Party Optimization for PotD; 1st Attempt

[Boeroer]

Fighter's Weapon Specialisation and Mastry don't give you any accuracy, only damage bonuses (+15% and +10%).

 

Persistance does more single target damage than Stormcaller (especially once you get durgan steel). Stormcaller can be better when it comes to foes who are resistant/immune to pierce damage. And also the reduced shock DR can be benefical for other party members (think of shocking lashes on party members' weapons).

 

Low deflection on a barb is usually no problem after some levels because he becomes so beefy. His other defenses are as high or low as those of other classes. He can make up for the lower deflection with One Stands Alone: while otehr classes would get flanked in the fray the barb will maintain his deflection value. With Frenzy he will even have +16 fortitude, +24 with Greater Frenzy. So when it comes to defenses against prone, stun, paralyze and petrify the barb is one of the sturdier classes (as long as Frenzy is on). 

[Lampros]

Ascaloth,

 

You repeatedly solicited our opinions. So I - along with others - gave our considered judgments. I am not so sure why you had to turn downright hostile and rude when I do not believe I have been so. In fact, in my first few posts I have thanked you for an enjoyable read!

 

Moreover, I have made my suggestions rather tentatively, initially qualifying my advice with the disclaimer that I am myself a relatively new player. And in the context of your accusing me of imposing my style on top of you: All I did was voice some concerns that many players share about the Barbarian. A lot of players do equip him either with Tall Grass or Godansthuynr - rather than as an outright DPS character. This is because the Barbarian has an amazing CC potential; and there are some survivability concerns about him at initial levels - especially if you are new to PotD. Was I so offensive in pointing out these alternative paths? Besides, I even conceded that they may be more "idosyncratic" concerns that preoccupy me over other people and implied that they may be overblown. I do not see where I tried to impose my play-style onto you.

 

Also, if you all but read the skill descriptions in-game, Weapon Specialization or Mastery do not increase Accuracy one iota. So yes, what you have is not enough Accuracy on PotD to CC reliably with a Fighter.

 

All in all, you can play which ever style you want; it's your game. But in that case you should not have solicited our opinion at all - especially when you are going to have a hissy fit about responses that were not even offensive (and certainly not meant to cause offense).

 

I am out of this thread.

Edited September 30, 2017 by Lampros

[Ascaloth]

Fighter's Weapon Specialisation and Mastry don't give you any accuracy, only damage bonuses (+15% and +10%).

 

Persistance does more single target damage than Stormcaller (especially once you get durgan steel). Stormcaller can be better when it comes to foes who are resistant/immune to pierce damage. And also the reduced shock DR can be benefical for other party members (think of shocking lashes on party members' weapons).

 

Low deflection on a barb is usually no problem after some levels because he becomes so beefy. His other defenses are as high or low as those of other classes. He can make up for the lower deflection with One Stands Alone: while otehr classes would get flanked in the fray the barb will maintain his deflection value. With Frenzy he will even have +16 fortitude, +24 with Greater Frenzy. So when it comes to defenses against prone, stun, paralyze and petrify the barb is one of the sturdier classes (as long as Frenzy is on). 

 

Welp. That'll teach me to pick choices based on assumptions, instead of double-checking with the wiki to confirm I'm on the right track.

 

Alright, so I guess I'm dropping WS Knight for Confident Aim after all, and I'll have to look at the talents again for a replacement to WM Knight. What about my thinking with Knock Down? Do you think I'll really need the extra tools for Proning enemies like I figured, or am I better off boosting accuracy with Disciplined Barrage instead?

 

Noted on Persistence and Stormcaller. In the context of the rest of my party, which do you think would be the better choice as the regular weapon of my Ranger? I mean, I'm fixated on Stormcaller because I've heard a lot of good things about it, after all.

 

Finally, is it true that it's not a good idea to dump CON on my casters? I didn't dump RES because I wanted the casters to have good Will saves, after all.

[Boeroer]

I think that Disciplined Barrage is one of the best abilities a fighter has. For me it's not Weapon Focus or Disciplined Barraged. I will always take both because they stack. But that's just me, liking offensive fighters better than defensive ones. The downside of Disciplined Barrage is that it's an active buff that runs out after some time - and that doesn't stack with Zealous Focus. If you use Zealous Focus you can leave Disciplined Barrage out without too much loss I guess.

 

Confident Aim is indeed better than Weapon Mastery. Without any damage bonuses Conf. Aim is a raise of ~8% damage and conversion on top. With every dmg bonus you get (MIG, enchantment, Weapon Spec. and so on) the multiplicative effect of CA gets stronger.

That's why I take both - again.

 

But you see that I have a different kind of fighter in my mind. If I had to decide between Weapon Mastery and Confident Aim then I'd pick Confident Aim.

