Best multiclass and best way to build a soulblade?

[Boeroer]

Yeah. I'm not sure if you can spam SA at all - because you need min 5 focus for the execution. Usually you will have 0 after SA. Or so I believe? Or was that changed lately? I actually never tried to spam it. I always did alternate.

 

Very understanding post by the way, thank you for that!

[Kaylon]

Yeah. I'm not sure if you can spam SA at all - because you need min 5 focus for the execution. Usually you will have 0 after SA. Or so I believe? Or was that changed lately? I actually never tried to spam it. I always did alternate.

Your focus is depleted only when you hit single targets. When you hit multiple targets the focus can replenish at the same time and it always worked like that.

Edited September 19, 2018 by Kaylon

[Haplok]

Hm, I think you're right. But that would also mean that it can't quite work in aoe  like we thought we figured it out some time ago. Base attack part of SA can't quite feed the SA on next target? Unless special rules apply for aoe? Eh, its complicated!

 

Edit: Maybe special aoe rules after all, as Kaylon wrote.

Edited September 19, 2018 by Haplok

[mant2si]

I think the best way to build single-target soul-blade is pick Sun & Moon and Small Monk shield and spam SA for every attack   But who cares ... there even exist post why this the most effective way to use SA and this post was written by guy who explain how SA works at ALL

There it is https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/104219-how-soul-annihilation%E2%80%99s-damage-is-actually-calculated, there no info about Sun & Moon, he wrote about this combination in another topic but the idea is pretty simple, SA is flat damage ability which scale with weapon bonuses and PL, more PL and Bonuses more flat damage per hit

In the game exist only single weapon with double hit, which guarantee you focus recovering and this is Sun & Moon

Edited September 19, 2018 by mant2si

[Haplok]

That's one way to do it of course. Allows SA every attack while keeping the deflection somewhat high, so tanky. But the damage output is not stellar with Sun & Moon from what I've seen.

[mant2si]

That's one way to do it of course. Allows SA every attack while keeping the deflection somewhat high, so tanky. But the damage output is not stellar with Sun & Moon from what I've seen.

The highest damage what you can get with SA spamming

Edited September 19, 2018 by mant2si

[Haplok]

If its a multiclass with other damaging abilities, then you'll do more damage by alternating, though. If not, then spam away.

[dunehunter]

I think the best way to build single-target soul-blade is pick Sun & Moon and Small Monk shield and spam SA for every attack   But who cares ... there even exist post why this the most effective way to use SA and this post was written by guy who explain how SA works at ALL

 

There it is https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/104219-how-soul-annihilation%E2%80%99s-damage-is-actually-calculated, there no info about Sun & Moon, he wrote about this combination in another topic but the idea is pretty simple, SA is flat damage ability which scale with weapon bonuses and PL, more PL and Bonuses more flat damage per hit

 

In the game exist only single weapon with double hit, which guarantee you focus recovering and this is Sun & Moon

 

Mind explain why Sun & Moon is the best weapon for SA? Does SA triggered twice with it?

[mant2si]

 

I think the best way to build single-target soul-blade is pick Sun & Moon and Small Monk shield and spam SA for every attack   But who cares ... there even exist post why this the most effective way to use SA and this post was written by guy who explain how SA works at ALL

 

There it is https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/104219-how-soul-annihilation%E2%80%99s-damage-is-actually-calculated, there no info about Sun & Moon, he wrote about this combination in another topic but the idea is pretty simple, SA is flat damage ability which scale with weapon bonuses and PL, more PL and Bonuses more flat damage per hit

 

In the game exist only single weapon with double hit, which guarantee you focus recovering and this is Sun & Moon

 

Mind explain why Sun & Moon is the best weapon for SA? Does SA triggered twice with it?

 

1. First hit trigger SA, second hit restore Focus

2. Damage calculation for single S&M hit for trickster = 2.6 * ((6 + 11)/ 2) * 1.35 = 30DM per HIT + 7DM Lash = 37DM per normal hit

3. Damage calculation for SA with 36 focus = (10+focus/4)*might bonus*PL = (10 + 9) * 2.6 * 1.35 ~= 66DM per SA hit after first Sun & Moon hit

4. Overall damage ~= 140DM per SA hit 

5. For 2 SA hits you will get 280 DM

6. With DW you has something like 1.2s for each hit with Sun & Moon 

 

------

 

So now you can calculate damage output for example for DW sabers legendary sabers

 

1. DW crippling strike - 2.35 * 14 * 1.35 * 2 ~= 88 + 16 (Cold lash) ~= 100DM

2. Single hit with SA with 100 focus ~= (10 + 25) * 2.6 * 1.35 ~= 120DM

3. For Crippling Strike + SA you will get ~= 100 + 120 + 50 = 270

4. With DW you has something like 1.9 recovery speed

Edited September 19, 2018 by mant2si

[mant2si]

Sorry I made an error in calculation average base damage for Sabres is 16 not 14 so you will get little more overall damage, so I think you can get something around 300DM per 2 hit for DW sabres

Now with DW nerf, your Crippling Strike will do on -30% less damage, than SA strike 

Edited September 19, 2018 by mant2si

[Haplok]

Sorry, I don't know what all these numbers mean.

 

I don't think I was getting 37 damage from 1 Sun & Moon hit. More like 20-something. But then again, this was at level 13, without Deathblows and with less Sneak damage.

