brindle88

After patch 2.00 with perception increasing accuracy, IMO you are better of concentrating on weapons that afflict afflictions on crits. Eg increasing perception as much as possible. Again, this adds a hole new spin on things lol

I absolutely hated how you could only specialise in one weapon in the baldurs gate series so I'm happy with what pillars have done here. The weapons where far more powerful in the BG series so this equaled it out.

Yeah this is a lot different from 1d6+2 for a short-sword that attacks once per round haha, I've been playing d&d since I was 12 and am a ie veteran and I still have no idea what the hell you guys have done with this system. I would have to spend about 2 days working this out with semi- complex mathematics on a spreadsheet. The way I use to work it out effectively is you would probably be better off with fast low dps wepons early game and slow high dps weapons late game due to increasing damage reduction. This is not necessarily a bad thing because you are making it hard for players to determine if some weapons are weaker then others, this is good from a role playing perspective. But this would be very very very confusing for people who haven't played d&d before

This is only the second game since bg2 that I have actually liked, so I a way I hope obsidian don't make a pillars 2 as it takes up to much of my time playing games like this and the real world is more fun:)

I've deleted this game and I'm not playing or thinking about it untill white march part 2 comes out. I want my life back haha

yeah I found them incredibly strong to, check my OP. I think a case is building for a pvsp combat, untll then we will never no you can make a case for just about every build. In PVSP saves would be a big deal, there is still a fair amount of luck to what happens in this game. I think overall there is no strongest build, only classes that perform different roles. This is what obsidian where after IMO and they succeeded

mate I tried playing your monk, after playing it for a bit came to the conclusion that I just don't enjoy playing monks. I just find there play style really boring and not fun at all. Weapon and item selection is not really optimized for them so that takes the fun out of collecting loot, I do realize you still can use items on them but most of there abilities aren't optimized for this. I also feel as though they fill into the cliché "budda" type monk, in a robe etc. not really a cool class and not as fulfilling as playing a magic user or strong weapon user. The last point I raised, using weapons and magic is generally why I play these games, monks still do this to a certain degree but not to the full effect. I find them incredibly boring. Having said that they may be a strong build 1v1 but I would consider rogues and fighters (especially after latest patch) to be stronger. Anyway im done with this thread. maybe im biased because I find them boring like I said. By all I need to get back to the real world haha

mate we have all acknowledged the game isn't made for pvp read the entire thread. And where not talking about stealth where talking about the rogue ability shadowing beyond

Of course you would not start a fight 2 meteres away from each other. The rot fingers cause afflictions that are not affected by any defence I also just noticed that you where the op for the juggernaught monk, hence why you have such a bond with it and are defending it so much. I have started a new play through today, and am using your build the monk. I have already started and tbh I think you are over rating it. It's human nature to be proud of something you created but you need to listen to reason and open your mind a little bit. Just like I have by playing your monk:) And your completely ignoring that contingency I mentioned, it's a level 5 wizard spell called llengraths safeguard, have a look at it. This would give the wizard two guaranteed chances of landing spells at you, once at the opening of combat and once after this contingency has activated, man if you reply back and say that your monk could survive 2 shots of either a petrify or a crushing doom I'm going to stop posting to this cause your just being way to ignorant

Of course you would not start a fight 2 meteres away from each other. The rot fingers cause afflictions that are not affected by any defence I also just noticed that you where the op for the juggernaught monk, hence why you have such a bond with it and are defending it so much. I have started a new play through today, and am using your build the monk. I have already started and tbh I think you are over rating it. It's human nature to be proud of something you created but you need to listen to reason and open your mind a little bit. Just like I have by playing your monk:)

I agree, actually I'm 99% certain. So I think it's fair to say that in terms of most overpowered build 1 vs 1 A wizard will beat the juaggernaught monk. A wizard will be able to beat all classes except a rogue who can activate invisibility, there fore evading spells and being able to position to be able to take the wizard down in melee. This will make the rogue then winner in a all vs all class combat. The wizard may........be able to defeat the rogue with that contingency that activates when it reaches below 50% endurance and knocks everyone prone around it. Unfortunately at the moment we can't try this out as the game won't allow pvp combat. The contingencies and spell triggers really are what differentiates wizards from all other classes in traditional d&d and what makes them so powerful. Pillars hasn't really touched on this matter yet.

