I am now in serious doubt that a patch will be released at all for KOTOR2.

 

A similar situation occurred with "Chronicles of Riddick". Although a patch had been made, and was promised for months, eventually it was deemed *not worth it* to actually release a patch - cost wise.

 

I am thinking the same will occurr here.

 

Regardless... and this is important... obsidian finished the patch a long time ago, and it will, most likely, barely contain much of note. It was not a large effort by them at all, either. Perhaps a smattering of fixes, if that.

 

However, the fact that Lucasarts has held onto it for so long indicates much more than just "not having the time" to release it.

 

I think they are having major reservations about the whole project.

 

All in all, it was a flawed project, but one that still produced a (barely) workable game. With the amount of antagonism from the community, why bother? I think they may just reject any further support and let the storm blow over.

 

Project complete... next please!

And software companies complain about the increase in piracy... they're digging there own grave with every game they abandon. I have to admit, I DID buy the game, but if I'm not happy with the support, I shan't bother in the future, and I imagine I'm far from the only person who feels this way, but hey, that's up to Lucasarts and Obsidian

 

Lets hope the title of this thread isn't the case...

I'm afraid you could be right--the optimism of release is whittled away with each day.

 

Would it be LA's job to extend the patch and have it fix more bugs, or would they theoretically send it back to Obsidian for that job?

 

Just wondering, as that MIGHT be a poor explaination the long, long delay of the patch...

The main concern I have is that from what I have read (scattered reports here and there) that the patch was actually done, finished a long time ago and now it is just up to LA finally release it...

 

But that the patch won't address half of the things addressed in the Bugs Thread stickied atop this forum.

 

That thread has 16 pages of SERIOUS, game-stopping and gameplay bugs that make this barely a beta-phase game they charged full retail for.

 

This is my greatest (greater?) concern right now in that we probably will get a patch... I know, hope springs eternal... But even if we do, it's not going to amount to much and it sure as heck isn't going to finish -- via adding cut content -- The game and make it better.

 

Here is the thing:

 

I think most people have finished the game by now... And no one really cares.

 

There is VERY little replay value in this game compared to the first -- which may seem odd, but is not if you think about some of the more linear choices you're forced to make regarding the Influence system and how you level up given the game uses skill levels to unlock portions of it -- And the horrible cut-endings and dangling sidequests only add to the frustratition.

You expressly acknowledge and agree that use of the Software is at your sole risk.  Except for the limited ninety (90) day warranty on the media set forth above, the Software and any related documentation or materials are provided "AS IS" and without warranty of any kind.  LUCASARTS EXPRESSLY DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS AND IMPLIED, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NONINFRINGEMENT.  LUCASARTS DOES NOT WARRANT THAT THE FUNCTIONS CONTAINED IN THE SOFTWARE WILL MEET YOUR REQUIREMENTS, OR THAT THE OPERATION OF THE SOFTWARE WILL BE UNINTERRUPTED OR ERROR-FREE, OR THAT DEFECTS IN THE SOFTWARE WILL BE CORRECTED.  THE ENTIRE RISK AS TO THE RESULTS AND PERFORMANCE OF THE SOFTWARE IS ASSUMED BY YOU AND YOU (AND NOT LUCASARTS) ASSUME THE ENTIRE COST OF ALL SERVICING, REPAIR AND/OR CORRECTION.  SOME JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WARRANTIES, SO THE ABOVE EXCLUSION MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.

 

UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES blah blah blah.

 

I haven't actually purchased, installed, or otherwise played KotOR2 simply because I don't have the time. That said, the above agreement may not be what you agreed to, but since it hadn't changed (other than LUCASARTS was just LEC) from 1999 to 2003, I assume it is still basically the same. Anyway, the underlined portion says it all.

 

Personally, I think that it's getting to the point that we as consumers need to start reading the fine print. If we don't like what we read, then we shouldn't purchase the product. What I don't understand is why stores do not allow the returning of opened software. In order to read most license agreements, there is no other way to read it other than opening the box. Usually, the outside of the box states that we can return the software if we don't agree to the license agreement. Because most software stores do not allow the returning of opened merchandise, I think that it's time that we start forcing store owners to open the box so that we can actually read the license agreement ahead of time (pre-purchase).

