Loranc

Chris said this quite a long time ago. Makes me even more excited for PE seeing as they have a very long time to develop the story for this game. I'm really looking forward to Sawyer's works. didnt you just say you didnt like him lol No! I said that down there. Gotcha, no worries. I just found it funny I'm actually glad you asked because I don't want people thinking I hate or don't like him for certain. I'm just not quite sure how I feel about him at this current moment. I figure a few months and a few updates into the game and i'll probably fall in love with him. In a non sexual bromance kind of way.

I think Adam nipped himself in the butt, he was playing IWD2 and everyone was haggling about a new stretch goal so he finally commented Cats at 4 million and that was all it took. So now that we hit that goal.. he's pretty much obligated to do something with cats .

Ahh I see, if only every discussion could remain that way. I for one try to never 'name' call, but I can't say for certainty that it doesn't happen. People have strong opinions and some of them 'really really' want romance to the level of willing to kill for it. I just would like it because I enjoy it and on a level of PS:T would be fine with me. The fact that people are this passionate about the game is a good thing though. Everyone wants their say in how the game should be, and I can't really argue with that point of view, everyone deserves a say, but the name calling and rudeness isn't necessary.

I wouldn't call BG2 romances well done but I could live with maybe one romance like in PS:T . And for all those who brings up Alpha Protocol, it's basicly pastiche/homage/spoof on spy-genre and especially James Bond, and imo doesn't compare to the fantasy RPG. It's funny how people probably assumed we didn't agree with our discussion but in the end you living with one romance like PS:T puts us in 100% agreement, and basically that's all I'm asking for as well. I really should learn to sleep better but ever since switching to these 12 hour shifts, it's just killer on my sleeping habits. I didn't like Alpha Protocol one bit... I tried to like it I really did. So I have no idea how the romances/bromances were incorporated into that game.

Yes, it really kind of is. Especially when I see the factually incorrect comments made to support a 'not in MY game' argument or the flat out 'imma insult you in as many "creative" ways as I can including personally demeaning you with name calling' posts. It's really very depressing and not understanding of how in-depth stories with fully fleshed out characters interact with each other in short and long books of almost every single genre. Not sure what's worse people commenting 'not in my game' or people commenting about people commenting 'not in my game'. If you can't add anything to the discussion why even bother to join it? It feels more like trolling than adding to a conversation about romance and friendship. Do you have any in depth thoughts on the matter? You're going to get the 'not in my game' attitude a lot because these threads are basically asking people's opinions. What else is an opinion than something you do and don't like. So to state the obvious... what did you expect coming into this thread?

Chris said this quite a long time ago. Makes me even more excited for PE seeing as they have a very long time to develop the story for this game. I'm really looking forward to Sawyer's works. didnt you just say you didnt like him lol No! I said that down there.

Me too!

I disagree, I actually think your current life dictates what you do/don't like in any game setting. I think the comparison is quite easily there if not sometimes subtle. And an rpg is really everything, drama, action, thriller, horror, I mean by it's very definition it is 'everything'. Purpose (taken from wiki) I for one prefer the full blown vision, but as I said it's all personal preference.

Because Sawyer agrees as do I with this. Sawyer pretty much stated that he won't add romance unless it's done exceptionally well. So basically... What are you even saying? Romances should take foreseat ahead of "Brothers in Arms"-type of thing because Sawyer says that romances shouldn't be done unless they can be done well? What that has to do anything with Romances vs. Brothers in Arms? I ask again: Why should romances take foreseat ahead of the "Brothers in Arms"-relationships if both can be done well? What makes romanes so goddamn much more important than anything else? Your main point was why should it happen since it's never done well. And my answer was if romance is added it's going to be done exceptionally well. Basically from what I understand is that you're only against it because it's not done well, so I answered your question by saying that it will be done 'exceptionally' well. Guess I was lazy in not going about explaining more, I'm kind of tired working 24 hours the last 2 days and getting about 4 hours of sleep. Brother in arms is perfectly fine in of itself but I don't understand how romance would push your 'brother in arms' out of the way. I don't think anyone here is saying that they would prefer romance over a camaraderie. In fact most people want both, Not sure why you should have to sacrifice one for the other, if Sawyer adds romance to the game he's not going to cut 'friendship' or 'camaraderie' so to speak. I'm assuming you're suggesting that the camaraderie should be enough for people and that romance isn't needed, asking what makes it so much more important to people. That's a hard one to answer because it's different for each person, for me personally as I've stated several times before want romance to be in the game in the way it was in PST and BG2. It doesn't need to have VO or cut scenes, but romance does have a deeper impact on me than a camaraderie. It's all personal preference and to answer your question specifically would never work as you just stated brother in arms during war times... it's all based on real life experience, interests, hobby's, etc etc. What makes a person like one thing more than another, I have no idea...

