UFOs in Mexico

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

And don't they know it! Flying around, abducting humans, administering anal probes and letting them go. And the only thing they've learned is that 1 out of 10 seems to like the probe.

 

Thank you, Kids In The Hall.

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Alien equivelent of cow tipping maybe.

[Rhomal]

  The speeds and ships of the UFOs in this case were ridiculously superior to our own.

 

  This event is not speculation.  As it was confirmed by a whole battalion of military troops.  The fighter pilots and hundreds of civilians. Complimented by videos, pictures, as well as an official confirmation by the Mexican Government.  So no, this is not a theory by 'crazies' G-pa.

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You got a link to this anywhere? It's peaked my interest.

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I used to run a pagan/occult/paranormal news and community site. If I had it still up I'd send you some links of news stories of reputiable sources that would boggle your mind. Stories like this happen on almost a WEEKLY basis. The main stream media are apprehensive (sp?) to carry such 9 out of 10 times for several reasons.

 

a. If they do carry/follow the story and it IS a hoax they end up with egg on their face. And loosing face like that is a big no-no in that field. As they fear no one will take then seriously again.

 

b. The bigger reason, IMO, is the 'dont shake the boat' mentality. Broadcasting something such as this and it be true/coverup would shake the foundations of our perceived reality and many beleif systems. thats something the powers that be dont want for obvious reasons. If its proven other intellegent life exists there goes a few 1000 yrs of teaching from the bible out the window for example.

[Whitemithrandir]

Damn aliens are snooping around because they don't have a green card.

[Product of the Cosmos]

"There are a few things that always bother me about ET sightings. One for a race who has found a way of faster than light travel they sure haven't developed better technology to say scan us from space out of our perception."

 

How would we know if they had this ?! And perception is not the only thing the mind is limited to

 

"Also if we have stealth technology, why couldn't they?"

 

lol, no reason. If they are here, they obviously do

 

"Again if it is a fact finding mission it would probably be done by their militery or scientific people I doubt they would likely joy ride in our atmosphere."

 

! You wouldn't joyride on a new amaing planet if you were exploring it?! I certainly would!!!

 

"Now to me the roswell scenario is more believeble as no matter how advanced the tecnology there can always be for lack of a better term "human" error."

 

True. The Roswell crash happened as result of lightening hitting the plane which was propelled by a gravity field of some sort(if I recolect Corso's claims correctly). Very possible. But IMO there are very many different types of beings already here. Some may even be walking amongst us, and we don't even notice it.

 

"I believe in the possibility of ET life I just really haven't seen any concrete proof yet."

 

If it interests you investigate. There is a wealth of info out there for anyone who has the will to know.

[xanas3712]

If its proven other intellegent life exists there goes a few 1000 yrs of teaching from the bible out the window for example.

 

Not really, the bible never makes it anywhere close to clear that there isn't other intelligent life in the universe. If we found other life it would be proof that some peoples assumptions based on theology are inaccurate. Some theologians would have something to answer for, but they shouldn't have been saying such ridiculous things in the first place. A good theologian leaves possibilities open rather than pretending like they know how everything is and will turn out. And there is plenty of room to do that.

[Rhomal]

If its proven other intellegent life exists there goes a few 1000 yrs of teaching from the bible out the window for example.

 

Not really, the bible never makes it anywhere close to clear that there isn't other intelligent life in the universe. If we found other life it would be proof that some peoples assumptions based on theology are inaccurate. Some theologians would have something to answer for, but they shouldn't have been saying such ridiculous things in the first place. A good theologian leaves possibilities open rather than pretending like they know how everything is and will turn out. And there is plenty of room to do that.

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I agree with you 150%, but my point was MANY of them dont heed such notions. Their thumping their little bible (full of mistranslations and inconsistiances, but thats another topic) preaching because their god loves us how we can only be the only possible intel life in the universe or how we are the superior beings of said universe. I agree thats a leap they take and the bible does not say such, but then again much of what those people behind the pulpit preach is based on wishful thinking and fantasy rather then hard fact or data sadly.