I agree, actually I'm 99% certain. So I think it's fair to say that in terms of most overpowered build 1 vs 1 A wizard will beat the juaggernaught monk. A wizard will be able to beat all classes except a rogue who can activate invisibility, there fore evading spells and being able to position to be able to take the wizard down in melee. This will make the rogue then winner in a all vs all class combat. The wizard may........be able to defeat the rogue with that contingency that activates when it reaches below 50% endurance and knocks everyone prone around it. Unfortunately at the moment we can't try this out as the game won't allow pvp combat.

The DEATHBLOWS bill be activated straight away with the rot finger gloves as per boerer suggestion, then 4 shots all DEATHBLOWS activated then once you summon twins who's to say I simply Say I just run of screen untill they disappear. Thaos obvisouly would have high fort, will and I can't remember the last time my rogue never landed a blinding strike or it's equivalent as they have an increased accuracy and the rogue will have the highest accuracy in the game so this will negate your monks defences. The affliction strikes from rogues ALLWAYS land. And I have a compete immunty button with invis to use at any time. I also have the option of punishing you with a firearm from range adding crippling afflictions that willl slow your move speed. There are more options there but I'm still confident I would kill you instantly as per the op did to thaos. He only landed one crit remember, crits also increase duration of afflictions by 50%, if I landed a crit with the opening fearsome strike or blind you dead. You are also over looking blind, this will basically disable you from being able to hit me, just like my invis One thing we have missed is that your monk would more then likely be bettered by a wizard in one on one combat. Your monk does not have invisibility, therefore no ability to to get up close to the wizard and inniate melee without copping a high level spell first. You would be petrified then chain cast with alacrity fireballs (fast speed cast spell) plus the alacrity. This is something the rogue can avoid you can't

The DEATHBLOWS bill be activated straight away with the rot finger gloves as per boerer suggestion, then 4 shots all DEATHBLOWS activated then once you summon twins who's to say I simply Say I just run of screen untill they disappear. Thaos obvisouly would have high fort, will and I can't remember the last time my rogue never landed a blinding strike or it's equivalent as they have an increased accuracy and the rogue will have the highest accuracy in the game so this will negate your monks defences. The affliction strikes from rogues ALLWAYS land. And I have a compete immunty button with invis to use at any time. I also have the option of punishing you with a firearm from range adding crippling afflictions that willl slow your move speed. There are more options there but I'm still confident I would kill you instantly as per the op did to thaos. He only landed one crit remember, crits also increase duration of afflictions by 50%, if I landed a crit with the opening fearsome strike or blind you dead. You are also over looking blind, this will basically disable you from being able to hit me, just like my invis

I'm all for listening to the monk but dude we have to leave the paladin out of this. It does not belong on this thread. Look at the screen shot on this link when the op 4 shoted thaos.https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/79744-tcs-rogue-dw-sabre-4-shot-thaos-1-bs-1-cs/ He was hitting thaos for around 70 without crits each time and thaos would have had a high damage reduction for slash, at least 20 I'm guessing so your 27 dr will Definately be getting punished. Let's assume I do open with invisibility, this guarantees me the fist 4 shots on the monk so it will be fearsome strike which has enabled 2 afflictions then blinding strike with DEATHBLOWS, THEN you will be able to hit me. I've just dealt you a minimum of 140 damage (assuming I didn't crit you) and remember rogues automatically gain an extra 20% of hits converted to crits no matter what due to talent selections, this combined with high perception and other accuracy buffs I think will crit the monk even with a high deflection about 30% of the time. So it's more then likely before you can even get a chance to hit me you : - are blind - crippled - weakened - hobbled - taken a minimum of 200 damage (assuming I critted once) Man seriously, that's a frickin huge handicap I just dealt you. You are underestimating invisibility Sorry I ****ed up. The op in that post four shotted thaos for 298 damage and only one landed a crit, have a look. The rogue will flog the monk

