Anime, the eternal Jettokōsutā

[Bartimaeus]

Paranoia Agent, the end. Strange, a little inexplicable at times, but very good.

Spoiler

I'm not clear on all of the details of how everything worked, but I guess it doesn't really matter, since this ended up being 99% theme-driven.

I believe that just about concludes watching all of Kon's film works besides the Jojo's Bizarre Adventure OVA (1993-1994) that he made as well as the the very first thing he worked on, which is some live-action horror comedy movie called World Apartment Horror. It's been real, guys.

 

Edited June 25, 2021 by Bartimaeus

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

9 minutes ago, Bartimaeus said:

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure OVA (1993-1994) that he made

Holy ****, I had no idea that was him.

[Bartimaeus]

17 minutes ago, KP the meanie zucchini said:

Holy ****, I had no idea that was him.

Was it good / how does it compare to the rest of Jojo (stylistically)?

Edited June 25, 2021 by Bartimaeus

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

57 minutes ago, Bartimaeus said:

Was it good / how does it compare to the rest of Jojo (stylistically)?

It was 90's anime and very condensed. Personally I think losing all the stand users is pretty negative because it'd be like if someone took out half the fun monsters and schemes from Sailor Moon.

As to a comparison, it draws from the manga and looks like part 3, with some changes. Here's a chart comparing characters from Ova and Anime.

And here's how Araki's style has changed in the manga.

Compared to the anime it's not as bright but it's still recognizable as the same thing.

[Bartimaeus]

@KP the meanie zucchini I'm sorry, I was very imprecise in how I asked that (even after I edited in the parentheses-ed "stylistically", too!). In terms of art style, I am willing to overlook the art for Kon (although I THINK I like how those characters are drawn a bit better in comparison to the general anime) - what I meant was more to do with writing, characters, themes...that sort of thing. I imagine that even if it is more Kon-ish, that it would still be pretty difficult for me to just pick up out of the blue as a non-Jojo fan?

Edited June 25, 2021 by Bartimaeus

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

8 minutes ago, Bartimaeus said:

what I meant was more to do with writing, characters, themes...that sort of thing. I imagine that even if it is more Kon-ish, that it would still be pretty difficult for me to just pick up out of the blue as a non-Jojo fan?

It's still very much JoJo, so Kon's involvement may not be a game changer for you.

[Bartimaeus]

6 minutes ago, KP the meanie zucchini said:

It's still very much JoJo, so Kon's involvement may not be a game changer for you.

I'll probably still give it a try at some point anyways, I think. Kon has a style and standard that makes his stuff work so much better for me than your standard anime that I'm willing to at least give him the benefit of the doubt, . May or may not translate to that OVA...only one way to find out.

(e): For clarification, apparently he co-wrote the series with Hiroyuki Kitakubo; he did some some additional directing, storyboarding, and animation, but was not like, by any means the main person responsible for any of that. So I guess I'll see what I'll see!

Edited June 25, 2021 by Bartimaeus

[majestic]

You really just need to ask one question. Stand users or no, does anyone yell JOESTAR-SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN?

If no, then hard pass.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

5 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

I'll probably still give it a try at some point anyways, I think. Kon has a style and standard that makes his stuff work so much better for me than your standard anime that I'm willing to at least give him the benefit of the doubt, . May or may not translate to that OVA...only one way to find out.

(e): For clarification, apparently he co-wrote the series with Hiroyuki Kitakubo; he did some some additional directing, storyboarding, and animation, but was not like, by any means the main person responsible for any of that. So I guess I'll see what I'll see!

Go ahead, I'm not trying to discourage you and I think I've stanned JoJo enough for it to be clear I love it. If you like it you may just want to skip the JoJo anime until Diamond is Unbreakable (s3). That part is almost entirely like the filler stuff you liked about Sailor Moon, and the main villain is David Bowie with a weird fetish.