 

Now in fairness I am not saying all theologians go down that road, but many do. I can remember when I was a roman catholic had more then one sermen basically saying man will never find any other intel life in the galaxy because god made us.

 

I also think it has to do with theologians trying to convience themselves theres more to life then this. And it scares the hell out of them that this is it. There may not be anything more then the moment we live in. We may very well be insignificant beings that lives, in relation to the entire lifespan of the universe, in a small moment of time and our lives, in the big picture, mean nothing. I think that scares many people, hence why they go to religion as they want to be told they are more then that, they want to hear they are important and significant. When, IMO, the reality of the situation is quite different but dont want to be told the truth.

[taks]

uh, actually, i think the problem the biblical teachings have with alien lifeforms isn't really "there is NO intelligent life other than here" since that is not directly stated. the problem is twofold, actually...

 

1. if there is life elsewhere, particularly intelligent, suddenly we aren't unique and what was god doing? timeshare?

 

2. if there is life elsewhere, particularly more advanced than us, the possibility that said life put us here intentionally increases. their current presence would possibly indicate a case of "lab-rat analysis" so to speak. this pretty much shoots the whole god thing in the foot, btw, as said alien life woulld actually be our "god."

 

i typically lean toward the latter explanation of what's going on, btw...

 

taks

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

us, the possibility that said life put us here intentionally increases.  their current presence would possibly indicate a case of "lab-rat analysis" so to speak.  this pretty much shoots the whole god thing in the foot, btw, as said alien life woulld actually be our "god."

 

i typically lean toward the latter explanation of what's going on, btw...

 

taks

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Like a game of Sim earth isnt it. Once evolution reaches the point you want it to. Like having a race of intelligent birds then you launch a big asteroid and start over and life takes a new path.

 

It's not inconceivable that aliens do study humans because humans do exactly the same thing to what they consider lower lifeforms.

 

It would be pretty funny if aliens landed and told everyone they genetically engineered them from ape DNA though

[taks]

it is also reasonable to assume they would have a difficult time communicating with us due to their level of advancement. akin to humans trying to communicate with an ant, for example. perhaps we're sooooo far behind that they could never properly get their point across.

 

taks

[BetaSquad]

Alien teenagers out for a joyride.

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Well, as a ceritfied Class A Alien version 2.6 (BetaSquad edition) myself, I have to tell you that this is the most correct answer so far on this topic. Very good guesses all around, but you were all off by just a tad. Must be the puny 3 Dimentions you are confined to. We have 5...thousand.

 

Btw, have any of you read the short story 'The Road Not Taken' by Harry Turtledove? It has a very unique view on the whole idea of how alien life might have evolved. But then again, so does 'Devolution', 'Dark They Were, and Golden-Eyed', and 'One' (Not all by that author of course, but all as thought provoking)

[Rhomal]

> uh, actually, i think the problem the biblical teachings have with alien lifeforms isn't really "there is NO intelligent life other than here" since that is not directly stated. the problem is twofold, actually...

 

Thats for the most part the main point of my post. While the bible does not say or even imply, from what I recall we are the only intel/unique being in the universe many who stand behind the pulpit DO make such assertions.

 

> 1. if there is life elsewhere, particularly intelligent, suddenly we aren't unique and what was god doing? timeshare?

 

LOL

 

> 2. if there is life elsewhere, particularly more advanced than us, the possibility that said life put us here intentionally increases. their current presence would possibly indicate a case of "lab-rat analysis" so to speak. this pretty much shoots the whole god thing in the foot, btw, as said alien life woulld actually be our "god."

 

*nods* I more or less agree with your theory. Tho I am in the camp of reincarnation (I think there is a huge amount of data to validiate such a theory or at the very least raise some serious inquiry) I do not have a issue with accepting we are small fish in a VERY big pond.

