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Holy Slayer vs Swashbuckler vs Mindstriker


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13 replies to this topic

#1
Pharaun159

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Thinking of adding a new rogue to replace eder. I want the rogue to off tank and do damage, so streetfighter probably be a good subclass. I havent messed with rogues hardly at all but im loving confounding blind. Im torn between a pirate dual weilding sabers or saber and hatchet vs a brawler with a rwohander and falcon helm. Any tips?

Oh yeah this is potd diff.

#2
Verde

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If you're looking for damage and tanking you can't go wrong with a Trickster/Soulblade. By the latter stages you can easily accumulate a couple hundred Focus and then unleash it with Soul Annihilation.

Edited by Verde, 11 August 2018 - 08:28 AM.


#3
1TTFFSSE

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Streetfighter/Devoted (should have been Eder) is really strong and tanky dd - war hammer is a good choice because of The last Word+Glacierbane

 

Streetfighter/Paladin is similar just a different "flavour" - Paladin has somewhat more team utility but in the end a bit less dps than devoted.

 

Mindstalker streetfighters are best built for ranged they are much more squishy compared to the above two. 



#4
Pharaun159

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I should mess with making a mod that chamges eder to streetfighter devoted

#5
Teclis23

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You will find the game a lot harder not having 2 dedicated tanks on POTD . You will probably find you will be spending a lot of time and resources just keeping the off tank alive.

Still very doable but not the optimal way to play.

Rogues are far better at ranged in deadfire then melee anyway. You can apply there afflictions in a AOE with the right weapons.

Edited by Teclis23, 11 August 2018 - 09:08 AM.


#6
Pharaun159

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Totally found a mid that changes eder to devoted streetfighter.. Woot!

#7
colma86

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I'm about 80% done with a full Magran's Fires run with a solo holy slayer (bleak walker/trickster). There's not an enemy or situation in the game that a holy slayer can't give a middle finger to and annihilate. All 3 you mention are strong, but holy slayer is on a different level.

 

oh and unity console mod can change eder or anyone to whatever class, even watershaper or gunhawk if you want.



#8
thundercleese

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You will find the game a lot harder not having 2 dedicated tanks on POTD . You will probably find you will be spending a lot of time and resources just keeping the off tank alive.

Still very doable but not the optimal way to play.

Rogues are far better at ranged in deadfire then melee anyway. You can apply there afflictions in a AOE with the right weapons.

Melee DPS survivability is only really an issue in the early game. Later on as long as you know what you're doing and make sure the tank takes all the initial attention of the mobs you shouldn't have a problem.

 

And while Rogues do make excellent ranged damage dealers, they are still very strong in melee.



#9
Malkoy

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Try Holy Slayer: Goldpact/Streetfighter with Hand Mortar(good) or Fire in the Hole(better) One-Handed(big damage), Weapon and shield(for when/if your main tank dies). Blunderbuss modal gives you flanked 100% up-time (doesn't stack with perception inspirations).

 

Trickster with Riposte and Great Sword Devoted with WotP is a lot of fun too: 

- less damage than mortar: almost everything in this game is less damage that streetfighter+mortars

- able to engage more with stances

- incredible survivability with Trickster (one of the best defenses in game for this combo)

- more active than your average tank - fun factor

- Probably hardest thing to kill in the game that actually does some decent damage


Edited by Malkoy, 12 August 2018 - 02:47 AM.


#10
brasilgringo

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Try Holy Slayer: Goldpact/Streetfighter with Hand Mortar(good) or Fire in the Hole(better) One-Handed(big damage), Weapon and shield(for when/if your main tank dies). Blunderbuss modal gives you flanked 100% up-time (doesn't stack with perception inspirations).

 

Trickster with Riposte and Great Sword Devoted with WotP is a lot of fun too: 

- less damage than mortar: almost everything in this game is less damage that streetfighter+mortars

- able to engage more with stances

- incredible survivability with Trickster (one of the best defenses in game for this combo)

- more active than your average tank - fun factor

- Probably hardest thing to kill in the game that actually does some decent damage

 

What stats / race would you go with?  Dwarf for Might etc. ?

 

I cannot seem to facetank the Fampyyr Cave on PoTD with an Unbroken/Trickster stacking around 168 deflection that seems to get knocked down lower by the fampyrs.  I had him using Cap Banquet to not get charmed, and I was chugging Ironskin and Mod Heal and Merciless Gaze potions.  He could hold his own for a while (with second wind / heal pots) but they just wore him down* (note didn't take Unbending Trunk).

  Is your Goldpact/Streetfighter going to do better?

 

I've been reading all the tank threads and can't seem to find a build that I like an can test that can facetank the Fampyrs in the cave, in the woods (Sanguine Great Sword), or Splintered Reef.  Even stacking engagement - spear modal, blackened helm, Unbroken, Fighter +1 talent, Large Shield, Guardian Stance - mobs are still breaking thru and going for Aloth when he starts casting.

 

I'd really like to understand how to build a tank for PoTD that can do his job and/or solo (at a reasonable pace, eg not Sir Sit A Lot).  Is it all just cheese with potions/scrolls to do the PoTD solos that involve Fampyrs (or even things like Nemnok)?



