Influence System Observations

[drcloak]

Atton is easy to choose as an example of how influence 'works'. Unfortunately, the same cannot be said about most of the other NPCs in your party.

 

For example, I had HandMaiden as Dark Side Mastery. I did something darkside with her in my group and lost influence lol.

 

Are you saying this is working as intended? If you are a Dark Jedi, with full Dark Side Mastery, and I did something evil in your presence, the last thing you would say to me is "This poor man only wanted our help, and you refused to give it!"

 

- dr cloak

[Volourn]

"Are you saying this is working as intended? If you are a Dark Jedi, with full Dark Side Mastery, and I did something evil in your presence, the last thing you would say to me is "This poor man only wanted our help, and you refused to give it!"

 

 

Hahaha! Influence is THA awesome!

[cewekeds]

I should be able to torture party memebers. Choke would be nice to get the info out. I also think the more evil you are the more scared they get. They should also get to the point were they either fight back or try to run away. Even get broken and tells you what every you want.

[Judge Hades]

This is a relatively new system and its not going to work perfectly. From what I heard of it, it is better than not having it at all and allwsy greater role playing for the single player. Is it perfect, not yet, but if Obsidian continues developing the Influence system, which I hope they do for NWN 2, it will be very rewarding.

 

It can only get better.

[Dark Wanderer]

It can only get better.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Only get better? I hope so...

 

But for what reason would they use it in NWN 2? If they do, through, then my interest in NWN would increase quite a bit...

[Judge Hades]

Well, from what I hear we will have quite a number of possible NPCs that can join the PC and you can have a party of four in NWN 2. A four person party is standard.

[Dark Wanderer]

Well, from what I hear we will have quite a number of possible NPCs that can join the PC and you can have a party of four in NWN 2.  A four person party is standard.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Quite a number, hmm? Like in BG? If so, it's good as we'll have quite a wide selection on what kind of party we want to have ^_^. And if the infludence system is used there, well, as you point out, then things could get really good :D

[Judge Hades]

Well, I hope they are putting the influence system in it.

[Volourn]

If it's as poorly implemented as it is in KOTOR2; I hope not. It seems to me that it's pretty much no different than any other RPG with joinable npcs except as a cheap way to get LS/DS points which was pretty much done in KOTOR1 anyways withiout a fancy name for it.

[Judge Hades]

Its a new mechanic, Volourn. Can't expect perfection from a new game mechanic, you know this.

[Volourn]

How is it a new mechanic?

 

It really does nothing new. You can influence npcs. Both BIO, and Obsidian/BIS games have been doing that years for the npcs without a fancy name.

 

Utterly silly.

[Judge Hades]

I haven't seen how Revan did any sort of influencing in the first KotOR. The NPCs did what they were going to do regardless what my character did or said. Except for that force persuading Zaalbar to kill Mission.

[Dark Wanderer]

I haven't seen how Revan did any sort of influencing in the first KotOR.  The NPCs did what they were going to do regardless what my character did or said.  Except for that force persuading Zaalbar to kill Mission.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

True. Same thing goes for other great RPG's. like BG. It's possible to infludence the characters in some small ways in that game thorugh, but throughly turn them?

[Volourn]

"It's possible to infludence the characters in some small ways in that game thorugh, but throughly turn them?"

 

Sarevok.

 

Imoen.

 

Batista.

 

Jaheira.

 

Viconia.

 

Aribeth.

 

The list goes on.

[Judge Hades]

Aribeth? That two dimensional character was worthless. How the hell can you influence her? No matter what you do she still betrays Neverwinter. Killed her for that.

 

Imoen? That is a laugh. She pretty much stayed the same through out the game and Sarevok was a simple minded oaf that only cared about one thing. Himself. There was no influence with those characters.

 

You are strenching it, Volourn. Stretching it alot.

[Volourn]

"Aribeth? That two dimensional character was worthless. How the hell can you influence her? No matter what you do she still betrays Neverwinter. Killed her for that."

 

You didn't seem to play HOTU. You can also influence her in the OC. Sure, she 'betrays' NW (only after the city betrays her first); but you can also get her to see the errors of the way.