This is what I picture as bromance... (kind of silly imo)

More like 'missing out remorse' I would have loved the $350 package but I completely missed the boat on it. The cpu in that apu is better than mine (not by much) but enough to warrant getting it by backing Project Eternity.

Because Sawyer agrees as do I with this. Sawyer pretty much stated that he won't add romance unless it's done exceptionally well. So basically...

Chris said this quite a long time ago. Makes me even more excited for PE seeing as they have a very long time to develop the story for this game. I'm really looking forward to Sawyer's works.

Hmmm..... now i'm drifting to other parts of youtube and loving it.

How much time do you think it took Bioware to create 10 spaceship models (which by the way are the main ship models just shrinked) the to include in the capitan's cabin? Those things don't take away time from the developers. If you were really concerned about such problems you should have complained about the whole Kickstarter prize system. Do you know how much time will take to collect all the NPC data sent by the backers and cram it into the game in a passable lore-friendly manner? If you want the developers to focus on player agency and player freedom you shouldn't complain about romance stories, because they give more freedom and more agency to the player. You should go in the gameplay forum and start asking to shut down some of the 11 classes and to avoid taking too much time into the combat system development. That's one thing that takes away a lot of time and resources, not some well written romance story. How much time did it take them to record all the VO work to take into account the various romance permutations in DA:O or ME? Your strawman argument won't wash here. They didn't just make the spaceships or the fish, they made cutscenes, voiced interactions etc. all which really served no real purpose but actually; in light of the supposed desperate plight of the galaxy or world facing imminent destruction from Reapers or Darkspawn; made it ridiculous with Shepard or the Grey Warden spending more time trying to get their leg over than dealing with an imminent threat to the world. THIS is why I despise the focus on romance in RPG games. I've already said that it's ok in moderation, as some minor interlude or if it's DIRECTLY relevant to the progress of the plot, but otherwise, why waste time on it? I wonder how much the heavy breathing and deep sighs cost for VO for every single sex cut scene...... I don't think the cut scenes were every really necessary it felt like they were trying to streamline video games into being more JRPG than CRPG.

Yes yes, let the dark side flow through you. 6 trillion flies cannot be wrong, manure is excellent sustenance. No point arguing about details or specifics, if lots of people like something, it must be good! I wonder why Justin Bieber isn't singing opera? He must be an excellent singer, all that critical acclaim, sold-out venues and millions of fans. But romance in BG2 did lead to sex. Every Bioware romance leads to sex - from BG2 to ME3 and all the games between. And make no mistake, the Biodrone-brigade here is not asking for MCA-style "romance", they are asking for more Bioware-style "romance". Say no to that crap already, don't apologize to them. That's why i'm pushing hard for the PST style of romance and what Sawyer said in my above post. Keep in mind that in BG2 the better romance options for Aerie and the Dark Elf were to not sleep with them. But as far as ME and DAO are concerned I really enjoyed those games, they had lore, story, Un forgettable characters, party banter, it was all amazing, cept for how romance was handled. I've never played a game with more enjoyable party banter than DAO just listen.