[Product of the Cosmos]

"> 2. if there is life elsewhere, particularly more advanced than us, the possibility that said life put us here intentionally increases. their current presence would possibly indicate a case of "lab-rat analysis" so to speak. this pretty much shoots the whole god thing in the foot, btw, as said alien life woulld actually be our "god.""

 

If we help a planet grow a species like us, are we God? If we we're religious and did this, would we suddenly become God? Last I heard God created everything according to those religious. And Eden etc is history of our occurance translated into mythology. I guess some people who 'thump the bible' hardcore(lmao@that term) would flip out...

 

"if there is life elsewhere, particularly intelligent, suddenly we aren't unique"

 

If a pentagon discovers there is a triangle(or indeed a plethora or different 'shapes'), is the pentagon not unique anymore? I think it still is. =P

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

"> 2. if there is life elsewhere, particularly more advanced than us, the possibility that said life put us here intentionally increases. their current presence would possibly indicate a case of "lab-rat analysis" so to speak. this pretty much shoots the whole god thing in the foot, btw, as said alien life woulld actually be our "god.""

 

  If we help a planet grow a species like us, are we God?  If we we're religious and did this, would we suddenly become God?  Last I heard God created everything according to those religious.  And Eden etc is history of our occurance translated into mythology.  I guess some people who 'thump the bible' hardcore(lmao@that term) would flip out...

 

"if there is life elsewhere, particularly intelligent, suddenly we aren't unique"

 

  If a pentagon discovers there is a triangle(or indeed a plethora or different 'shapes'), is the pentagon not unique anymore?  I think it still is.  =P

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As we evolve we constantly re evaluate what it means to "play god".

 

If the only criteria to be god is to be worshipped then some pop stars have that covered right there. Creation of life ? Well we can already do that. Shaping life to our needs. Yep we can do that too.

 

If religion claims there is only one god. Then yes having more than one is a bit of a problem for them.

 

It's not that far fetched to see how humans could create a world (not from scratch mind you, but by modifying its atmosphere). And seed such a world with life.

[taks]

  If we help a planet grow a species like us, are we God?  If we we're religious and did this, would we suddenly become God?  Last I heard God created everything according to those religious.  And Eden etc is history of our occurance translated into mythology.  I guess some people who 'thump the bible' hardcore(lmao@that term) would flip out...

you missed my point... if they "created" us, then yes, they become our "god." that's why i put the quotes around god. that does not superceded the possibility of another god (logic does that by itself). the point is that we are suddenly not created by some omniscient power, but by other mortal (presumed) beings...

 

If a pentagon discovers there is a triangle(or indeed a plethora or different 'shapes'), is the pentagon not unique anymore?  I think it still is.  =P

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what??? that doesn't make sense. the religious believe we are unique in the universe... "unique" defined as "the only planet with life" or better "god's children." if it turns out that another race created us, this belief is obviously incorrect. you're trying to apply a micro view to a macro situation.

 

taks

[Dakoth]

What I love about us bible thumpers is we always point to the verse in the bible that said we are made in Gods image. What most think and I tend to disagree with are we are made in Gods exact image.

[Gorth]

What I love about us bible thumpers is we always point to the verse in the bible that said we are made in Gods image.  What most think and I tend to disagree with are we are made in Gods exact image.

 

Interesting point Dakoth.

 

Without the benefit of emoticons or footnotes, it could have meant anything from a cloned image (likeness wise) to an erect walking bi-pedal mammal (primate). It's all in the interpretation

[xanas3712]

uh, actually, i think the problem the biblical teachings have with alien lifeforms isn't really "there is NO intelligent life other than here" since that is not directly stated.  the problem is twofold, actually...

 

1. if there is life elsewhere, particularly intelligent, suddenly we aren't unique and what was god doing?  timeshare?

As funny as this comment is, your assumptions about what the problems are I think are incorrect. Sure, God could be doing timeshare. So what? God is supposed to be all-powerful/knowing so it's hardly difficult for him to do 2 things at once. I certainly can't say that he hasn't.