 

Statements like the one underlined above should send out red flags. It basically says that LA isn't responsible for any updates or the quality of their product. Bugs or no bugs, the state of the software is technically not their responsibility. I don't personally agree with it, but everyone who installed this software did acknowledge that they read and understood the agreement. That's LA's loophole. I think it stinks, but it is what it is.

 

Incidentally, I got burned by LA's "X-Wing Alliance" many years ago. Since then, I always try to read reviews of any software packages (games or not) before I buy them. I say "try" because I have messed up and bought sequels to otherwise good games prior to reviewing them (Doom 3 and Rollercoaster Tycoon 3 come to mind.) Usually, I wish that I had just waited. For instance, even before the patch to KotOR 1, I bought it because it had good player reviews. I was dubious even then because (for those of us who remember its biggest controversy) there was no playable demo of it.

 

So, the moral of this story is that we (and by "we" I mean the customers, LucasArts, and Obsidian Entertainment) should learn from our mistakes. Customers should think twice before shelling out the big bucks to purchase software, and the companies that produce them should take the responsibility upon themselves to provide quality products and services.

 

[edited]

As I think more about it, I doubt seriously that OE's quality is to be questioned. I'm basing this statement off of correspondance that I've had with them. They seem like they really care. I would guess that LA has "tied their hands" in terms of providing any kind of official statements or support. Perhaps OE can learn from that mistake and specifically allow that type of customer relations with other contracts they win.

 

 

.. quietly steps down from the soapbox..

If the patch is done, there is absolutely no point no to release it. It LA wants to save bandwith, there is the BitTorrent solution. And even if LA has not set up any obligation to fix the bugs of their games in their license agreement, not fixing them is a very good way to increase piracy and to sink it's reputation.

As I think more about it, I doubt seriously that OE's quality is to be questioned.  I'm basing this statement off of correspondance that I've had with them.  They seem like they really care. 

 

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Wow... that is the biggest load of crap I have heard all April Fools Day... oh, sorry, you were serious??

Well, i am just gonna let the game gather dust on the shelf and since i have completed it once, i don't see the point in playing it again.

 

Lightside Male is enough for me. (since there is only minor flirting and non-existant endings)

 

I am still playing Kotor I, i have finished it 500 times or so and i still play it, but Kotor II, is a one time thing. (just call it a fling, a one night stand and then on the shelf type of thing)

 

The New additions in Kotor II is pretty cool, the reputations, the slightly more decent graphics is pretty cool, but the main thing that makes me cheat on Kotor II is the random loot crap. (i have to edit the game to give my jedi party members sabers and robes because you might be lucky if you find a single robe for yourself through the whole game and the rest don't get nothing at all)

 

But i found a neat mod that allowed you to make robes and sabers on the workbench, but that was after i got totally bored with the game and i think it has gathered several layers of dust by now, since i finished it about a week after i got it, i haven't touched it since.

 

If there is a kotor III, they had better not screw it up like they did with Kotor II. (lack of development and more importantly, it was so small...more planets, more open gameplay, but not too major so that it doesn't clash with their all mighty SWG, which they are screwing up every second they release an update. lol)

 

Its a good job my sister pays for it, i surely wouldn't. (i think Republic Commando is better and that game sucks)

 

Anyway, the patch will be out when it is out. (if it gets out, but you know companies....money first and then money second)

I have found some bugs in the game, yes...its got some, but they are not Oh-god-startover-time type...the game companies release buggy games, and patch them up on their own sweet time, if at all. I actually held on buying KOTOR 2, because reviews said it was buggy, but after a month I gave in and bought it....maybe next time I will not buy it, at least until a feasable patch is working....that way game companies might take notice...Here in mexico software piracy is rampant, and I actually shelled close to $65 for the original game, while the copy was $12...Software compa

We are going to get a patch released and are working to do so. I apologize for the time it has taken to be released and wish it was more within my control to get it released as quickly as possible.

We are going to get a patch released and are working to do so.  I apologize for the time it has taken to be released and wish it was more within my control to get it released as quickly as possible.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Patience is a virtue, they say.

 

Thanks for replying; it's nice to know that you guys are still working hard on trying to get it released, at least, as some of us were starting to get concerned after the long period with no update.

We are going to get a patch released and are working to do so.  I apologize for the time it has taken to be released and wish it was more within my control to get it released as quickly as possible.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thank you for the reply, and the apology. I'm sure that when you originally said that the patch would be coming soon, you didn't imagine that it would take this long.