It's hard choice, but I tend to agree here with Patrick - but it's really 'close call'. The more choices we have in the game - the better. Romance - is a type of choice, basically. But it should be done well, as other things in the game. It's kind of funny but Sawyer pretty much stated what I stated in this thread. Sick of the black screen fade outs, the unnecessary sex (I think you could have a three way in DAO with Isabella and zevran. Did anyone find that necessary?) Not even sure why that was in the game...... or you could turn Leliana evil, keep her on as a mistress and get married still. (Did they honestly think this somehow added to the game?) And I love his final statement though i'm still going to nitpick it.. he tossed out harem anime which would be one guy and a bunch of girls that was to be with him or one girl and a bunch of guys that want to be with her. Not sure... what games Sawyer has written for but in all the crpgs I've played I've never ran into Harem Anime in my rpg. So i'm not sure what he's referring to here. I'll re-state what I wrote before: I want romance to receive either less or more attention in games. Anything worth doing is worth doing well, especially when it's something with so much emotional potential. But I certainly don't want to go the route of harem anime, which is total fantasy indulgence and gross pandering.

Just a tip; your arguments and opinions will probably be better received if you at least attempt to explain and justify them rather than just stating them and telling people to accept them. Well that's my OPINION and there's no need to explain or justify it but I've had a dozen years or putting up with flaccid dating and hiking simulators and when we finally have a tiny hope that things can change, the Bioware brigade descends to try and hijack another game with the hope of turning it another of the conveyor belt forgettable products that they are enamoured with. They tried it with Wasteland 2, but Brian isn't exactly in the mood to take such things, so they now moved here thinking that Obsidian is more 'mainstream' and thus more succeptible to such pressure. These people would like nothing more than making every RPG's most crucial decision be deciding whether to shag the officer with a hot ass but cold exterior or the homely, awkward girl with freckles. That's my explanation my friend: once you start on that road the last decade has shown that it can end in only one way. The focus and effort of the game changes and trivial things like romances(and house decorating)suddenly get pushed to the forefront and take away from other aspects. ME is the most extreme example as the actual 'save the galaxy' plot was overtaken very early on by the whole crew romance thing and the need to decorate your cabin with fish and toy spacecraft. Umm.... what? Bioware had hiking simulators and dating simulators? ..... Where? Not to mention DAO and ME are still two of the most critically acclaimed rpgs, people still boast, talk, and play these games (include NWN 2 in that.) So not sure.. that they're really forgettable, though I do agree that the 'sex' cut scenes were unnecessary. And somehow... romance now =sex again... of course. It seems another person has been claimed with the idea that Romance must = sex must = cut scene must = major part of the game syndrome. There is a doctor somewhere... here for you, with a nice shot of wake up! You need to unlearn all you have learned and look back at the romance in Planescape Torment, BG2, and stop focusing all your hatred on what Publishers did to the gaming community. Obsidian is not publishing this game they are developing it, we the backers are publishing it... sort of. We payed for it anyways, that's the point.

Oh gawd the first time i heard that word Furrie I was like wth is that? Then someone explained to me about the massive furrie LARP sex parties......and just no... just no.

br(romances) has nothing to do with a dating simulator or a LARP sim. So not sure what your argument or point even is. Not to mention that an RPG is basically a real life simulation of a story, basically you are playing a story that someone is telling you, the more real the better. Are you saying that romance is fake? Anyways.. it all depends on preference, but your statement is full of flaws and illogical statements . You are comparing this.. to this... And we're not talking apples and oranges here...

For some reason listening to this reminded me of Celtic music and now i'm listening to Celtic/Folk music again. Man I love this song..... the music is so beautiful, I would love to hear some Celtic/Folk music in PE. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yJEpuT-SSE

BG2 is whole different level (of clichés) from PS:T. Torment "romances" which were almost not there were fine, BG2's were dreadful cliché ridden experience. The only thing in their favour was that you could easily skip them, because their role in overall narrative was exactly zero and the game never tried to push you in their direction anyway (DA2 I am looking at you). Exactly my point, but of course they could fix the dreadful cliche ridden experience part, but keep that second part "because their role in overall narrative was exactly zero and the game never tried to push you in their direction anyway. "

I agree with this 110%!!!

Not sure I like Chris that much, no offense. It was originally quoted that he'd play at 3.6 than it was changed to 4.0. He also stated on Ustream that it would not be a full play-through which I don't care about. I think one of my biggest worries with this guy is if he doesn't want something there's a 99% chance it won't be in the game. Now the rest of the team I love, but i'm a little iffy on that Chris guy.

....... I just want them to keep it on the same level as PST and BG2. It was simple, fun, enjoyable, and was in no way a part of the main story. (It just added to the individual players game experience.)