1 hour ago, majestic said:

You really just need to ask one question. Stand users or no, does anyone yell JOESTAR-SAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN?

If no, then hard pass.

Speedwagon, Baron Zephelli Von Stroheim, Smokey, the Pillar Men, and half the stands are missing from the OVA. But at least Jotaro still throws a dog at a disabled man.

[InsaneCommander]

23 hours ago, KP the meanie zucchini said:

AoT s4 (the final season): time skips and more child soldiers, still the same show. I'm looking forward to being done with it.

Final season... part 1. Part 2 who knows when it will be available.

[majestic]

Episode 4 of Love Live! School Idol Project was a bit weird, because the fanservice just crept into the character stuff.

At least I really see no other reason for that girl fight over the shy one who wants to join the group but is too, uhm, shy to do that. They're kind of fighting with each other over who of the two gets to drag the shy girl to the band to sign up. The composer of the song is called Maki, the shy girl is Hanayo and her childhood friend is called Rin. So Rin and Maki drag Hanayo to sign up and join as well.

There's some weak justification for the fight over Hanayo, she talked to Maki earlier and Rin seems a bit jealous, but eh... that's... nope, that's just there for the viewers to see two girls squabble over a third one.

Beats the other scene where Honoka's sister, wearing only a towel, was pleading with her breasts to grow a little. *headscratch*

You know what's the worst part about all of this?

Spoiler

I'm currently more likely to start the next episode of Love Live! School Idol Project than the next Clear Card episodes. There, I said it. This isn't a raving endorsement of Love Live!, it just shows how disappointing Clear Card is when viewed directly after the original anime.

So, @Bartimaeus, once you're done with the original CCS and maybe want to check out Clear Card regardless of me finding it to be disappointing, let it rest for a while. Like, long enough for nostalgia to kick in.

 

[Bartimaeus]

Maybe I'll just watch Sailor Moon Eternal (without having seen the rest of SMC) right before, .

[majestic]

1 minute ago, Bartimaeus said:

Maybe I'll just watch Sailor Moon Eternal (without having seen the rest of SMC) right before, .

It's a pretty good contrast to SuperS. At times, it makes SuperS look well thought out.

[majestic]

I want to add one positive side effect of moving the new Cardcaptor Sakura season to a more contemporary setting.

Tomoyo has a drone which enhanced her stalking capabilities greatly.

Spoiler

Too bad it also means that certain characters who could easily respond to her e-mails and texts decide to douchwaffle Sakura for some ominous plot point or two. Yeah, needless to say, I don't like that one at all. Whatever is going on right now, you condescending pricks, don't you think she earned some honesty by now?

Spoiler

It involves Shaoran, Eriol (the transfer student from the second season) and Sailor Jupiter. Nope, don't like this at all.

 

 

Edited June 26, 2021 by majestic

[Bartimaeus]

I finally have the Italian DVDs for Sailor Stars. A bit late on the draw, but better late than never.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/lwuvg342kpllqdx/qSUjYSLW7M.mp4

...It's not season 1/2/3 still, but at least it's not the disgusting smeared mess that are the blurays. There are actual lines! Strong and consistent line-work is one of my big things for art styles, and upscales like Sailor Moon's blurays absolutely demolish all of the line-work in an already pretty shaky Sailor Stars.

P.S. Once I finish the last handful of episodes of Ranma, I should be back on Sakura, I THINK.

Edited June 27, 2021 by Bartimaeus

[majestic]

25 minutes ago, Bartimaeus said:

I finally have the Italian DVDs for Sailor Stars. A bit late on the draw, but better late than never.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/lwuvg342kpllqdx/qSUjYSLW7M.mp4

...It's not season 1/2/3 still, but at least it's not the disgusting smeared mess that are the blurays. There are actual lines! Strong and consistent line-work is one of my big things for art styles, and upscales like Sailor Moon's blurays absolutely demolish all of the line-work in an already pretty shaky Sailor Stars.

