The All Things Political Thread (The World and US Reunited)

[ComradeYellow]

I was being serious...

A competitive Korea is best Korea!

[BruceVC]

54 minutes ago, ComradeMaster said:

I was being serious...

A competitive Korea is best Korea!

Oh....I see ...okay I assumed you were joking

Yes a working and functional NK would be much better for the region but its not possible just China is going to be able  fix the broken economy of NK. Because China already is the only reason NK hasn't  utterly collapsed as it always has provided various economic and financial lifelines 

So what you would need is regime change in NK or serious political changes, like NK no longer being a hermit dictatorship , to allow other countries to want to trade with NK ....but this going to take a long time so I wouldnt  hold my breath waiting ?

[midnite rule]

14 hours ago, Zoraptor said:

It was a bit more than bad blood, since Interahamwe were literally literally the remnant Hutu genocide gangs from 1994.

(Not Bruce, but the legal justification for the intervention was fine, under international law. You can 'invade' a neighbour if they're unable to prevent cross border raids against your country. It's certainly an oft abused position though, and the Rwandan intervention was not just about raids any more than for others who abuse that justification like the US and Turkey. OTOH, that specific war would almost certainly have happened in some form with or without Rwanda as the central Congolese state was and largely remains extremely weak with the country being an impoverished mish mash of ethnicities and local power blocs theoretically ruled over (up until recently) the decidedly non democratic Laurent Kabila)

 

6 hours ago, BruceVC said:

Yes I am very familiar with that conflict as I live in SA and I have worked in the DRC

Its not a well known conflict but one that cost many lives and the DRC still is a country that is unstable and its people suffer terribly but most of the interventions from African countries in the DRC are  about gaining resources. That war was no different, if you look at the countries that sent armies to "help " you will notice countries like Angola, Namibia and Zimbabwe got involved and they have no real tribal or ethic link to the DRC yet they somehow could send troops yet we dont see that type of commitment from Africa leadership in dealing with any other conflict on the continent. Like Somalia or current violence in northern Mozambique with that Al- Shabaab linked group 

The DRC should be the wealthiest country in  Africa and its people should have a great life but its vast resources have always made it a target for other countries to " intervene " and help yet its not about helping the people of the DRC 

That was my point.

Rwanda had legitimate grievance with the DRC, but the real reason they invaded was for the loot. Gold, cobalt and coltan; the stuff our electronic gizmos are made of, that which power the dialogue we’re currently engaged in.

And I don’t think the US is any more moral than Rwanda.

Sorry, but I don’t believe in American exceptionalism, I see no evidence America is acting very differently from any other empire in history.

 

Besides, how do we define a cross-border raid?

Trump (and his ilk) oft frame the Mexican border issue in warlike terms. Portraying every person coming from south of the Rio Grande as the vanguard of an MS-13 army. They point to crimes by undocumented Latinos as evidence. They’re not making up crimes, they’re just selectively highlighting those that fit their hyperbolic narrative.

(I’d wager the Rwandan narrative justifying the invasion also contained much hyperbole.)

Do you think the US should drone bomb Mexican drug Cartels?

[Guard Dog]

On 3/10/2021 at 7:51 AM, Darkpriest said:

@Guard Dog and how do you feel about topics like this?

https://www.zerohedge.com/economics/feds-most-convenient-lie-cpi-charade

I would not want to be the chairman of the Federal Reserve for all the money in the world. They have three tasks: moderate interest rates (the repo market especially, inter-banking system borrowing), stabilize bond prices, and (hopefully) maximize employment through crisis avoidance. Only one of those three are actually within their control. The last three Presidential admins and the current one have done nothing but deficient spend. The Obama admin had a real shot at turning it around with their austerity measures which, while meant as a political weapon at the time, did unintentional good  but was wiped out by runaway spending.  

