The next patch...

[GeorgeWSidious]

Well, I have had KoTOR 2 sitting on my hard drive long enough. I can reinstall it once everything is figured out, if it gets figured out. I'm looking forward more to the restoration project than anything coming from the devs at this point.

 

I'm going to throw Jedi Knight 2 in and play until my eyes bleed. Look out world, here comes Kyle Katarn!

[jaguars4ever]

I'm going to throw Jedi Knight 2 in and play until my eyes bleed.  Look out world, here comes Kyle Katarn! 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Why play a thoroughly mediocre game when great games are (or can be), at your disposal?

 

Also: That avatar is seriously disturbing.

[GeorgeWSidious]

I'm going to throw Jedi Knight 2 in and play until my eyes bleed.  Look out world, here comes Kyle Katarn! 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Why play a thoroughly mediocre game when great games are (or can be), at your disposal?

 

Also: That avatar is seriously disturbing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Well, I like lightsabers.... ummm, especially when they do realistic damage. And one person's mediocre game can be another person's simple pleasure. :D

 

And it probably wasn't meant as such, but thank you for the compliment on my avatar! :cool:

[Mark Havel]

I think i will never bougth another game from obsidian NVW 2 Will be a **** i think because KOTOR 1 is a great game but Kotor 2 Is A **** and => NVW 1 great, NVW 2 (lost my time and money)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Is seems there is some people who did not understood that KotOR II flaws were just caused by LA. They wanted the game for Christmas (and only for US Xbox owners...) while Obsidian initially planned to release it for "Winter 2005", eg March. I'm quite sure that if Obsidian had a few months more to finish it, KotOR II would have been far far better than the first game.

Unfortunately, it won't be the case unless a content patch fixing the incoherent ending is officially releseased.

You don't (neither do I) know Atari's policy about the release of NWN2, so don't anticipate nor say it will be a bad game. Most of Obsidian's staff are coming from Black Isle Studio who developped the 2 Fallout, the excellent Planescape Torment and the 2 Icewind Dale, plus some addons for ADD games. So I really think there are good developpers and very able to make excellent games.

[11238_1556103629]

Actually that incoherent ending was their intention, not something forced upon them by the deadline set by LA.

They cut the ending because they thought it was better the way it is now, not because they were forced to do so...

They though it was best to build up relations with your sidekicks and then just have them disappear for no apparant reason at one point in the game with little to no explanation as to what happened to them... <_<

Obsidian shot themselves in the foot with this decision, and many others, like accepting such a contract with limited control to begin with...

[mstormrage]

I think i will never bougth another game from obsidian NVW 2 Will be a **** i think because KOTOR 1 is a great game but Kotor 2 Is A **** and => NVW 1 great, NVW 2 (lost my time and money)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

KotOR 2 is also a great game. And just because you had problems with their first game doesn't mean you will with their 2nd. They've learned from Lucasarts mistakes and have their own internal QA department now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Internal QA department != Better quality game

 

It's up to the developers to actually fix what the QA department flags.

[Mark Havel]

[quote name='

[WoT]

[quote name='

[Mark Havel]

I ever thought this was the explanation to the cut of the droid planet and some more "consistent" content, not the ending. I do no believe they would have let willingly such incoherences of their game if they could have fixed them. Their precedent games as Black Isle studios were too well made (and without any visible incoherence).

! Summon Obsidian developper to have the final word !

[swaaye]

please release some new music Feargus

[6 Foot Invisible Rabbit]

Hello, Obsidian!!! You said it would be a few days. Tell LA to get their collective heads out of their arses.

[Naso]

shhhhhhh, they're sleeping........

[ken007]

This is what was sent to Gamespot as the official comment from LucasArts and Obsidian:

 

"We've heard from some people that they feel there was another ending

that was not realized in the shipping version of the Star Wars Knights

of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords. The truth of the matter is that

much like a movie a certain amount of the game ends up on the cutting

room floor. This is often because the original ideas or design just

don't make sense when put in the context of the final game as it is

being put together.