Usagi on the ferris wheel.

Sailor Stars might have tried to reach too far and failed a little, might have Shinji-ed Usagi at the end, had an ending run of episodes that felt both too rushed and too slow at the same time (that will always be an achievement), didn't do enough with Makoto and Ami (Ami even gets the distinction of being focused on in both episodes of this season that are arguably ungood hat aren't in the story finale) and had really weird designs (that can be blamed on Ms. Takeuchi, at least), stuck to the formula in a manner that made it obvious that the writers wanted to simply do away with it but weren't allowed to (how else do you explain the 30 second fights), had some really sketchy artwork and made it abundantly clear that Seiya would be a better fit for Usagi than Mamoru, and last - but certainly not least - it gave a huge idiot ball to Haruka, but... 

But... when it was good, and that it frequently was, then it was damned good.

Sailor Moon is sure strange in some regards. Sailor Stars has none of the episodes of Sailor Moon I would put in an overall top 10 list, maybe not even in a top 20, its villains, apart from Iron Mouse perhaps, are all significantly less interesting, fun or developed than the regular ones from Sailor Moon S. Not counting the one-offs at the end there, and yes, that does include Kaorinite if only for the fun things she gets to do/say with/to Hotaru.

But still, I'd rank it second overall, and that pretty close to S - but I said that numerous times now.

I think all the girls together, as a group of friends, are really strong in Sailor Stars, maybe better than ever, even though Rei and Usagi clearly got the largest focus. That doesn't mean Rei does a lot on her own, but what she does is really great.

Going to stop myself now, before this becomes too long. Again. Sure love talking about Sailor Moon.

33 minutes ago, Bartimaeus said:

P.S. Once I finish the last handful of episodes of Ranma, I should be back on Sakura, I THINK.

Hoooooooooeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

Are you going to start with the first movie, since you're already past the point where it was supposed to be watched?

 

Oh, and, episode 5 of Love Live! was not that good. It had less fanservice, but also not a very interesting storyline about an idol stalker girl the president of the Idol Research Club. She ends up joining the group, because everyone must.

That's something a little weird, the opening credits has this music performance by µ's:

Which totally is a spoiler because each and every one of them that aren't Umi, Honoka and Kotori, need episodes to be recruited. Sometimes multiple. And all... yeah, except Hanayo, who is called Kayo by her friend for some weird kanji-pronunciation reason, all don't want to join at first and need some convincing. Hanayo wants to join, but needs encouragement.

Good job show.

So, where was I? Oh, right. Episode 5 was a bit of a letdown. Not bad, but the good bits weren't as good as the ones before, and the bad bits... ey, weren't as bad as before. Sigh. Can we have a good episode with the amount of fanservice in this one now?

[Lexx]

^ that video above is exactly the kind of anime that made me not look at anime for years. Horrible stuff.

[majestic]

1 hour ago, Lexx said:

^ that video above is exactly the kind of anime that made me not look at anime for years. Horrible stuff.

But why? It's just Usagi on a ferris whe... oh, wait, you're talking about the Love Live! opening credits.

Love Live!, so far, has been... less ungood than I expected, but not enough so to really recommend it regardless of it's presentation. I'm not sure how this got so popular. The fanservice is there, but not good, frequent or well integrated enough to be the primary reason to watch it if one likes that sort of thing, the character interactions are sometimes fun, but not enough so, and probably most damning of all, with the band apparently eventually getting nine members, there are too many characters to handle. The episodes so far were at their best when it was just Honoka, Umi and Kotori trying to get their idol club started.

However, to be completely fair, I don't hate watching it. Which is really unexpected. Honoka, Umi and Kotori also make a pretty okay Freudian trio (tm), which is probably why their interactions are better than the others.

However, good news, I just read that episode 10 is the beach episode. This is going to be great, I'm certain of it. Beach episodes are always the best.

