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Purudaya

So...No New Companions

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I love how people treat this as news even though they've been saying this all along.

Yeah, they were very upfront about not adding companions in the expansions.

Where? Everybody keeps saying how obvious it was, but I don't remember hearing this and feel like I've followed the game's development reasonably well.

Then you clearly remember the many times they mentioned how expensive and lengthy and complicated the companion implementation process is. Sure sounded like, “don’t get your hopes up” to me. Especially since they said it every time the topic came up

 

When Josh Sawyer said that the team was "very aware" of the Ydwin fanbase (I'm not really a Ydwin fan, but to each their own) when asked about future companion content, I think it was reasonable to assume that they were looking at giving at least that sidekick an upgrade.

*shrug*

 

Taken with the other comments being made (see above), I don’t see how that would be a reasonable assumption to make. “Upgrading” a companion was something they consistently said was expensive, time consuming, and expensive.

 

We now know he was just talking about tacking on a handful of non-interactive lines in BoW, but it definitely didn't sound like meatier content was off the table at the time.

 

smh. Ok.

"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

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I love how people treat this as news even though they've been saying this all along.

Yeah, they were very upfront about not adding companions in the expansions.

Where? Everybody keeps saying how obvious it was, but I don't remember hearing this and feel like I've followed the game's development reasonably well.

Then you clearly remember the many times they mentioned how expensive and lengthy and complicated the companion implementation process is. Sure sounded like, “don’t get your hopes up” to me. Especially since they said it every time the topic came up

 

When Josh Sawyer said that the team was "very aware" of the Ydwin fanbase (I'm not really a Ydwin fan, but to each their own) when asked about future companion content, I think it was reasonable to assume that they were looking at giving at least that sidekick an upgrade.

*shrug*

 

Taken with the other comments being made (see above), I don’t see how that would be a reasonable assumption to make. “Upgrading” a companion was something they consistently said was expensive, time consuming, and expensive.

 

We now know he was just talking about tacking on a handful of non-interactive lines in BoW, but it definitely didn't sound like meatier content was off the table at the time.

smh. Ok.

 

 

Yeah, there's really no need for the condescension. During the Twitch Q&A from four months ago that I was referencing, Josh Sawyer was directly asked if any sidekicks would be fleshed out into full companions in the upcoming DLCs. His answer at 31:03:

 

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/261766778?t=31m03s

 

Does that sound like "don't get your hopes up" to you? I'm terribly sorry that I am disappointed about something that you're not disappointed about, but no - when the director of the game himself hints that strongly that the developers are listening to a specific request for content, it's not unreasonable for players to hope to see that content make it into the game. What would be odd would be insisting repeatedly that this has been a hard "no" at every stage when Josh Sawyer is on tape not coming anywhere close to ruling out the possibility when specifically asked. 

 

 

Edited by Purudaya
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I love how people treat this as news even though they've been saying this all along.

Yeah, they were very upfront about not adding companions in the expansions.

Where? Everybody keeps saying how obvious it was, but I don't remember hearing this and feel like I've followed the game's development reasonably well.

Then you clearly remember the many times they mentioned how expensive and lengthy and complicated the companion implementation process is. Sure sounded like, “don’t get your hopes up” to me. Especially since they said it every time the topic came up

 

When Josh Sawyer said that the team was "very aware" of the Ydwin fanbase (I'm not really a Ydwin fan, but to each their own) when asked about future companion content, I think it was reasonable to assume that they were looking at giving at least that sidekick an upgrade.

*shrug*

 

Taken with the other comments being made (see above), I don’t see how that would be a reasonable assumption to make. “Upgrading” a companion was something they consistently said was expensive, time consuming, and expensive.

 

We now know he was just talking about tacking on a handful of non-interactive lines in BoW, but it definitely didn't sound like meatier content was off the table at the time.

smh. Ok.