 

Contrast this with the approach from LucasArts, who are probably NOT trying very hard to get the patch out, and certainly haven't bothered to communicate with the public about it. I appreciate Obsidian's willingness to come to these boards and post, even about something they're taking a lot of flak for and don't have full control over.

I am still playing Kotor I, i have finished it 500 times or so and i still play it, but Kotor II, is a one time thing. (just call it a fling, a one night stand and then on the shelf type of thing)

 

The New additions in Kotor II is pretty cool, the reputations, the slightly more decent graphics is pretty cool, but the main thing that makes me cheat on Kotor II is the random loot crap. (i have to edit the game to give my jedi party members sabers and robes because you might be lucky if you find a single robe for yourself through the whole game and the rest don't get nothing at all)

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

100% agreeable...nothing more to add.

BTW: please don

We are going to get a patch released and are working to do so.  I apologize for the time it has taken to be released and wish it was more within my control to get it released as quickly as possible.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thank you for the reply, and the apology. I'm sure that when you originally said that the patch would be coming soon, you didn't imagine that it would take this long.

 

Contrast this with the approach from LucasArts, who are probably NOT trying very hard to get the patch out, and certainly haven't bothered to communicate with the public about it. I appreciate Obsidian's willingness to come to these boards and post, even about something they're taking a lot of flak for and don't have full control over.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

All they have said is that the patch will be out soon and now this. The devs haven't said anything other than that!

[i don't believe there is a piece of software in history that had zero bugs

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Pong? :D

I might be imagining things, but I sense in Feargus' posts that he is also slightly impatient with LucasArts and how they handle this whole situation.

 

If we are really unlucky, LucasArts won't be bothered with releasing the patch until after Episode 3 hits the cinemas and all their crappy E3 games are released.

you know what's funny? everyone at LA is complainign that no one officially responds to threads like this giving any sign of where the patch is at or if it's still coming... here you get a reply and are then rude about it... i can understand being angry about it taking so long but there's no need to be rude to the one person actually TALKING to us even if only in a short message... and i'm damn glad to hear the patch si coming since "patch canceled" theories and topics are cropping up all over due to lack of comments on the subject by LA.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Feargus is a PAID developer and representative of OE. What he posted is what he should be doing. That is part of his job, take the good with the bad. I am also sure he is mature enough to distance himself from any personal attacks on him (or OE) on a internet forum as well.

 

I am bringing this up because everyone seems to think that just because a representative of a company posts that this somehow is something "special" and that we should be greatful.

 

Remember the days when devs used to post all the time?

 

Does anyone here play (or used to play) Ghost Recon? The devs at Redstorm were constantly posting and interacting on the boards with the community and that was what made that game so special besides the game itself. They never kept you in the dark -- They also didn't realease an unfinished game either, but that is another story.

 

My point is that while I appreciate Feargus' posts... We are now at a point in the industry where we, as gamers and consumers, are greatful for limited communication from actual game developers when communicating is (should be) part of their job -- or used to be -- And we've been forced to accept less than that and are "amazed" when we get one, two cryptic posts.

yes it's defintiely their job to keep the community posted, which LA is not doing. When surrounded by such crappy support at every corner, I don't think it's strange that people are happy for getting something along the lines of what they expect to get, namely feedback. And as with anything else i think people who actually do their job at least to some extent should not be treated with the same attitude as those who dont do jack. if we bitch at the ones doing their job a much and in the same rude way as at those who aren't doing their jobs, then why should they even bother? they're obviously not gonna get fired over it or else LA would have to be chucking all their q&a people. if there's positive feedback to doing what you should do chances are a lot higher you'll keep doing it than if there's no difference, imo.

also i don't know that anyone at obsidian could give more than a "cryptic" statement at this point since the patch is sitting at LA, and i highly doubt obsidian has much of a say in or knowledge of La's timeline. In any case, the only reason i said something is because i'm sick of weeding through a million curse word and obnoxious posts esp. when people got what they were looking/asking for: a reply/update all be it a rather general one (which again is hardly to be helped as the only people who could say something more concrete at this point would be LA, and they're not talking).

Thread Pruned and Closed. I would stronly urge all members to consider very catefully the manner in which they choose to post, as there are indeed consequences for poor choices.

 

Fionavar