[majestic]

Okay, Cardcaptor Sakura: Clear Card is officially dead.

Just had an episode without Tomoyo.

Spoiler

The mysterious transfer student has a plush bunny that she brought over to Sakura's place. Actually she brings it everywhere, and it's always poking out of her bag. It's been in focus shots every now and then, and it sure moves around a lot for a plush toy. It even looked happy that Sakura captured two cards in this episode. Unless this is all set up for a big inversion/fake-out we're three for three mysterious transfer students with magical powers. It was already a stretch the second time around during the Sakura Card arc, but this is ridiculous.

I'd be willing to overlook such details if the rest of the arc was great, but it just isn't.

[Bartimaeus]

10 hours ago, majestic said:

Sailor Stars might have tried to reach too far and failed a little, might have Shinji-ed Usagi at the end, had an ending run of episodes that felt both too rushed and too slow at the same time (that will always be an achievement), didn't do enough with Makoto and Ami (Ami even gets the distinction of being focused on in both episodes of this season that are arguably ungood hat aren't in the story finale) and had really weird designs (that can be blamed on Ms. Takeuchi, at least), stuck to the formula in a manner that made it obvious that the writers wanted to simply do away with it but weren't allowed to (how else do you explain the 30 second fights), had some really sketchy artwork and made it abundantly clear that Seiya would be a better fit for Usagi than Mamoru, and last - but certainly not least - it gave a huge idiot ball to Haruka, but... 

But... when it was good, and that it frequently was, then it was damned good.

Sailor Moon is sure strange in some regards. Sailor Stars has none of the episodes of Sailor Moon I would put in an overall top 10 list, maybe not even in a top 20, its villains, apart from Iron Mouse perhaps, are all significantly less interesting, fun or developed than the regular ones from Sailor Moon S. Not counting the one-offs at the end there, and yes, that does include Kaorinite if only for the fun things she gets to do/say with/to Hotaru.

But still, I'd rank it second overall, and that pretty close to S - but I said that numerous times now.

I think all the girls together, as a group of friends, are really strong in Sailor Stars, maybe better than ever, even though Rei and Usagi clearly got the largest focus. That doesn't mean Rei does a lot on her own, but what she does is really great.

Going to stop myself now, before this becomes too long. Again. Sure love talking about Sailor Moon.

Sailor Stars does some stuff that makes it more fun/interesting in different ways from previous seasons. Big focus on school stuff that arguably should've always been a part of the series (both for allowing many opportunities for silly school shenanigans but also helping keep the series more grounded in the face of more and more ridiculous alien/superpowered stuff); gets rid of Mamoru in exchange for a vastly more fun, interesting, and less weird Seiya; puts the (minor) villains in a bit of a different light, making them both more sympathetic and silly than I think we saw in previous seasons (also Iron Mouse was great and Tin Nyanko was surprisingly good for the short amount of time she's around, though I might be biased because their English VAs are like literally just about perfect for their characters; Lead Crow and Aluminum Siren are...rougher around the edges, but they have their good points too, certainly better than e.g. my favorite metaphorical punching bag, Kaolinite); actually has a really good main story arc...in the first six episodes of the season, the finale not as much but also not any worse than anything in the other three seasons that aren't SuperS (heck, probably still better than the rest, I can't remember e.g. anything of R's ending at all off the top of my head, while I wish I couldn't remember anything from SuperS). It does have its weaker points as we've discussed, but at least it did some of the different things it did well.

10 hours ago, majestic said:

Are you going to start with the first movie, since you're already past the point where it was supposed to be watched?

I already have it, so I might as well, right?

10 hours ago, majestic said:

Oh, and, episode 5 of Love Live! was not that good.

So, where was I? Oh, right. Episode 5 was a bit of a letdown. Not bad, but the good bits weren't as good as the ones before, and the bad bits... ey, weren't as bad as before.