You have probably heard me say this, because I've been saying it for years, I would not buy US bonds if they took dried dog poop for payment. The default is inevitable.  Most folks think the US Dollar will be ok long term because even with all this it is still the most stable currency and the world reserve currency. But in the era of blockchain and crypto's immunity to inflation that may not last. It probably won't. Nations are already using bitcoin for trade. 

As far as the Fed putting a happy (dishonestly so) face on it... wow... shocking. Not. 

It is worrisome because sooner or later the bill comes due. Inflation has been creeping up for a while. That worries me being so close to retirement and now with a minimal income. Inflation is a tax on savings. But... there is nothing anyone can do about it. Not even voting. Fiscally responsible candidates don't win elections. All we can do it:

1.  Manage debt: if you are in debt get out. If you're not, don't go in. 
2. Invest in things that have real value. Real estate, hard commodity, etc.  

[BruceVC]

57 minutes ago, midnite rule said:

 

That was my point.

 

Rwanda had legitimate grievance with the DRC, but the real reason they invaded was for the loot. Gold, cobalt and coltan; the stuff our electronic gizmos are made of, that which power the dialogue we’re currently engaged in.

 

And I don’t think the US is any more moral than Rwanda.

 

Sorry, but I don’t believe in American exceptionalism, I see no evidence America is acting very differently from any other empire in history.

 

 

 

Besides, how do we define a cross-border raid?

 

Trump (and his ilk) oft frame the Mexican border issue in warlike terms. Portraying every person coming from south of the Rio Grande as the vanguard of an MS-13 army. They point to crimes by undocumented Latinos as evidence. They’re not making up crimes, they’re just selectively highlighting those that fit their hyperbolic narrative.

 

(I’d wager the Rwandan narrative justifying the invasion also contained much hyperbole.)

 

Do you think the US should drone bomb Mexican drug Cartels?

 

You make some good points and I dont support the Trump bigotry around his generalizations he made of some Latinos but their are parts of Mexico almost under the control of the Cartels so in way its similar to  non-conflict zones in Western Pakistan where the  Taliban find sanctuary amongst certain tribes and I support drone attacks or necessary cross border raids ( that is how Bin Laden was killed ) in that area. So your question about bombing Mexican Cartels is interesting 

Yes I do think drones should be used for targeting Mexican Drug Cartels within the Mexican border but only with the agreement of the Mexican government because Mexico is an important trade and economic ally and its not like they have no control of the drug cartel regions so you need to include them in drone strikes 

And their must be accurate intelligence verified by military intelligence, I trust the US security forces to make the right decision most of the time 

[Gromnir]

Congresswoman who thought Guam not part of US will get island cookies

"I'm a regular, normal person. And I wanted to take my regular – normal person, normal, everyday American values, which is: We love our country. We believe our hard-earned tax dollars should just go for America – not for what, China, Russia, the Middle East, Guam – whatever, wherever," said Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene on Feb. 27 at the Conservative Political Action Conference, which headlined former President Donald Trump.

...

"Congresswoman Greene is a new member, and we will be paying a visit to her and delivering delicious Chamorro Chip Cookies as part of our ongoing outreach to new members to introduce them to our wonderful island of Guam," said Del. Michael San Nicolas. He also referred to using "cookie diplomacy" in Congress during his annual address to the Legislature last year. 

From the governor's office, director of communications Krystal Paco-San Agustin said: "We would be more than happy to send Representative Greene's office a copy of 'Destiny's Landfall: A History of Guam.' "

HA! Good Fun!

[Guard Dog]

2 hours ago, Gromnir said:

Congresswoman who thought Guam not part of US will get island cookies

"I'm a regular, normal person. And I wanted to take my regular – normal person, normal, everyday American values, which is: We love our country. We believe our hard-earned tax dollars should just go for America – not for what, China, Russia, the Middle East, Guam – whatever, wherever," said Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene on Feb. 27 at the Conservative Political Action Conference, which headlined former President Donald Trump.

...

