think that choice is purely a conscious decision.

[Walsingham]

1. Health issues?

 

- Rock climbing has associated health issues. It also wastes search and rescue resources on occasion. Is it bad? I don't think so.

 

- Moreover, heterosexual sex isn't always white sheets and the missionary, at least not where I'm from. We Brits have been catching up in this department in recent years and we now have massive hetero STD infection rates among youngsters. The worst in Europe.

 

- I can't think of any way gay sex could result in unwanted children. With all the badness that entails.

 

2. Social issues.

 

People, even gay people often say how homosexuality precedes the fall of civilisations. But then so does good food, central heating, live entertainment, political corruption and a failure to support the military. The only social issue is with being counter the establishment. Being an establishment types such behaviour riles me, but no more than those grud danged hippies!

 

As a further point, you would probably be surprised how many gay people are right this minute serving to defend you. And how many have died serving you in the past. And forget about the millions who work in our public services and political systems.

 

 

~

 

We should forget all about worrying whether someone is gay, straight, and a bunch of other things, and focus on what makes a person an ***-hole. Answer me that question and ...

 

...wait, what do you mean "he's born in England"?

[julianw]

Walsingham - I agree that homosexuality is not a significant issue. It's just for discussion's sake.

 

BTW, the rate of dying from AIDs is much higher than from rock-climbing. I love all people, including homosexuals. That's why I try to point out their problems.

[Lucius]

You're just being silly.

 

And you're also naive and think that choice is purely a conscious decision.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No more silly than you claiming that we chose our sexuality, and by chose we're talking about a conscious decision, right? If it's something that evolves subconciously while growing up, it's not a decisions, and not a choice.

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Homosexuality is a genetical means of birth control, like a natural contraceptive genetically developed over the years and manifested over several species.

 

This here bottle of bourbon told me so.

[alanschu]

No more silly than you claiming that we chose our sexuality, and by chose we're talking about a conscious decision, right? If it's something that evolves subconciously while growing up, it's not a decisions, and not a choice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You'd be surprised how much of your subconscious is used in your conscious decisions.

 

I am not talking about something that evolves subconsciously while growing up.

 

 

And I'm not making the claim, I just mentioned that alternative. If you look up a bit more you'll see that my belief is that it's based on environment.

[Dark Moth]

I'm not a homophobe, I don't hate homosexuals. That, however, does not mean I agree with their lifestyle (which I don't). Does that mean I hate them? No, I happen to know homosexuals in real life. I know that they too are people and can be great people. That still does not stop me from disagreeing with their lifestyle, but at the same time I won't treat them differently.

 

What I also hate is that whenver someone claims to disagree with homosexuality, they're branded as a bigot, racist, nazi, homophobe, religious zealot, etc. People often equate Christianity with hatred because it teaches against homosexuality, but that is not true. Christianity teaches that homosexuality is wrong, but we should treat them as equals just the same. :D

 

As for the whole choice issue, as I said, people numerous times can turn straight or gay, so you can't say it's all genetics. It's happened many times before. And it's not as if someone wakes up one day and says "Well, I think I'll be gay from now on." No, it's a long process that comes from the experiences and choices of the individual. People can be born with it, granted, but there are also many others who make it a choice.

 

You gotta love controversial threads, they attract posts like a magnet. :D

Edited July 22, 2005 by Mothman

[Lucius]

You're not playing my mind, are you? Because I was about to say that people suffering from schizophrenia didn't exactly 'chose' to, either, and now there's two of you!

 

Besides, the environment is part of growing up, but a lot of people growing up in rural areas turn out to be gay as well, and then they move into the big cities.

[julianw]

Mothman - You are confusing people's understanding of themselves with their actual sexuality. Most people who try to experiment with their sexuality always go back to before they started experimenting.

[alanschu]

Besides, the environment is part of growing up, but a lot of people growing up in rural areas turn out to be gay as well, and then they move into the big cities.

 

You'd have to analyze their situations while growing up. I never said it JUST happens in large cities.

 

There are certain conditions that are highly related to overpopulated areas, and those conditions can still be replecated elsewhere through other means.