 

 

Yeah, there's really no need for the condescension. During the Twitch Q&A from four months ago that I was referencing, Josh Sawyer was directly asked if any sidekicks would be fleshed out into full companions in the upcoming DLCs. His answer at 31:03:

 

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/261766778?t=31m03s

 

Does that sound like "don't get your hopes up" to you? I'm terribly sorry that I am disappointed about something that you're not disappointed about, but no - when the director of the game himself hints that strongly that the developers are listening to a specific request for content, it's not unreasonable for players to hope to see that content make it into the game. What would be odd would be insisting repeatedly that this has been a hard "no" at every stage when Josh Sawyer is on tape not coming anywhere close to ruling out the possibility when specifically asked. 

 

 

 

You did this once before and I replied with the full quote for context. 

 

Alll he says is that they are aware that this is what people want. That is literally *all* he says. It's the equivalent of a parent telling a child, "I heard you" after the 15 millionth request for a pony.

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"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

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You did this once before and I replied with the full quote for context. 

 

Alll he says is that they are aware that this is what people want. That is literally *all* he says. It's the equivalent of a parent telling a child, "I heard you" after the 15 millionth request for a pony.

 

I was very optimistic when I heard that they were aware that people wanted Ydwin as a companion, but as you say it was not a confirmation that they would upgrade her. Far from it.

 

Well, at least they included more content for her in the dlc. For me that's excellent since I don't really care if she is involved with the relationship system. I'll take what they can give us.

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I love how people treat this as news even though they've been saying this all along.

Yeah, they were very upfront about not adding companions in the expansions.

Where? Everybody keeps saying how obvious it was, but I don't remember hearing this and feel like I've followed the game's development reasonably well.

Then you clearly remember the many times they mentioned how expensive and lengthy and complicated the companion implementation process is. Sure sounded like, “don’t get your hopes up” to me. Especially since they said it every time the topic came up

 

When Josh Sawyer said that the team was "very aware" of the Ydwin fanbase (I'm not really a Ydwin fan, but to each their own) when asked about future companion content, I think it was reasonable to assume that they were looking at giving at least that sidekick an upgrade.

*shrug*

 

Taken with the other comments being made (see above), I don’t see how that would be a reasonable assumption to make. “Upgrading” a companion was something they consistently said was expensive, time consuming, and expensive.

 

We now know he was just talking about tacking on a handful of non-interactive lines in BoW, but it definitely didn't sound like meatier content was off the table at the time.

smh. Ok.

 

 

Yeah, there's really no need for the condescension. During the Twitch Q&A from four months ago that I was referencing, Josh Sawyer was directly asked if any sidekicks would be fleshed out into full companions in the upcoming DLCs. His answer at 31:03:

 

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/261766778?t=31m03s

 

Does that sound like "don't get your hopes up" to you? I'm terribly sorry that I am disappointed about something that you're not disappointed about, but no - when the director of the game himself hints that strongly that the developers are listening to a specific request for content, it's not unreasonable for players to hope to see that content make it into the game. What would be odd would be insisting repeatedly that this has been a hard "no" at every stage when Josh Sawyer is on tape not coming anywhere close to ruling out the possibility when specifically asked. 

 

 

 

You did this once before and I replied with the full quote for context. 

 

Alll he says is that they are aware that this is what people want. That is literally *all* he says. It's the equivalent of a parent telling a child, "I heard you" after the 15 millionth request for a pony.

 

 

Did what once before? Sorry if I took something out of context - your argument was that it was "not a reasonable assumption to make" in response to my view that Obsidian was "looking at least at giving that sidekick an upgrade." I posted the video to illustrate that the latter could easily be inferred from Sawyer's response to the question - not a confirmation, but a possibility. 

 

If "no additional companions" had been as firmly baked into the conversation from day one as you say, I imagine he would've simply reiterated that rather than leaving the possibility open. I'm not the only person in the subreddit where I sourced that link (or in these forums, for that matter) who drew the conclusion that a sidekick upgrade might yet be possible. 