#11
brasilgringo

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To edit into my above post, here's a standard look at my Deflectino:

22 Swashbuckler (at 20lvl)

+57 level

+15 resolve

+8 Inviolate (entonia sig ring)

+20 refreshing defense

+12 Apex Ward

+8 legendary Apex Ward

+6 weapon/shield style

+7 greater cloak deflection

+4 superior deflection (fighter talent)

+10 llengrath's displaced image (sometimes I'll cast mirror image but it gets dispelled easier)

= 169 total Deflection

Sometimes the fampyr's seem to bat that down to 162 or lower

If i get flanked, it goes down to 159 or lower (see pic)

 

And they are hitting me at these levels.



#12
Malkoy

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Try Holy Slayer: Goldpact/Streetfighter with Hand Mortar(good) or Fire in the Hole(better) One-Handed(big damage), Weapon and shield(for when/if your main tank dies). Blunderbuss modal gives you flanked 100% up-time (doesn't stack with perception inspirations).

 

Trickster with Riposte and Great Sword Devoted with WotP is a lot of fun too: 

- less damage than mortar: almost everything in this game is less damage that streetfighter+mortars

- able to engage more with stances

- incredible survivability with Trickster (one of the best defenses in game for this combo)

- more active than your average tank - fun factor

- Probably hardest thing to kill in the game that actually does some decent damage

 

What stats / race would you go with?  Dwarf for Might etc. ?

 

I cannot seem to facetank the Fampyyr Cave on PoTD with an Unbroken/Trickster stacking around 168 deflection that seems to get knocked down lower by the fampyrs.  I had him using Cap Banquet to not get charmed, and I was chugging Ironskin and Mod Heal and Merciless Gaze potions.  He could hold his own for a while (with second wind / heal pots) but they just wore him down* (note didn't take Unbending Trunk).

  Is your Goldpact/Streetfighter going to do better?

 

I've been reading all the tank threads and can't seem to find a build that I like an can test that can facetank the Fampyrs in the cave, in the woods (Sanguine Great Sword), or Splintered Reef.  Even stacking engagement - spear modal, blackened helm, Unbroken, Fighter +1 talent, Large Shield, Guardian Stance - mobs are still breaking thru and going for Aloth when he starts casting.

 

I'd really like to understand how to build a tank for PoTD that can do his job and/or solo (at a reasonable pace, eg not Sir Sit A Lot).  Is it all just cheese with potions/scrolls to do the PoTD solos that involve Fampyrs (or even things like Nemnok)?

 

I had problems in that cave. These fampyrs seem to be overturned compared to other content a bit. I would go as far to say that Fampyr cave is top 5 hardest encounters in the base game. Cap Banquet is a must. They also cast nasty damage AoE on the ground that you want to avoid and their "priests" are both high in damage and hard to kill. This is ability intensive encounter, deflection wouldn't solve everything for you there, since you have Fort/Reflex (maybe some Will?) targeted abilities used by Fampyrs.

 

It took a bit of grinding and nice RNG to get though that fight. Would not venture there on triple crown :p

 

Nemnok I have had little trouble with solo, you can choke point hold, split and leash enemy clusters in the room. Didn't find Nemnok really challenging when he's alone. Queen and Guardian fights are tougher imho because you have to face everything at once and can't cheese it like Nemnok(I heard there is a sweet spot for chanter on guardian fight, but never had to use it).

 

Priority targets are important on solo in general. That would largely depend on your class.

If you feel comfy with 15 armor most of the time, Arquebus kith and rogues will hurt more than the rest of the pack for example.

 

If you have high deflection and didn't invest into +10 passives for other defenses, spells and abilities will hurt. A lot. I know I suffered a ton on some fights with my riposte 2H Holy Slayer, since I had dropped dex to 8 and left per at 10, resulting in a low reflex defense, and no shield buff/modal to compensate. Entonia Signet doesn't work for me (no bonuses, when I look at deflection checks in the log). I'd use ring of minor protection, cloak of greater protection, and a ring of your choice and have all +10 defenses from passives to survive.

 

Mirrored image seems to be superior to me for deflection bonus, I don't use use Llengrath's for deflection or hit to graze, I use it for reflex heavy fights.

 

Flanking is painful for damage and defense, best advise: don't get flanked. Sometimes you can't help it, but you can get enemies in a choke or corner in a manner you won't get flanked. I usually corner hug ship fights for this reason, since my crew melts on 3rd sea bounties and way too many attacks go my way.

 

I don't know how Goldpact/Streetfighter will fare on solo too be honest (it will revolve around DoTs probably (Gouguing Strike, Wither upgrade) and burning down ranged attackers while running around for Arterial strike procs)

 

I would take Goldpact/Trickster version of The Faceless Dancer for solo any day though.

 

As for race, Wild Orlans are superior tanks due to Perception/Resolve focus. Accuracy and Deflection/Will are way too valuable for me. Passive is just a side treat.

 

But then again, solo play would be past the scope of this thread.


Edited by Malkoy, 12 August 2018 - 06:43 PM.


#13
Lampros

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Streetfighter/Devoted (should have been Eder) is really strong and tanky dd - war hammer is a good choice because of The last Word+Glacierbane

 

Streetfighter/Paladin is similar just a different "flavour" - Paladin has somewhat more team utility but in the end a bit less dps than devoted.

 

Mindstalker streetfighters are best built for ranged they are much more squishy compared to the above two. 

 

Is Warhammer still viable for DPS builds? The base damage is so low relative to other 1H weapons for DPS , and the advantage of two weapon damage types did not come into play as much as I expected in testing. Someone also mentioned that the Last Word can shut down boss casters from casting at all in old threads, but it looks like the silence duration on that weapon has been halved?



#14
Verde

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Why not Eder as a Swashy? No Eder makes me sad :(




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