 

 

"Imoen? That is a laugh. She pretty much stayed the same through out the game"

 

Most likely, yes. But there are subtle changes as well due to your character's influence on her. However, she is the wekaest of the inflouence.

 

 

"Sarevok was a simple minded oaf that only cared about one thing. Himself."

 

This is only true if you didn't bother to help him in TOB, and don't help him come to an understanding of good vs. evil. Sure, he never becomes pure eharted; but he most cetrainly cares about others. HINT: His ending in TOB proves this.

 

This surely beats the lame "Pure Hearted Jedi turns to Evil Doer because you said theyw ere HOT" in KOTOR2.

 

R00fles!

[Dark Wanderer]

"It's possible to infludence the characters in some small ways in that game thorugh, but throughly turn them?"

 

Sarevok.

 

Imoen.

 

Batista.

 

Jaheira.

 

Viconia.

 

Aribeth.

 

The list goes on.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I can only completely agree for Sarevok - if you infludenced him enough, his alignament changed, if I remember correctly. If you were a Male PC and took the Viconia romance route, then you could get her to get (mostly) rid of her evil nature, but that's about it and her non-love ending in ToB hints that she was on that path already - After all, she abandoned the Spider Queen, so she's not a throughly evil chick any longer... but as for the others? Never seen that you could infludence them to become evil or good...

 

Aribeth - yes, you could convince her to abandon her evil path, but that was quite late in the game after she had given herself to evil and did not change much, if anything at all - we don't get to know her fate after the end of the game, after all, so...

[Volourn]

"Aribeth - yes, you could convince her to abandon her evil path, but that was quite late in the game after she had given herself to evil and did not change much, if anything at all - we don't get to know her fate after the end of the game, after all, so... "

 

HOTU...

[Dark Wanderer]

"Aribeth - yes, you could convince her to abandon her evil path, but that was quite late in the game after she had given herself to evil and did not change much, if anything at all - we don't get to know her fate after the end of the game, after all, so... "

 

HOTU...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Never brought that one - played thorugh NWN once and then felt like most of my interest in it had been spent, so I turned my attention to what games that pulled my interest more - and those things did not include any of the so-called expansions to NWN...

[Volourn]

Then game over.

[Dark Wanderer]

Then game over.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

. Yeah, yeah... I MAY take a closer look at the expansions someday, when I have a job and thus can risk spending money on things that might not be rated as top-stuff. Until then, thorugh, it's "Game Over" for me, through ;p

[Aaron Contreras]

People are missing the fact that the Dark Side path is more akin to a true Sith Lord.  You can lie to your party members, placate them, and then twist them to do evil deeds.  Once you have influence on them, you can corrupt them completely.  If you constantly tell your party members to screw off and attempt to bully them, you're not going to turn many people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think what is missing is a consistent false flattery option:

 

1. What a great idea Atton! You're so cool!

2. [Lie] What a great idea Atton! You're so cool!

 

I really don't like how buttering up your party members can often result in shifts to the light side. Twisting actions to your benefit would also have empowered the player immensely. Say you do something really evil (or good) which results in a flat Influence loss with a party member. Give the player the opportunity to Persuade/Influence the NPC to cancel out the Influence loss of your actions.

[Naso]

Eh, I'm not sure those major plot-point scripted binary choices for characters are the same as influence. They're good, but they're fairly sudden. Not quite the same thing. I don't know about the KotOR2 influence yet so can't really say either way. Some peoples' stories make it sound horribly buggy, some peoples' make it sound just like a good first step.

[EnderAndrew]

I don't think it's buggy.

 

Let's consider what some people are complaining about.

 

Let's say your dark, and you twisted the Handmaiden dark. People are complaining that you lose influence with her with some dark options. Influence isn't based simply on light and dark. You gain inlfuence with one person with overty cruelty, and lose influence with another person.

 

But, in this case, Handmaiden objects to a particular cruel action that she witnesses. A true Sith Lord hides their cruel behavior.

 

Either way, if you gained influence by doing whatever you are naturally inclined to do, then you'd max influence with all the party members with no effort.

 

That is a broken system.

[Jad'en]

Even Evil people have good in them or moral's left... you just have find the right way to stimulate these