"Congresswoman Greene is a new member, and we will be paying a visit to her and delivering delicious Chamorro Chip Cookies as part of our ongoing outreach to new members to introduce them to our wonderful island of Guam," said Del. Michael San Nicolas. He also referred to using "cookie diplomacy" in Congress during his annual address to the Legislature last year. 

From the governor's office, director of communications Krystal Paco-San Agustin said: "We would be more than happy to send Representative Greene's office a copy of 'Destiny's Landfall: A History of Guam.' "

HA! Good Fun!

Apparently there are a lot of folks in Georgia with misconceptions about Guam

 

Of course the best territory faux pas was Trump saying he would discuss something with the "president of Puerto Rico". I with I'd been a fly on the wall when he found out who that was. 

Edited March 12, 2021 by Guard Dog

[Amentep]

I promise you, there actually are people in Georgia who know something about Guam.

[ComradeYellow]

17 minutes ago, Amentep said:

I promise you, there actually are people in Georgia who know something about Guam.

Yes when they're not victims in psyops and pawns in the international arena Georgians tend to be a decent and intelligent people, was ranked 7th safest country in the world in 2017 in fact!

You are talking the country, right.

 

[BruceVC]

3 hours ago, Gromnir said:

Congresswoman who thought Guam not part of US will get island cookies

"I'm a regular, normal person. And I wanted to take my regular – normal person, normal, everyday American values, which is: We love our country. We believe our hard-earned tax dollars should just go for America – not for what, China, Russia, the Middle East, Guam – whatever, wherever," said Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene on Feb. 27 at the Conservative Political Action Conference, which headlined former President Donald Trump.

...

"Congresswoman Greene is a new member, and we will be paying a visit to her and delivering delicious Chamorro Chip Cookies as part of our ongoing outreach to new members to introduce them to our wonderful island of Guam," said Del. Michael San Nicolas. He also referred to using "cookie diplomacy" in Congress during his annual address to the Legislature last year. 

From the governor's office, director of communications Krystal Paco-San Agustin said: "We would be more than happy to send Representative Greene's office a copy of 'Destiny's Landfall: A History of Guam.' "

HA! Good Fun!

Gromnir you shouldn't be too hard on Americans who aren't that well informed on topics outside the USA....like geography ( even in this example Guam is considered "outside " )

Its more common than you may think and from my experience with meeting Americans its because the USA offers so much to its citizens their is less emphasis and interest on learning about things outside of the USA. So people tend to live in a  bubble but then I have met US citizens who travel regularly and are very well informed 

I have on several occasions during visits to the USA, yes it happened in Vegas , met people in bars and social environments and when I told them I am from South Africa they genuinely were surprised and asked " but you white, I didn't know their were white people living  in SA"  

[BruceVC]

1 hour ago, Amentep said:

I promise you, there actually are people in Georgia who know something about Guam.

I absolutely agree with this....but just for the record and in the interest of empirical evidence do you know anyone who currently lives in Georgia that knows about Guam? Because you said I promise you and that to me means " definitely " ????

[BruceVC]

1 hour ago, MellowYellow said:

Yes when they're not victims in psyops and pawns in the international arena Georgians tend to be a decent and intelligent people, was ranked 7th safest country in the world in 2017 in fact!

You are talking the country, right.

 

Comrade why have you changed your name ?

[Gromnir]

11 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

 

I have on several occasions during visits to the USA, yes it happened in Vegas , met people in bars and social environments and when I told them I am from South Africa they genuinely were surprised and asked " but you white, I didn't know their were white people living  in SA"  

chances are we would not have supported electing the vegas bar patrons bewildered by your whiteness to Congress.

...

'course am having no idea what is the correlation 'tween being a resident o' one o' the "safest" nations on earth and knowledge o' US pacific territories, so perhaps is Gromnir who got lost in translation with the current turn o' the thread.

HA! Good Fun!

 

[ComradeYellow]

5 minutes ago, Gromnir said:

'course am having no idea what is the correlation 'tween being a resident o' one o' the "safest" nations on earth and knowledge o' US pacific territories, so perhaps is Gromnir who got lost in translation with the current turn o' the thread.