 

What is included in those multipliers? 2.6/2.35? 1.35?

60% Legendary, 50% Sneak, 50% Deathblows? 35% Might bonus??

If so, the new dual wielding malus seems too small. And the regular damage portion of SA attack would be a little higher.

 

Still interesting.

Edited September 19, 2018 by Haplok

[mant2si]

Sorry, I don't know what all these numbers mean.

 

I don't think I was getting 37 damage from 1 Sun & Moon hit. More like 20-something. But then again, this was at level 13, without Deathblows.

 

What is included in those multipliers? 2.6/2.35? 1.35?

60% Legendary, 50% Sneak, 50% Deathblows? 35% Might bonus??

If so, the new dual wielding malus seems too small. And the regular damage portion of SA attack would be a little higher.

 

Still interesting.

SA - Strike

 

60% Legendary

35% Sneak attack

50% Death blows

15% Might

= 160% or 2.6 damage modifier

 

Crippling strike 0

 

60% Legendary

35% Sneak attack

50% Death blows

15% Might

+25% Damage

-55% DW

= 130% or 2.3 damage

 

1.35 - Multiplicative PL scaling for base damage - SA and CW get same damage bonus for regular portion of attack

 

16 - Sabre base damage

9.5 - Sun & Moon base damage

 

2 - DW

 

 

4s - Recovery after Crippling strike with Saber 

3s - Recover after SA strike with Sun & Moon

 

On additional, with Sun & Moon setup you will have 3 chance to apply any affliction from any rogue ability

Edited September 19, 2018 by mant2si

[Haplok]

Thank you for the complete explanation! Didn't think about 35% PL bonus. Wish the mechanics were more transparent.

 

Why only 35% Sneak for Trickster though? I think it'd be more like 50% at PL VII?

 

Edit: Wonder what would be the result with a light offhand for Crippling Strike spam. Then the attack speed would be the same. Only every second attack though, so it's closer but still not the same. Guess damage wise SA would have a slight edge. 

 

There is one issue with that calculation: it doesn't take into consideration enemy armor.  SA doesn't care about it, but the base attack portion does. So if you can't easily penetrate, then I think alternating can still be the better damage option.

Plus on wounded targets, Devastating Blow would certainly be the superior choice.

 

Finally... can SA crit? The raw part of it cannot, I think? If so, then crits could also allow Crippling Strike to pull ahead.

Edited September 19, 2018 by Haplok

[mant2si]

Thank you for the complete explanation! Didn't think about 35% PL bonus. Wish the mechanics were more transparent.

 

Why only 35% Sneak for Trickster though? I think it'd be more like 50% at PL VII?

I think it get only 35% on PL 7, but even additional 15% don't change a lot  

[mant2si]

Don't forget that with monk Shield and Rogue riposte you will have pretty good chance to riposte and S&M also give you +2.5% additional DPS from repeating attack

Edited September 19, 2018 by mant2si

[mant2si]

Thank you for the complete explanation! Didn't think about 35% PL bonus. Wish the mechanics were more transparent.

 

Why only 35% Sneak for Trickster though? I think it'd be more like 50% at PL VII?

 

Edit: Wonder what would be the result with a light offhand for Crippling Strike spam. Then the attack speed would be the same. Guess damage wise SA would have a slight edge.

 

There is one issue with that calculation: it doesn't take into consideration enemy armor.  SA doesn't care about it, but the base attack portion does. So if you can't easily penetrate, then I think alternating can still be the better damage option.

Plus on wounded targets, Devastating Blow would certainly be the superior choice.

 

Finally... can SA crit? The raw part of it cannot, I think? If so, then crits could also allow Crippling Strike to pull ahead.

I don't sure about this on 100%, but I assume that it raw part will take all damage bonuses - exclude overpenening, yes you right about penetration but at least Ukaizo and BoW dragon al all Golems can be easily penetrating, because this is Crush damage 

Edited September 19, 2018 by mant2si

[Boeroer]

 

Yeah. I'm not sure if you can spam SA at all - because you need min 5 focus for the execution. Usually you will have 0 after SA. Or so I believe? Or was that changed lately? I actually never tried to spam it. I always did alternate.

Your focus is depleted only when you hit single targets. When you hit multiple targets the focus can replenish at the same time and it always worked like that.

Ah, ok. I didn't even notice.

 

I don't know if SA+AoE always worked like that though. In backer beta SA + Spirit Lance didn't refill focus (and had different more "chaotic" AoE raw dmg mechanics than today). But there was no WotEP of course.

Edited September 19, 2018 by Boeroer

[mant2si]

 

 

Yeah. I'm not sure if you can spam SA at all - because you need min 5 focus for the execution. Usually you will have 0 after SA. Or so I believe? Or was that changed lately? I actually never tried to spam it. I always did alternate.

Your focus is depleted only when you hit single targets. When you hit multiple targets the focus can replenish at the same time and it always worked like that.

Ah, ok. I didn't even notice.

 

I don't know if SA+AoE always worked like that though. In backer beta SA + Spirit Lance didn't refill focus (and had different more "chaotic" AoE raw dmg mechanics than today). But there was no WotEP of course.

 

In previous game version WotEP don't refill focus on multiple targets, I'm sure on 100%