With the style of this show in mind and the fact that I most likely wouldn't last more than a minute or two of even the best episode of the entire series, I'm translating statements like these to mean "it was absolute garbage that would've lead to your immediate death if you had seen it", .

1 hour ago, majestic said:

Okay, Cardcaptor Sakura: Clear Card is officially dead.

Just had an episode without Tomoyo.

Yep, that'll do it: Clear Card has been cancelled.

4 hours ago, Lexx said:

^ that video above is exactly the kind of anime that made me not look at anime for years. Horrible stuff.

It really doesn't help that all of the most popular stuff which dominates popular/ongoing anime discussion is exactly this sort of thing...or worse, . If there are any animes that would appeal to me that have come out...especially post-2010, I'm never going to be able to find them thanks to the absolute deluge of garbage sucking up all the air in the room.

Edited June 27, 2021 by Bartimaeus

[majestic]

3 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

Sailor Stars does some stuff that makes it more fun/interesting in different ways from previous seasons. Big focus on school stuff that arguably should've always been a part of the series (both for allowing many opportunities for silly school shenanigans but also helping keep the series more grounded in the face of more and more ridiculous alien/superpowered stuff);

One of the great things in the season was the way they became friends with the Three Lights. Usagi bumping into Sailor Moon's Robbie Williams without her recognizing him was perfectly in character for Usagi and it makes sense for her to be interesting for Seiya. Taiki and Yaten are more exasperated by the girls than anything else, but slowly learn to appreciate them.

The school shenanigans really took a backseat in R outside of the filler arc and S (studying for high school entrance exams aside), and disappeared from SuperS entirely. To be fair to SuperS, which is sort of hard, there was no school stuff in Eternal, and there probably is none in the manga either. It begins with the scene from early Sailor Stars where Usagi is happy that everyone made it to highschool, most surprisingly herself. Maybe the entire arc takes place in the holidays.

It really did serve as a perfect counterbalance to the ridiculous scope of the threat in Sailor Stars. The earlier seasons were already bad, but Sailor Stars managed to up the ante even more.

Came with a lot less focus on ridiculous monsters and the loss of other things, like more Outer Senshi or maybe a bit more of the cats. Guess that wouldn't have been possible with the format, but Sailor Stars could have benefitted from an extra five minutes of runtime per episode.

3 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

gets rid of Mamoru in exchange for a vastly more fun, interesting, and less weird Seiya;

One of the best things that happened during the adaptation of the manga, but really also a side effect of the show almost cutting him out entirely after the first season. A bit more balance might have been nice, looking back. The manga and Crystal with it had way too much focus on Usagi and Mamoru, the anime had, at times, too little. We have "fated to be together", then "fake breakup" and then... nothing, until the end. Nothing except SuperS. Ugh.

Overall however, a pretty good decision. In Crystal I always got the feeling that Usagi and the others stand a bit apart. They're always doing things without her, and she's off with Mamoru. At the end of the first arc they're even fighting separately.

3 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

puts the (minor) villains in a bit of a different light, making them both more sympathetic and silly than I think we saw in previous seasons (also Iron Mouse was great and Tin Nyanko was surprisingly good for the short amount of time she's around, though I might be biased because their English VAs are like literally just about perfect for their characters; Lead Crow and Aluminum Siren are...rougher around the edges, but they have their good points too, certainly better than e.g. my favorite metaphorical punching bag, Kaolinite);

The biggest problem with Lead Crow and Aluminum Siren was the amount of screentime they got in the episodes where they showed up, before being blasted apart by Galaxia or sucked into a black hole. Iron Mouse had more episodes, and Tin Nyanko got to do more (like stalking the girls in disguise), but AS and LC got exactly that run of episodes where the writers just went "ah, screw that" and gave them like 30 seconds per episode.

I also liked the way they just all left whenever it became pointless to stick around, with the Sailor Guardians complaining about it. "I am Sailor Moon, and..." "Ok, baaai!" *TARDISES AWAY* but technically that's not entirely original either. Eudial/Eugeal did the same.