I'm all for listening to the monk but dude we have to leave the paladin out of this. It does not belong on this thread. Look at the screen shot on this link when the op 4 shoted thaos.https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/79744-tcs-rogue-dw-sabre-4-shot-thaos-1-bs-1-cs/ He was hitting thaos for around 70 without crits each time and thaos would have had a high damage reduction for slash, at least 20 I'm guessing so your 27 dr will Definately be getting punished. Let's assume I do open with invisibility, this guarantees me the fist 4 shots on the monk so it will be fearsome strike which has enabled 2 afflictions then blinding strike with DEATHBLOWS, THEN you will be able to hit me. I've just dealt you a minimum of 140 damage (assuming I didn't crit you) and remember rogues automatically gain an extra 20% of hits converted to crits no matter what due to talent selections, this combined with high perception and other accuracy buffs I think will crit the monk even with a high deflection about 30% of the time. So it's more then likely before you can even get a chance to hit me you : - are blind - crippled - weakened - hobbled - taken a minimum of 200 damage (assuming I critted once) Man seriously, that's a frickin huge handicap I just dealt you. You are underestimating invisibility And then after you do hit me after I have done all this to you I will still have DEATHBLOWS activated, you will be dead in 1 more hit, 2 max, Seriously have a good think about this and look at that screen shot. The rogue will win guaranteed

I'm all for listening to the monk but dude we have to leave the paladin out of this. It does not belong on this thread. Look at the screen shot on this link when the op 4 shoted thaos. https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/79744-tcs-rogue-dw-sabre-4-shot-thaos-1-bs-1-cs/ He was hitting thaos for around 70 without crits each time and thaos would have had a high damage reduction for slash, at least 20 I'm guessing so your 27 dr will Definately be getting punished. Let's assume I do open with invisibility, this guarantees me the fist 4 shots on the monk so it will be fearsome strike which has enabled 2 afflictions then blinding strike with DEATHBLOWS, THEN you will be able to hit me. I've just dealt you a minimum of 140 damage (assuming I didn't crit you) and remember rogues automatically gain an extra 20% of hits converted to crits no matter what due to talent selections, this combined with high perception and other accuracy buffs I think will crit the monk even with a high deflection about 30% of the time. So it's more then likely before you can even get a chance to hit me you : - are blind - crippled - weakened - hobbled - taken a minimum of 200 damage (assuming I critted once) Man seriously, that's a frickin huge handicap I just dealt you. You are underestimating invisibility

I'd say the Wizard is way ahead of the Cipher. Amplified wave is great BUT you only get to cast one of them and then you need to make a few normal attacks to regenerate focus. Time Parasite is great in that it speeds up your attacks but after using it you are out of focus and need to attack a few times to regenerate focus. A Wizard can bang out an Alacrity, get a 50% speed increase and then bang out four level seven spells and the follow up with four level six, five, four and so on. Nothing will survive being on the receiving end of a Wizard's full unloading of its Grimoire. The only defense is to kill the Wizard. Plus the Wizard can do this in every single battle if they are willing to back track or expend camping supplies. With the Rogue vs Monk deathmatch I'd be betting on the Monk Using my Juggernaut (with equipment but no paladin auras, buffs, food or rest bonuses) I have 322 Endurance, 27 slash DR, 25 pierce DR and 18 crush DR (Armor is merely exceptional, have not upgraded to Superb), Fortitude is 122, Reflex is 94, Will is 76, all of which get increased by 10 from Crucible of Suffering which kicks in after the first status attack. A 64 deflection and an 89 accuracy. Fists are fast speed, 3 DR bypass and are listed as 26 -33 damage. You get first hit with +50% sneak attack, and a blind strike vs Will. Reflex. Even if you get past the defense it is only a -20 -25 debuff to accuracy and deflection. Its not as if your deflection is high enough to cause misses against an 89 accuracy even if I'm blind. Even with a crit how hard is the hit? 100, 150 max? Factor in DR and it is probably less than 100. The point being that I am still alive and now have 10 wounds to spend. I use eight to summon the Twins who have like 280 endurance and the same DR as I do. Now it is three on one and the twins are not blinded and you're out of blinding strikes. Even without the Twins Torment's Reach spam is a full attack at +50% crush, how many of those can your Rogue take? If I took Force of Anguish, for two wounds I'd get a ten+ second prone. The fight would be like the early days of MMA where wrestlers and ground and pound were the kings. The Monk is the wrestler and the Rogue would be the Tae Kwan Do master. this is the build that would beat the monk https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/79744-tcs-rogue-dw-sabre-4-shot-thaos-1-bs-1-cs/