 

2. if there is life elsewhere, particularly more advanced than us, the possibility that said life put us here intentionally increases.  their current presence would possibly indicate a case of "lab-rat analysis" so to speak.  this pretty much shoots the whole god thing in the foot, btw, as said alien life woulld actually be our "god."

 

Not really, because God is by definition (within Christianity since we are discussing the Bible) both imminent and transcendant. He created the universe. Any alien's existence is contingent on the universe. Now while you could certainly say that what we perceive as God could possibly be in many cases aliens, there is certainly no way you could explain everything that we attribute to God as alien. The creation of the universe being one of those things. There are other explanations out there now (quantum explanations) but I have never really bought them, considering we have no idea how things work outside the universe and can certainly not guarantee anything to that degree. There is also some pretty amazing stuff about how the universe started that leads me to believe that the process was more than random, but anyway..

 

I'm going to reply to the other point that was made by someone else here . can't remember who said it in reading through, and that's the idea that God having created something else makes us less "unique" Well, God created angels first of all, so we are already not unique insofar as we have intelligence, etc. We are not the most powerful of beings created. "In his image" was another statement used later and the proper interpretation of that. Well, being the believer in the Bible that I am I think you have to take that with the rest of the Bible and find the context as a whole. I tend to believe that the only thing being referred to there is that we are intelligent, self-motivated beings. We have a true free will and intelligence (if you are Calvinist you believe we *had* a free will until the fall but that's beside the point). I personally don't believe to any extent we can recreate intelligence as it exists in us, but we will be able to design better simulations of it. But this restriction is certainly not on God, he can do whatever he wants. We do not have to be unique, just know that we are here because that was what God wanted. It's entirely unnecessary (nor is it stated) that we are the only thing God has ever done, or will ever do.

 

I tend to think that's where the idea that religious people are arrogant spreads. Theologians try to define too much. Though, I have to say being somewhat of a fundamentalist that many would find me pretty arrogant anyway I don't buy into relativist ethics and I think that I'm right.. but I don't really think most people are any different, they just don't want me telling them they are wrong. They don't mind telling me that I am wrong for believing so however I've always found that funny.

[Product of the Cosmos]

"you missed my point... if they "created" us, then yes, they become our "god." that's why i put the quotes around god. that does not superceded the possibility of another god (logic does that by itself). the point is that we are suddenly not created by some omniscient power, but by other mortal (presumed) beings..."

 

In the scenario under the belief system your using, God created them , in which they helped create us. And with current superstition of such believers, if this scenrio was proven they would probably fall back on 'God was guiding them', or something along those lines.

 

Cosmos:"If a pentagon discovers there is a triangle(or indeed a plethora or different 'shapes'), is the pentagon not unique anymore? I think it still is. =P"

 

 

"what??? that doesn't make sense. the religious believe we are unique in the universe... "unique" defined as "the only planet with life" or better "god's children." if it turns out that another race created us, this belief is obviously incorrect. you're trying to apply a micro view to a macro situation."

 

Please bring to my attention in the bible where it says 'We are the only planet with life'. I think such is an assumption by believers, not in the material itself. But I have not read the full bible. So please fill me in if I'm missing something.

 

And as for being the only planet with life, well Carl Sagan pretty much proved that ridiculously unlikely while creating life with

 

elements our planet had in its earlier days+electricity=life is created

 

a few decades ago...

 

Not to mention as far as I know there is no definite definition of the word 'planet'. If Pluto is a planet in terms of parameters, we have about 2 dozen planets in our solar system.

 

As for the term 'God's children'. No matter what, this can be used in any scenario, EBE planted or not.

[Dakoth]

Quote from Gorth

 

Without the benefit of emoticons or footnotes, it could have meant anything from a cloned image (likeness wise) to an erect walking bi-pedal mammal (primate). It's all in the interpretation

 

Quote from Xanas.

