Theorycrafting Thoughts On New Classes (Patch 4.0 Beta)

[Sanctuary]

The only real downside of the Arcane Archer compared to a vanilla one is the ACC penalty with normal weapons. If you circumvent that: how can the Arcane Archer be worse than the vanilla one?

 

I think people still believe that subclasses have to be more powerful than the vanilla ones and are somehow disappointed if they are only slightly - or not obviously.

 

I don't know if this is supposed to be a direct response to me or just a general statement, because I never implied anything of the sort.  I've already played as a Berserker/Ranger and was going to wait until the Arcane Archer issues were patched to play one.  I was only asking if the problem was significant enough to not bother with them until after it gets fixed, that's all.  If the class is currently functioning worse than intended, then it is weaker than it's supposed to be.

 

And FWIW, I am a firm believer that subclasses should be stronger than the vanilla forms: for specific builds with very specific uses.  Otherwise, there's no point in having so many options if they are all the same for all builds in the end anyway, and min/maxing wouldn't even really be a thing.  But just generally stronger period?  Nah.

Edited January 3, 2019 by Sanctuary

[Marigoldran]

 

Hm, there are no new patch notes.

 

 

They stealthpatched herald out. ;-)

 

Noooooooooooooo.

[Boeroer]

 

The only real downside of the Arcane Archer compared to a vanilla one is the ACC penalty with normal weapons. If you circumvent that: how can the Arcane Archer be worse than the vanilla one?

 

I think people still believe that subclasses have to be more powerful than the vanilla ones and are somehow disappointed if they are only slightly - or not obviously.

I don't know if this is supposed to be a direct response to me or just a general statement, because I never implied anything of the sort. I've already played as a Berserker/Ranger and was going to wait until the Arcane Archer issues were patched to play one. I was only asking if the problem was significant enough to not bother with them until after it gets fixed, that's all. If the class is currently functioning worse than intended, then it is weaker than it's supposed to be.

 

And FWIW, I am a firm believer that subclasses should be stronger than the vanilla forms: for specific builds with very specific uses. Otherwise, there's no point in having so many options if they are all the same for all builds in the end anyway, and min/maxing wouldn't even really be a thing. But just generally stronger period? Nah.

Just a general statement since so many people complain that Arcane Archer is bad. Which it isn't.

[dunehunter]

Is Forbidden First + Garrote the strongest lvl 1 combo? You have two tier 3 affliction available on lvl 1. But the efficiency drop dramatically once level up and facing stronger enemies. As 1. enemies will have higher and higher fortitude defense, 2. forbidden fist get wounds slower than normal monk.

[TheWeaver]

You should rename the thread (in the support forum). "Question" might get overlooked by QA. Rename it to "[bUG <game version>] Arcana Archer: Imbue spells don't scale properly with Power Levels" or something like that.

 

Done -- sorry about that -- I tried earlier, but missed that you could do the rename in the full editor.  Also, it looks like Simon caught it in his latest pass -- so thanks much for the help.  Now here's hoping it gets fixed -- because I so want to play a single class AA.

[TheWeaver]

Is Forbidden First + Garrote the strongest lvl 1 combo? You have two tier 3 affliction available on lvl 1. But the efficiency drop dramatically once level up and facing stronger enemies. As 1. enemies will have higher and higher fortitude defense, 2. forbidden fist get wounds slower than normal monk.

 

Quite possibly.  It is still a combo I want to try once FF is fixed to not double apply the first curse (I think with some HoT items and stacking minus duration as discussed in the Darcozzi Purifier build it might be quite potent).  Add in Willbreaker and the modal and it might even work past the early levels.

[giftmefood]

Is Forbidden First + Garrote the strongest lvl 1 combo? You have two tier 3 affliction available on lvl 1. But the efficiency drop dramatically once level up and facing stronger enemies. As 1. enemies will have higher and higher fortitude defense, 2. forbidden fist get wounds slower than normal monk.

 

I played around with this and your assessment is correct. Really fun and easy early game but then yeah as enemy stats get bloated it gets quite hard. I'm talking about bosses and megabosses is where you'll struggle. You can use the console to test build ideas btw. It's so much quicker to do. 

Edited January 4, 2019 by giftmefood

[TheWeaver]

 

Is Forbidden First + Garrote the strongest lvl 1 combo? You have two tier 3 affliction available on lvl 1. But the efficiency drop dramatically once level up and facing stronger enemies. As 1. enemies will have higher and higher fortitude defense, 2. forbidden fist get wounds slower than normal monk.

 

I played around with this and your assessment is correct. Really fun and easy early game but then yeah as enemy stats get bloated it gets quite hard. I'm talking about bosses and megabosses is where you'll struggle. 

 

 

That's too bad because single target, boss lock down seems like exactly what this combo was meant to do.

[giftmefood]

 

 

Is Forbidden First + Garrote the strongest lvl 1 combo? You have two tier 3 affliction available on lvl 1. But the efficiency drop dramatically once level up and facing stronger enemies. As 1. enemies will have higher and higher fortitude defense, 2. forbidden fist get wounds slower than normal monk.

 

I played around with this and your assessment is correct. Really fun and easy early game but then yeah as enemy stats get bloated it gets quite hard. I'm talking about bosses and megabosses is where you'll struggle. 

 

 

That's too bad because single target, boss lock down seems like exactly what this combo was meant to do.

 

 

The problem with it is with bosses it's VERY hard to apply affliction on them thus rendering steel garotte passive useless.

 

Forbidden fist get's the helwalker problem late game, yes you do more damage than standard monk but the hit to survivability offsets it. So either you use FF and die faster or you don't use FF and run out of wounds. I feel like FF is really under-tuned right now but it's a fine line to balance. 

 

Also even if you have a tank and have FF just for damage, you'll be better off with Helwaker as you'll do more damage with Helwaker DPS than FF DPS. 

Edited January 4, 2019 by giftmefood

[Boeroer]

You can use the console to test build ideas btw. It's so much quicker to do.

I admit I had to giggle hysterically about this.

[Yonto]

Hello fellas.

 

It’s not that important since I’ll be playing on veteran, but I’m about to start a run with a debonaire/beguiller and I was wondering if anybody here had some input on that.

 

Some little suggestions that at a first glance would be difficult to think about. I just don’t want to facepalm myself in the future when I find out that there were some nice interactions between weapons or skills and I never noticed

 

I know debonaire it’s not great but I like the flavor of it.

 

Cheers

[Rimiu]

Hello fellas.

 

It’s not that important since I’ll be playing on veteran, but I’m about to start a run with a debonaire/beguiller and I was wondering if anybody here had some input on that.

 

Some little suggestions that at a first glance would be difficult to think about. I just don’t want to facepalm myself in the future when I find out that there were some nice interactions between weapons or skills and I never noticed

 

I know debonaire it’s not great but I like the flavor of it.

 

Cheers

 

I'm not sure what the sites and buildmaker reputation is and how good the build really is but fextralife covered that build recently.

[Yonto]

I'm not sure what the sites and buildmaker reputation is and how good the build really is but fextralife covered that build recently.

I already saw that video and it’s what got me convinced to try it, but it doesn’t show anything “special” per se.

 

Thanks anyway!