nightshroud on the rogue may be the best weapon for this

I'd say the Wizard is way ahead of the Cipher. Amplified wave is great BUT you only get to cast one of them and then you need to make a few normal attacks to regenerate focus. Time Parasite is great in that it speeds up your attacks but after using it you are out of focus and need to attack a few times to regenerate focus. A Wizard can bang out an Alacrity, get a 50% speed increase and then bang out four level seven spells and the follow up with four level six, five, four and so on. Nothing will survive being on the receiving end of a Wizard's full unloading of its Grimoire. The only defense is to kill the Wizard. Plus the Wizard can do this in every single battle if they are willing to back track or expend camping supplies. With the Rogue vs Monk deathmatch I'd be betting on the Monk Using my Juggernaut (with equipment but no paladin auras, buffs, food or rest bonuses) I have 322 Endurance, 27 slash DR, 25 pierce DR and 18 crush DR (Armor is merely exceptional, have not upgraded to Superb), Fortitude is 122, Reflex is 94, Will is 76, all of which get increased by 10 from Crucible of Suffering which kicks in after the first status attack. A 64 deflection and an 89 accuracy. Fists are fast speed, 3 DR bypass and are listed as 26 -33 damage. You get first hit with +50% sneak attack, and a blind strike vs Will. Reflex. Even if you get past the defense it is only a -20 -25 debuff to accuracy and deflection. Its not as if your deflection is high enough to cause misses against an 89 accuracy even if I'm blind. Even with a crit how hard is the hit? 100, 150 max? Factor in DR and it is probably less than 100. The point being that I am still alive and now have 10 wounds to spend. I use eight to summon the Twins who have like 280 endurance and the same DR as I do. Now it is three on one and the twins are not blinded and you're out of blinding strikes. Even without the Twins Torment's Reach spam is a full attack at +50% crush, how many of those can your Rogue take? If I took Force of Anguish, for two wounds I'd get a ten+ second prone. The fight would be like the early days of MMA where wrestlers and ground and pound were the kings. The Monk is the wrestler and the Rogue would be the Tae Kwan Do master. I wouldn't blinding strike first I would fearsome strike, therefore inflicting 2 afflictions instantly, then blinding strike (including deathblows), so you are blind, crippled, weakened and hobbled in 2 shots. I would still have invis up my sleeve aswell remember as a monk is not a caster so I would not activate it at the start of combat to avoid spells. if I critted on any of these 2 strikes you would not probably die, if I critted on both you would definitely die , If you did manage to survive you definatley would not be in a position to win