 

I tend to believe that the only thing being referred to there is that we are intelligent, self-motivated beings. We have a true free will and intelligence (if you are Calvinist you believe we *had* a free will until the fall but that's beside the point).

 

Both of these quotes illustrate exactly what I tried to point out, I feel when it was said we were made in Gods image it was more of an abstract thing not litterally an exact image of what God looks like.

[taks]

As funny as this comment is, your assumptions about what the problems are I think are incorrect.  Sure, God could be doing timeshare.  So what?  God is supposed to be all-powerful/knowing so it's hardly difficult for him to do 2 things at once.  I certainly can't say that he hasn't.

you TOTALLY missed my point. i'm not saying this is what is the problem, i'm saying this is what religious people fear. pay attention. just because you don't think that way doesn't mean a vast majority don't. this is a rather common idea...

 

Not really, because God is by definition *snip*

again...

 

taks

[taks]

I think such is an assumption by believers, not in the material itself.

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that's my ENTIRE POINT PoTC... sheeeeesh... is it that hard to understand? this is what people BELIEVE, not what the bible says. for god's sake i'm agreeing with you and you continue to argue moot points.

 

get OVER YOURSELF!

 

taks

[taks]

  And as for being the only planet with life, well Carl Sagan pretty much proved that ridiculously unlikely while creating life with elements our planet had in its earlier days+electricity=life is created

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hehe, not really. you can't "prove" unlikely or likely. terms unlikely and likely are probabilistic arguments. carl sagan provided a logical argument that said a lack of life was unlikely. he didn't prove anything...

 

i agree with him, btw, before you go and get your panties in a stitch.

 

taks

[Child of Flame]

<thinks about C.S. Lewis' Space Trilogy*>

 

 

*Read the customer reviews if you aren't familiar with these books.

[Product of the Cosmos]

I think such is an assumption by believers, not in the material itself.

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that's my ENTIRE POINT PoTC... sheeeeesh... is it that hard to understand? this is what people BELIEVE, not what the bible says. for god's sake i'm agreeing with you and you continue to argue moot points.

 

get OVER YOURSELF!

 

taks

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I just wanted to see if you had a scripture where it said that. No reason for the audacity.

 

And as denial goes, when proven wrong, fall back on anything you can is the method of religion IMO. lol. Since it's not written in the scriptures those who benefit from the scriptures followers would make that clear. And say they were wrong in interpretation(agian, lol, for the trillionth time).

 

 

"hehe, not really. you can't "prove" unlikely or likely. terms unlikely and likely are probabilistic arguments. carl sagan provided a logical argument that said a lack of life was unlikely. he didn't prove anything...

 

i agree with him, btw, before you go and get your panties in a stitch.

 

taks"

 

Unlikely and likely are probabilities. They are not statements of absolute proof. Yes, you can prove highly unlikely or highly likely. By presenting a piece of evidence that changes the open minded unknowing variables to more likely, or unlikely.

 

He DID prove something though, something HUGE!!!!!! That life can be made with elements and electricity! That is big! Considering planets in our own solar system have electricity and the ability to evolve atmospherically. And considering the countless numbers of planets out there. This makes life probability so high there is no number, well, 99.99 with a line over it, for the probability there is life out there like, or more advanced then us.

[zer"0"]

Quick question. What would your initial reaction be to hearing/seeing a real live E.T? Maybe mentally and technologically more advanced than our species?

 

To be honest... My initial reaction would be sheer fear. I would think first to protect myself and my family. Even if the E.T was not acting hostile, because how do I know what if any morals guide it.

Most humans act instinctively to danger, its hardcoded in our genes.

 

Can humans as a species, that has total dominion over earth and no predator to speak of - Accept the existance of another species as intelligent, advanced as their own??

IMO instinct would drive humans to war with any species we couldn't control or destroy.

Just look at what we do to ourselves/eachother everyday... hmm?