[Lucius]

I'm not a homophobe, I don't hate homosexuals.  That, however, does not mean I agree with their lifestyle (which I don't).  Does that mean I hate them?  No, I happen to know homosexuals in real life.  I know that they too are people and can be great people.  That still does not stop me from disagreeing with their lifestyle, but at the same time I won't treat them differently.

I wonder if your friends agree with your lifestyle, my guess is that they do, but I'm sure they're glad that you don't hate them, how merciful of you.

[Dark Moth]

Mothman - You are confusing people's understanding of themselves with their actual sexuality. Most people who try to experiment with their sexuality always go back to before he started experimenting.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah, that too. Some people don't truly know who they are (sexuality included) unless they try something different, and unfortunately many people have to do that. Sexuality is just one among many choices we make in our lives.

[Lucius]

Mothman - You are confusing people's understanding of themselves with their actual sexuality. Most people who try to experiment with their sexuality always go back to before he started experimenting.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah, that too. Some people don't truly know who they are (sexuality included) unless they try something different, and unfortunately many people have to do that. Sexuality is just one among many choices we make in our lives.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Except that it isn't a 'conscious' choice, for most people.

[Dark Moth]

Mothman - You are confusing people's understanding of themselves with their actual sexuality. Most people who try to experiment with their sexuality always go back to before he started experimenting.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah, that too. Some people don't truly know who they are (sexuality included) unless they try something different, and unfortunately many people have to do that. Sexuality is just one among many choices we make in our lives.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Except that it isn't a 'conscious' choice, for most people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

True, true.

[Lucius]

Besides, the environment is part of growing up, but a lot of people growing up in rural areas turn out to be gay as well, and then they move into the big cities.

 

You'd have to analyze their situations while growing up. I never said it JUST happens in large cities.

 

There are certain conditions that are highly related to overpopulated areas, and those conditions can still be replecated elsewhere through other means.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You sure did emphasise it, either you need to get better at expressing yourself, or I need to check up on my understanding of English. (damn Anglo-Saxons)

[Kor Qel Droma]

Hey Rosbjerg!! It's nice to see you posting again. I actually have no opinions on this subject other than 'live and let live'...

[alanschu]

Besides, the environment is part of growing up, but a lot of people growing up in rural areas turn out to be gay as well, and then they move into the big cities.

 

You'd have to analyze their situations while growing up. I never said it JUST happens in large cities.

 

There are certain conditions that are highly related to overpopulated areas, and those conditions can still be replecated elsewhere through other means.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You sure did emphasise it, either you need to get better at expressing yourself, or I need to check up on my understanding of English. (damn Anglo-Saxons)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Here is what I originally said:

 

You'll find that homosexuality is often a reflection of environment. They're more often located in locations such as overpopulation and whatnot.

 

There's an increased predisposition towards homosexual activity (and experimentation) when overpopulation is combined with a socially restricting stigma.

 

I merely mentioned an increased predisposition. I certainly don't consider that to be an emphasis, since it just mentions one correlation.

[Fionavar]

Thread Pruned: Though this topic covers a vast range of opinions, I would remind people that this fora is open to people of ALL ages and that it remains public. As a result, I would urge people to post without the need to demonstrate the graphic nature of the human continuum of sexuality. Please post with sensitivity to the forum guidelines and the understanding that both children and their parents also make use of these public fora.

[Lucius]

And then you continued on to say it happened in the animal world as well, when I said that homosexuals move into the big cities.

[Cloris]

Wow, you know -- this was one of the few game-oriented message boards that I would count on for intelligent conversation. Then threads like this pop up, and I wonder why on earth I even bother. What is it with video game message boards and the penchant for homophobia?

 

As a sexuality and reproductive health professional, and a person of alternative sexual orientation, I can tell you that folks like {deleted for the sake of flame avoidance} are indeed bigoted and most certainly incorrect on almost every single point made in this thread. Not knocking you guys personally (though I would like to), but your science is bad, your philosophy is ill-advised, and your facts are just plain wrong.