 

When it comes to KOTOR II, there was material cut at various times in

the game's making, including at the end of the game's development cycle.

We don't feel that the amount of material was much more or less than we

have had to cut from any of the other games that any of us have worked

on.

 

Ultimately, both Mike and I are proud of the game and of the talented

people at Obsidian who made it with the assistance of LucasArts.

 

Sincerely,

 

Feargus Urquhart, Obsidian CEO & President

Mike Gallo, LucasArts Producer"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Arghh, that pisses me of..... what... do Obsidian really think we're idiots?!? TO OBSIDIAN: The ending in KotorII was so disappointing that it made my stomach twist and turn, and when I realised that the game actually was over..... I fainted out of sheer disbelieve! That ending SUCKED, you get it, it was TERRIBLE! And don't think that if YOU say you think the game was great and the ending was wonderful and jadajadajada, that we will be convinced of the same... at least I won't!!!

[Antagonist]

I don't believe Feargus on this one. To me it sounds more like the usual press propaganda to counter the backlash by the fans. It's more probable that Obsidian new that the ending was screwed due to the release date change so they had to somehow explain it by telling it was all done purposefully.

 

Note that this statement was also made by Gallo. Am I the only one imagining Gallo holding a gun to Feargus' head while writing this stuff ?

[metadigital]

I don't believe Feargus on this one. To me it sounds more like the usual press propaganda to counter the backlash by the fans. It's more probable that Obsidian new that the ending was screwed due to the release date change so they had to somehow explain it by telling it was all done purposefully.

 

Note that this statement was also made by Gallo. Am I the only one imagining Gallo holding a gun to Feargus' head while writing this stuff ?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It does smell like a cover-up. Why are they bothering to make an official statement if they don't have a guilty conscience?

 

After all, they could have just said "Play the game and judsge for yourself, we love the ending."

[Valdartak]

Still no sound patch? Nor a patch to fix the first patch? I just can't believe this lack of support.

[Guest MacleodCorp]

I am going to say this, but it makes some scense:

 

1. The Patch is not a priority, for Episode III the game and movie are the money makers.

 

2. Chances that the patch will be released in the next week to three are very slim.

 

3. Chances are there are plans for KOTOR III, and their thoughts are not on the KOTOR II... KOTOR II is now old news..

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

This may be true, but this shoddy treatment is going to cost them customers for KOTOR III. I'm not going to buy KOTOR III unless, I hear that it is essentially bug free, because of the horrible technical support on this game.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

People who like and dislike KOTOR II's problems will buy KOTOR III. Regardless of KOTOR II's problems, people will still buy the product. It does seem horrible that you will not get, what we the gammers call, a finished and solid game. However, I think it will not stop people from buying the next KOTOR.

[Oerwinde]

I think i will never bougth another game from obsidian NVW 2 Will be a **** i think because KOTOR 1 is a great game but Kotor 2 Is A **** and => NVW 1 great, NVW 2 (lost my time and money)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

KotOR 2 is also a great game. And just because you had problems with their first game doesn't mean you will with their 2nd. They've learned from Lucasarts mistakes and have their own internal QA department now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Internal QA department != Better quality game

 

It's up to the developers to actually fix what the QA department flags.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well the QA for KotOR2 was obviously not very good, since they missed a lot of blatantly obvious bugs. Having internal QA will allow them to be able to test and fix faster than sending a build off to Lucasarts or whatever to have tested. More efficient QA = less bugs/more complete game by release. In most cases at least.

[mstormrage]

Well the QA for KotOR2 was obviously not very good, since they missed a lot of blatantly obvious bugs. Having internal QA will allow them to be able to test and fix faster than sending a build off to Lucasarts or whatever to have tested. More efficient QA = less bugs/more complete game by release. In most cases at least.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

A better idea would be to code the game correctly in the first place. How's that for a concept?

 

The developers of MoO ]I[ had access to quite a few QA testers in-house. At least MoO ]I[ was complete before it left the development house (despite being a crappy game).