3 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

actually has a really good main story arc...in the first six episodes of the season, the finale not as much but also not any worse than anything in the other three seasons that aren't SuperS (heck, probably still better than the rest, I can't remember e.g. anything of R's ending at all off the top of my head, while I wish I couldn't remember anything from SuperS). it does have its weaker points as we've discussed, but at least it did some of the different things it did well.

How can you say that you forgot R's ending? Black Lady and DEATH PHANTOM were awesome. Even awesomer in Crystal.

Eh, yeah. DEATH PHANTOM was certainly the least interesting of the Sailor Moon villains, and that includes a cosmic horror being with no dialogue from the next season. However, and I'll say that for R, Saphir's death and Petz' reaction to it certainly ranks amongst the more emotional moments of Sailor Moon.

3 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

I already have it, so I might as well, right?

It really is better watched in between than at the end of the show, like I did. I didn't enjoy it as much as the anime proper or the second film, but coming back to the show from an extended break would be the ideal time to go for it, I guess.

3 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

With the style of this show in mind and the fact that I most likely wouldn't last more than a minute or two of even the best episode of the entire series, I'm translating statements like these to mean "it was absolute garbage that would've lead to your immediate death if you had seen it", .

There's something endearing about an Usagi style character trying to form an idol group, but that's pretty much the only thing this has going for it. It's enough to keep me watching without hating it, which is a plus what with having to finish it now that I've started, but I doubt it would be for anyone else in this thread.

Except maybe Hoonding. He'd probably make ten thousand memes out of it.

3 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

Yep, that'll do it: Clear Card has been cancelled.

Ah, and I was so looking forward to discussing it with you.

 

Edited June 27, 2021 by majestic

[majestic]

Love Live! School Idol Project, episode 6.

The student council is doing interviews to promote club activities, including the idol group. During the interview they kind of notice that Umi writes the lyrics, and Kotori comes up with the choreography, Maki writes the music... and Honoka, for some reason, in spite of contributing nothing of note to the group, is considered their leader.

They're then having a vote, with everyone more or less in favor of Umi, who doesn't want the job. The second choice, Kotori doesn't want it either. So they end up playing Karaoke to find a winner, with no clear result, then dance dance revolution on "apocalypse mode EXTRA" (okay, I'll admit, I laughed), then hand out flyers... yeah, with no real, clear winner either. Nico, the newest member, would like the job, but nobody wants to give it to her.

Honoka comes up with the idea to share the spotlight for the upcoming song, with everyone doing an equal part, and they end up doing that. Cue new music video. One that wouldn't be so bad if... they wouldn't have cat and bunny costumes and all that stuff, so, uhm.

Yeah.

Honoka sleeps in class, eats more than she should, likes sweets, is lazy, hates getting up early and is bad at school. She's maybe not the leader they would vote for, but they one they need. Hey. Why does this remind me of a much better anime for some reason?

So, actually, this was a fun, decent episode, with nary any overt fanservice. It's still there in the way the girls sometimes stand around (I'm sure they'll all get serious backpains eventually if they keep standing around like that), the close ups and the dancing, but no creepy boob grabbing and no more butt wiggling for the time being.

Spoiler

Begs the question, am I actually liking this? If so, then why?

Spoiler

 

 

[Bartimaeus]

1 hour ago, majestic said:

Begs the question, am I actually liking this? If so, then why?

Because you're forgiving when it doesn't concern that which you adore? 

Edited June 27, 2021 by Bartimaeus

[majestic]

10 minutes ago, Bartimaeus said:

Because you're forgiving when it doesn't concern that which you adore? 

That seems reasonable and has some basis in reality, so I'm going with aliens.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

AoT s4: Heel turn and a cliffhanger, the protagonist has completed his metamorphosis into an omega edgelord.