 

Current scientific (biology, psychology, sociology, and anthropology) thought indicates that the sexual orientation is the likely result of a number of factors including genetics (that influence the activity level of certain parts of the brain), hormonal influence in the womb, socio-economic and cultural influence, and the effectiveness of reporting (someone living in a well-educated, affluent urban area is statistically much more likely to express rather than repress a tendency towards same-sex attraction than someone in a rural, economically depressed, and poorly educated area). So far there is not, nor is there likely to be, a single "magic bullet" that creates same-sex attraction. To believe it is simply a "choice" is not only wrong, but is quite frankly delusional and almost criminal in its ignorance.

 

Oh, and KJVB doesn't teach that homosexuality is wrong -- it teaches that it is an "abomination" which is, in context, something unfit for Jews. Never mind the hypocrisy of James I while he was overseeing this little project (ask the Brits on the board about George Villers, Duke of Buckingham). If theocratic bigots aren't simply teaching hatred, well then they would go after ham and cheese bagels the same way they go after homosexuals... or people that wear poly cotton blends, or work on Sundays, or football players (unclean pigskin and all) et al.

 

With over twelve years of research in this field, a library of over 200 volumes on sexuality, and a curriculum vitae specializing in alternative sexuality -- I could go on and on and on and on about this. But I'm too damned mad -- so I'm going to load up a game, and blow the hell out of some strangers instead.

 

Absolutely Disgusted,

 

Cloris

[Lucius]

Wow, you know -- this was one of the few game-oriented message boards that I would count on for intelligent conversation. Then threads like this pop up, and I wonder why on earth I even bother. What is it with video game message boards and the penchant for homophobia?

 

As a sexuality and reproductive health professional, and a person of alternative sexual orientation, I can tell you that folks like {deleted for the sake of flame avoidance} are indeed bigoted and most certainly incorrect on almost every single point made in this thread. Not knocking you guys personally (though I would like to), but your science is bad, your philosophy is ill-advised, and your facts are just plain wrong.

 

Current scientific (biology, psychology, sociology, and anthropology) thought indicates that the sexual orientation is the likely result of a number of factors including genetics (that influence the activity level of certain parts of the brain), hormonal influence in the womb, socio-economic and cultural influence, and the effectiveness of reporting (someone living in a well-educated, affluent urban area is statistically much more likely to express rather than repress a tendency towards same-sex attraction than someone in  a rural, economically depressed, and poorly educated area). So far there is not, nor is there likely to be, a single "magic bullet" that creates same-sex attraction. To believe it is simply a "choice" is not only wrong, but is quite frankly delusional and almost criminal in its ignorance.

 

Oh, and KJVB doesn't teach that homosexuality is wrong -- it teaches that it is an "abomination" which is, in context, something unfit for Jews. Never mind the hypocrisy of James I while he was overseeing this little project (ask the Brits on the board about George Villers, Duke of Buckingham). If theocratic bigots aren't simply teaching hatred, well then they would go after ham and cheese bagels the same way they go after homosexuals... or people that wear poly cotton blends, or work on Sundays, or football players (unclean pigskin and all) et al.

 

With over twelve years of research in this field, a library of over 200 volumes on sexuality, and a curriculum vitae specializing in alternative sexuality -- I could go on and on and on and on about this. But I'm too damned mad -- so I'm going to load up a game, and blow the hell out of some strangers instead.

 

Absolutely Disgusted,

 

Cloris

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I appriciate your post, Cloris, you're capable of expressing yourself far more eloquent than I... This stuff pisses me off somewhat terribly as well.

[alanschu]

I was mentioning that the phenomenon was not just restricted to humans. The predispositions exist for other mammals too, so it would seem that there would be more than just them all moving to the big city, although the large concentrations would be affected by that as well.

[julianw]

Hey, nobody said homosexuality is simply a choice or even not as complicated as you said it to be.

 

I did list some of the health issues from homosexuality, but that got deleted. I am just saying that homosexuals are more vulnerlable to AIDs, one of the biggest enemies of mankind. Homosexuality is not wrong, but unhealthy and not safe. If you disagree with that part, then list your evidences.

[Musopticon?]

To Cloris:

This isn't intelligent conversation? I mean, for a geek board.