Can't handle fun facts, Grookie?  Oh that's right you're a baby boomer who's dabbled in law, silly me.

Edited March 12, 2021 by MellowYellow

[BruceVC]

1 minute ago, Gromnir said:

chances are we would not have supported electing the vegas bar patrons bewildered by your whiteness to Congress.

.

 

You make me laugh with how you sometimes frame things 

But yes they werent people elected to Congress but  they were very interested in the quick history lesson I shared with them including the fact their are over 4 million white people living in SA so I always try to educate people if they want to hear and people are always receptive to these types of updates 

[Gromnir]

24 minutes ago, MellowYellow said:

Can't handle fun facts, Grookie?  Oh that's right you're a baby boomer who's dabbled in law, silly me.

as you can see, is not a fact. if you rank two dozen spots behind sierra leone, chances are you is doing something very wrong. georgians might be top ten in furry love for all we know, and that "fun fact" would be as incongruous. 'course as we know from your posting history, comrade is strongk with facts. 

*shrug* 

you tripped over your punchline and wanna blame Gromnir? knock yourself out.

@BruceVC

given your additional info, am thinking we would be more likely to vote for the bar patrons than most current members o' Congress. a willingness to be educated 'bout stuff they is ignorant is a quality in short supply in US legislators.

...

admitted, chances are we woulda' screwed up the educational opportunity. ask the bar goers if they know 'bout history o' sa apartheid… if not, jog their memory with the lethal weapon movie. (not going for depth) kinda baby step 'em to the recognition it woulda' been hard to pull off such a long history o' apartheid without at least a few white people, yes?

am sure bruce handled better. 

HA! Good Fun!

 

Edited March 12, 2021 by Gromnir

[BruceVC]

59 minutes ago, Gromnir said:

as you can see, is not a fact. if you rank two dozen spots behind sierra leone, chances are you is doing something very wrong. georgians might be top ten in furry love for all we know, and that "fun fact" would be as incongruous. 'course as we know from your posting history, comrade is strongk with facts. 

*shrug* 

you tripped over your punchline and wanna blame Gromnir? knock yourself out.

@BruceVC

given your additional info, am thinking we would be more likely to vote for the bar patrons than most current members o' Congress. a willingness to be educated 'bout stuff they is ignorant is a quality in short supply in US legislators.

...

admitted, chances are we woulda' screwed up the educational opportunity. ask the bar goers if they know 'bout history o' sa apartheid… if not, jog their memory with the lethal weapon movie. (not going for depth) kinda baby step 'em to the recognition it woulda' been hard to pull off such a long history o' apartheid without at least a few white people, yes?

am sure bruce handled better. 

HA! Good Fun!

 

I never ever assume people know anything about SA and its history ( its always nice when they do but its not expected ) and that sadly  includes people living within SA. We have some  citizens who have forgotten how Apartheid ended and more importantly they  have forgotten the role that Nelson Mandela and many others from that time period  played and worse than that they call him a " sell-out " and " traitor " but they havent bothered to understand the history of their own country and years between when Apartheid ended and our first real election in 1994. So these are citizens who basically have failed to study the history of SA from 1988-1994 and are happy to make public comments that are offensive, vacuous and happily demonstrate an utter lack of knowing their own history !!!

But interestingly enough when I meet people outside of SA, like Europeans or Americans, they generally do know the story of Nelson Mandela and respect him for what he did and the role he played in creating the foundation for the new SA in 1994

So for me its strange that non-SA citizens sometimes  know more about Nelson Mandela and SA history than some South Africans ?

 

[Amentep]

3 hours ago, MellowYellow said:

You are talking the country, right.

I wasn't talking about the former Sakartvelo, no...

1 hour ago, BruceVC said:

I absolutely agree with this....but just for the record and in the interest of empirical evidence do you know anyone who currently lives in Georgia that knows about Guam? Because you said I promise you and that to me means " definitely " ????