I'd say the Wizard is way ahead of the Cipher. Amplified wave is great BUT you only get to cast one of them and then you need to make a few normal attacks to regenerate focus. Time Parasite is great in that it speeds up your attacks but after using it you are out of focus and need to attack a few times to regenerate focus. A Wizard can bang out an Alacrity, get a 50% speed increase and then bang out four level seven spells and the follow up with four level six, five, four and so on. Nothing will survive being on the receiving end of a Wizard's full unloading of its Grimoire. The only defense is to kill the Wizard. Plus the Wizard can do this in every single battle if they are willing to back track or expend camping supplies. With the Rogue vs Monk deathmatch I'd be betting on the Monk Using my Juggernaut (with equipment but no paladin auras, buffs, food or rest bonuses) I have 322 Endurance, 27 slash DR, 25 pierce DR and 18 crush DR (Armor is merely exceptional, have not upgraded to Superb), Fortitude is 122, Reflex is 94, Will is 76, all of which get increased by 10 from Crucible of Suffering which kicks in after the first status attack. A 64 deflection and an 89 accuracy. Fists are fast speed, 3 DR bypass and are listed as 26 -33 damage. You get first hit with +50% sneak attack, and a blind strike vs Will. Reflex. Even if you get past the defense it is only a -20 -25 debuff to accuracy and deflection. Its not as if your deflection is high enough to cause misses against an 89 accuracy even if I'm blind. Even with a crit how hard is the hit? 100, 150 max? Factor in DR and it is probably less than 100. The point being that I am still alive and now have 10 wounds to spend. I use eight to summon the Twins who have like 280 endurance and the same DR as I do. Now it is three on one and the twins are not blinded and you're out of blinding strikes. Even without the Twins Torment's Reach spam is a full attack at +50% crush, how many of those can your Rogue take? If I took Force of Anguish, for two wounds I'd get a ten+ second prone. The fight would be like the early days of MMA where wrestlers and ground and pound were the kings. The Monk is the wrestler and the Rogue would be the Tae Kwan Do master. I wouldn't blinding strike first I would fearsome strike, therefore inflicting 2 afflictions instantly, then blinding strike (including deathblows), so you are blind, crippled, weakened and hobbled in 2 shots. I would still have invis up my sleeve aswell remember as a monk is not a caster so I would not activate it at the start of combat to avoid spells. if I critted on any of these 2 strikes you would not probably die, if I critted on both you would definitely die , If you did manage to survive you definatley would not be in a position to win http://pillarsofeternity.gamepedia.com/Fearsome_Strike

BTW i only found these 3 spells the cipher has to be the ones of any real use, so basically if you compare a cipher to a wizard the wizard is more versatile but I think these three spells amplified wave, time parasite and mind plague are more powerful then anything the wizard has, perhaps apart from that cauncahaults hammer the wizard gets a craighold bluff but this only targets one person. Come to think of it if the wizard could fire this spell of at the rogue that could make the wizard the most powerful build in one on one also. It would be hard for the wizard to do it though because the rogue would activate invisibility as soon as engaged started and then I think the wizard would be dead as soon as it was engaged in melee. This is where wizards need contingencies and spell triggers

Invisibility for the rogue is a bizarre ability. It can be used to unbelievable effectiveness in this 1 vs 1 situation, the name of it should be changed from invisibility to immunity. I personally wouldn't go with stunning or overbearing weapons I would go with a annihilation. I don't think any other build could survive successive rogue afflictions like blinding strike, crippling strike (that all stack concurrent damage bonuses eg 25% for the affliction, 50% for sneak attack, 100% for deathblows, 30% merciless hand, 10% dungeon delver, 50% annihilation. You can 2 shot most high powered bosses with this build with the annihilating sabres

Ok all. We have some good discussion here and It has helped me a lot but we seem to all be interpreting my OP Differently. 1. Some people are interpreting what the most overpowered build post patch 2.00 is as an individual, e.g. say for example one class vs. another in a 1 on 1 fight. e.g. Rogue vs. Monk 2. Others are interpreting my OP as What is the most overpowered build vs. the Mobs/ Bad Guys/ General monsters etc. So lets answer this in these terms The Answer to 2. seems to be a wizard? Do we all agree on this? I am tied between a wizard and a cipher simply because Amplified Wave is the only GOD LIKE ability in this game. The Wizard has no spell more powerful then amplified wave but overall the wizards repertoire of spells to choose from may be more powerful. The cipher also has the spells time parasite and mind plague. All three of these spells are capable of wrecking just about anything I encountered in POTD especially the wave. Also keep in mind time parasite and mind plague jump to enemies, they are not restricted to a circle of effect like most of the wizards powerful spells eg petrify. Im going with Cipher, the Wave IMO is just to powerful to ignore. In Regards to 1. Most Powerful build class vs class: I think Rogue, the Rogue can activate Invisibility Instantly and is the only class capable of doing this. Invisibility will allow the Rogue to be IMMUNE to spells and attacks and allow the rogue to position itself to lock down its target with a series of critical hits, sneak attacks and Deathblows. Someone show me how to avoid this???????????? You cant, once a rogue does that your fckd.

dude seriously, you obviously like paladins and so do I but a paladin does not do more dps then a fighter. Im not replying anymore to this post, People if you are reading it, trust me, a paladin will not do more dps then a fighter