 

---

 

For whatever reason, I didn't get the same impression of finality on this subject that you did. Maybe we didn't see all of the same developer comments, maybe I didn't follow the Fig campaign as closely as you did, maybe I interpreted "companion content is costly and time consuming" as tamping down expectations for the amount of potential content rather than precluding it altogether, or maybe I watched that video and thought - because of fan demand - that some of the developer's calculations on the matter might have changed. Is that really so unreasonable? Is it even worth arguing about?

Edited by Purudaya
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It could only be easily inferred if one ignored everything else the studio was saying on the subject.

 

Which is just another way of phrasing dog_days' vastly superior post above.


"Art and song are creations but so are weapons and lies"

"Our worst enemies are inventions of the mind. Pleasure. Fear. When we see them for what they are, we become unstoppable."

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There is a wiki page related to a possible companion Ryona who is a spirit paladin, anyone know if this will be a new sidekick in DLC2?

No way to know for sure until the release of DLC2.  While references and assets relating to Ryona started appearing around the 2.1 beta, there hasn't been anything definitive to specifically tie her introduction to the next expansion.

 

Data-mining can be quite hit-or-miss.  It's sometimes difficult to determine if we're unearthing secrets, or digging through piles of discarded trash.

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Less is more... 10+ companions leads to two dimensional character development displayed through a simple logic tree and some voice-over files.

 

A better product would emerge if they just worked on 4-5 companions, with the understanding the players might only relate to 1 or 2. If you are going with a companion system, you need to develop characters with depth, goals, aspirations, fears, foibles, etc.

 

As for the storyline... less time should be spent with micro-games (ship combat) and more resources on a compelling story that creates true motivation or evokes some level of emotion. POE2 had a thin story (with zero sense of urgency or import) and mediocre characters... the story might be harder to nail, but limiting the number of companions would probably have produced a better overall product.

 

By the way, random ideas as I pour a cup of coffee:

1) compulsive liar companion: you never really know the truth and every time a big event happens they relate to it, but is most likely all a lie... for example, you just defeated a shadow drake and the companion says, “as a child, my village in the living lands was terrorized by a massive drake, summoned by a vile chanter. My father was part of the town militia and they were summoned to confront the vile chanter. After a fierce battle they defeated the drake and thought they had won, until the chanter summoned another drake and destroyed the remaining militia. We grew up as a slaves to this chanter and eventually I ran away on my 14th name day. No need to tell you the challenges of being a female runaway, but it made me who I am. i am starting to trust you, but if you bring a chanter into this party you will need to make a decision... me or them.” This could be a huge lie, some truth, etc., but depending on your interactions and choices either the truth begins to emerge or more lies keep the character shrouded in mystery.

 

2) protege companion: A companion that wants to be you... you saved them or did something fairly remarkable to make a lasting impression. Either you allow them to continue to fawn over you and eventually take them on as an apprentice (multi class with one class being the same as main character) or you turn them away, causing possible friction and lots of snide remarks.

 

3) someone better than you companion: older veteran, possibly the original watcher, that happens to have slid down a dark path (drinking, harlots, etc.) because of a massive tragedy (lost his original companions, accidentally caused a village to be enslaved by a vile chanter, etc.) and you convince him or her they have chance at redemption or at least not dying of boredom. Now this is really unique since you have a really powerful character that has no interest in being a leader, but this companion will also have no hesitation pointing out (with sarcasm) a bad decision or a self-serving action...

 

Back to coffee...

Edited by heldred
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I was excited when Vatnir was announced, but when I finally got to pick him up I was underwhelmed. Having to wait so late to get him compared to the others sucks. Plus he's just... not that well written. I'd rather they beefed up the existing sidekicks than added new sidekicks/companions. I'm not much of a Ydwin fan, but I would throw a vote towards more Rekke interactions.

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