 I thought this was obvious...

 

[Gromnir]

we were in university and law school during the years you mention, so is not a shock apartheid were a big deal for the people we most often interacted. 

on the negative side, am thinking all too often sa apartheid were (still is) used by americans as a contrast. in the eyes o' too many, apartheid were real racism and a whole lotta americans felt better about themselves by condemning the evils o' apartheid while kinda ignoring the continuing systemic racism in this country.  am thinking many americans don't realize just how long overt discriminatory lending practices existed in the US (well into the 70s), and is not as if the resulting income disparity which such practices contributed to sudden evaporated. fix the income disparity issue in the US is hard and is less overt than apartheid, so many o' our fellow university students raged 'bout apartheid and felt a whole lot better 'bout ignoring the race problems here in the US. 

HA! Good Fun!

[BruceVC]

2 minutes ago, Amentep said:

I wasn't talking about the former Sakartvelo, no...

 I thought this was obvious...

 

I know, I am just teasing you 

Their are many, many Georgians who know about Guam. CNN is based in Atlanta for example and all the journalists on CNN are generally well informed and would know this fact 

[ComradeYellow]

24 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

all the journalists on CNN are generally well informed and would know this fact 

 !!!!!!

More like paid shills for corporate white trash evangelical empire.

 

[BruceVC]

15 minutes ago, MellowYellow said:

 !!!!!!

More like paid shills for corporate white trash evangelical empire.

 

What are you  talking about, yes I understand some of the criticism towards CNN but comments like this make me ask " do you actually watch CNN " ? And I am talking about CNN International which has journalists and shows with Chris Cuomo, Don Lemon, Anderson Cooper, Wolf Blitzer, Becky Anderson and Michael Holmes 

Because these journalists are basically liberal, Democrat supporters, " anti-Trump " and support BLM and dont focus on the violence and anarchy caused by ANTIFA. They often call out and criticize the Republicans and you could argue ignore certain problems with how the Democrats do things. 

So I have no idea how  you can say CNN supports "white, trash evangelical empires " .....in fact can you give me just one example of this? Just one Comrade ?

I dont always agree with the framing of certain issues on CNN but they do more things right and fairly than wrong which is why its the one international channel I tend to watch the most of alongside Al Jazeera, BBC and Sky 

Edited March 12, 2021 by BruceVC

[ComradeYellow]

3 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

So I have no idea how  you can say CNN supports "white, trash evangelical empires " .....in fact can you give me just one example of this? Just one Comrade ?

Whelp I guess it's wartime propaganda at play here, if you support aggressions against the East whilst completely ignoring the domestic issues and inequality at home (Which is expected because all politicians and media are owned by corporations), you're just as bad as the white trash evangelical Trump supporter in my book.

It's getting to that point where it's "All the same to me".

[BruceVC]

1 minute ago, MellowYellow said:

Whelp I guess it's wartime propaganda at play here, if you support aggressions against the East whilst completely ignoring the domestic issues and inequality at home (Which is expected because all politicians and media are owned by corporations), you're just as bad as the white trash evangelical Trump supporter in my book.

It's getting to that point where it's "All the same to me".

Its disappointing to me that a US citizen would honestly have a view that Trumpism and the views of prominent Democrats like Obama and Biden are exactly the same. Its egregious actually and I would assume no one who wants to engage in a real debate would ever say something so factually inaccurate 

Yes both groups have certain  issues with the hegemony of China but that is to be expected. So maybe just be honest and say  " I dont like CNN because they raise valid concerns with the way Chinese foreign policy is being implemented " 

But you dont need to play the race card when this is about Chinese political and global overreach ....its okay you can make that point without bringing " white people " into it. I promise you its a reasonable debate and we can have that discussion 

[Malcador]

13 hours ago, Gromnir said:

I'm a regular, normal person.

That's the sad part.