 

QA testing would not have resulted in a better ending. QA testing would not have caught the missing content. Better Beta testing would have caught these errors, but QA testing (whether internal or external) would not have.

[Ahkey]

If it takes LA this long to QA a patch, just imagine how long the game must've taken. Obsidian must've had, what, three months before the virginal game entered the LAQA machine, emerging celophane-wrapped and rotten to the core.

[Cathari]

Anyone else think that whomever it was that ordered the "by Christmas" rush made a stupid and massive mistake by not holding the game's release back to after Ep3?

 

Would've had time to complete the game

Would've had time to quality assure the game

Would've had a pack of freshly enthusiastic rabid SW fans out for something good

Would've made a bucket-load more money, even after incurring the extra developmental and testing costs, through having a game that was complete, excellent (story-line was excellent until the end), and would not have been so buggy as to drive people away from buying the game.

 

Frankly I think it would have to be one of the worst marketing/management decisions for such a vast number of reasons that we've ever seen.

 

I don't believe that OE is to blame. Overall they've done a great job in the time-frame allocated to them.

 

I don't even believe that Mike Gallo or Feargus Urquart are directly to blame, except to not push back harder on whomever was pushing on them.

 

The fault directly lies within the upper-management of LA for having a shocking policy on developmental time, putting out incomplete and buggy software, and having an astoundingly short-sighted view on the market and market timing.

 

As a software developer myself, almost always the ones who show their face to the public are not the ones at fault when something goes wrong. They are almost always the "expendable middle-pecking-order scapegoat" who gets shoved to the front to take the bullets for some gutless visionless higher up manager who's ****-scared of the consequences of his actions/policy.

 

Very, very rarely are the development team, or even the lower-rung publisher front-line managers, the ones at fault. Most often the problem goes all the way up to the highest levels of the command chain where decisions based on ego rather than reality, and butt-covering tactics, are the main order of the day. The ones in the public eye lower down the pecking order have no choice but to tow the obsequious line and cover for the upper-management, because these guy's jobs are on the line if they don't, and not only that, the jobs of all the people they work with.

[Oerwinde]

Well the QA for KotOR2 was obviously not very good, since they missed a lot of blatantly obvious bugs. Having internal QA will allow them to be able to test and fix faster than sending a build off to Lucasarts or whatever to have tested. More efficient QA = less bugs/more complete game by release. In most cases at least.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

QA testing would not have resulted in a better ending. QA testing would not have caught the missing content. Better Beta testing would have caught these errors, but QA testing (whether internal or external) would not have.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You do realize that QA testing IS beta testing right?

[jedipodo]

I don't even believe that Mike Gallo or Feargus Urquart are directly to blame, except to not push back harder on whomever was pushing on them.

 

I don't know much about LA's project management, but wasn't Gallo the responsible producer for Kotor2?

[Cathari]

I don't even believe that Mike Gallo or Feargus Urquart are directly to blame, except to not push back harder on whomever was pushing on them.

 

I don't know much about LA's project management, but wasn't Gallo the responsible producer for Kotor2?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'd bet good money that Mike Gallo would just be the publically visible front-line producer/manager, acting under orders from someone higher up saying "LA's policy is to have the game out by Christmas as per our mandated 12m production cycle. Make sure it happens or you're out the door". The second sentence wouldn't be stated like that of course, but the implication would always be there in whatever was really said. Since Mike would've agreed to those terms, yes, you could say that it was his fault, but it's hard to not agree to unrealistic terms and be a champion of the upper management's cause when a gun is held to your head. That's the way it all works in my experience. Mike Gallo would then be the obvious scapegoat in everyone's eyes, just as intended, even though his hands would've been largely tied the whole time with an axe over his head.

[mstormrage]

You do realize that QA testing IS beta testing right?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Not where I work. Two completely different things testing for two completely different reasons.

 

Oh, did you believe that you were QA testing Windows XP Professional x64 Edition when you downloaded the beta and the successive RC1 and RC2 editions?