 

Knockdown also gets +1 accuracy per level (all offensive abilities do) - so it's easier to hit with a Knockdown than with auto-attacks. Maybe you don't need all the ACC you can get because of this.

[Boeroer]

Stormcaller is more fun if you ask me. Just because of the "whack" it makes when Returning Storm triggers (it's not really returning in this case, just a one-time strike of lightning) and because every hit produces a nice brizzling sound from the shock damage.

They are both very good.

[Boeroer]

I'd rather dump RES than CON on my backline. It's really bad if they get one-shotted with a ranged attack. Mind Control is not a big deal because the AI will not use spells and while you're turned you won't get attacked.

In PotD there are also a lot more enemies who will rush your backline.

 

But I do both sometimes: dumping CON and also RES. It works but you will be very frail. You have to let the front line unstealth and engage and then unstealth and attack with the back line. That way they don't get targeted immediately.

And stuff like CC also helps with survival. But in general I'd say it's less of a hassle to have less squishy casters. Also some medium armor can prevent rushing. Some enemies look for low DR, some for low endurance and others for low deflection.

[Ascaloth]

I think that Disciplined Barrage is one of the best abilities a fighter has. For me it's not Weapon Focus or Disciplined Barraged. I will always take both because they stack. But that's just me, liking offensive fighters better than defensive ones. The downside of Disciplined Barrage is that it's an active buff that runs out after some time - and that doesn't stack with Zealous Focus. If you use Zealous Focus you can leave Disciplined Barrage out without too much loss I guess.

 

Confident Aim is indeed better than Weapon Mastery. Without any damage bonuses Conf. Aim is a raise of ~8% damage and conversion on top. With every dmg bonus you get (MIG, enchantment, Weapon Spec. and so on) the multiplicative effect of CA gets stronger.

That's why I take both - again.

 

But you see that I have a different kind of fighter in my mind. If I had to decide between Weapon Mastery and Confident Aim then I'd pick Confident Aim.

 

Knockdown also gets +1 accuracy per level (all offensive abilities do) - so it's easier to hit with a Knockdown than with auto-attacks. Maybe you don't need all the ACC you can get because of this.

 

Works for me. So I think I'll retain Knockdown since my Paladin already has Zealous Focus, replace WS Knight with Confident Aim, and for the talents, I'll replace WM Knight with One-Handed Style for the increased crit rate. Does the math work out that way?

 

Stormcaller is more fun if you ask me. Just because of the "whack" it makes when Returning Storm triggers (it's not really returning in this case, just a one-time strike of lightning) and because every hit produces a nice brizzling sound from the shock damage.

They are both very good.

 

Alright, I guess I'll stick with my original plan then. Maybe I'll put more Shock spells in the Wizard's grimoire, so he can exploit Stormcaller's Shock DR reduction with a follow-up.

 

I'd rather dump RES than CON on my backline. It's really bad if they get one-shotted with a ranged attack. Mind Control is not a big deal because the AI will not use spells and while you're turned you won't get attacked.

In PotD there are also a lot more enemies who will rush your backline.

 

But I do both sometimes: dumping CON and also RES. It works but you will be very frail. You have to let the front line unstealth and engage and then unstealth and attack with the back line. That way they don't get targeted immediately.

And stuff like CC also helps with survival. But in general I'd say it's less of a hassle to have less squishy casters. Also some medium armor can prevent rushing. Some enemies look for low DR, some for low endurance and others for low deflection.

 

Alright, I'm convinced. I'll dump RES instead of CON on both casters. By the same logic, I might as well dump RES instead of INT on my Ranger, too.

Edited October 1, 2017 by Ascaloth

[Boeroer]

Yes, don't dump INT on a ranger unless you don't want to take Stunning Shots and Binding Roots. Longer stuns are the key to stun-locking your enemy. RES will do not much for you.

Dumped INT on a ranger is cool with the wounding enchantment on a weapon and Wounding Shots (applies the raw damage faster), but that's it.

 

Using more shock spells is a good thing if you have Stormcaller in the party. I forgot if you have a druid? Those are really great in combo with a Stormcaller ranger because some of their best spells are shock based (while the wizard's shock spells are a bit mediocre) and you can also take Wildstrike Shock and go totally crazy in melee when you attack the same enemy the ranger prepared with -6 shock DR.

Edited October 1, 2017 by Boeroer

[Ascaloth]

Yes, don't dump INT on a ranger unless you don't want to take Stunning Shots and Binding Roots. Longer stuns are the key to stun-locking your enemy. RES will do not much for you.

Dumped INT on a ranger is cool with the wounding enchantment on a weapon and Wounding Shots (applies the raw damage faster), but that's it.

 

Using more shock spells is a good thing if you have Stormcaller in the party. I forgot if you have a druid? Those are really great in combo with a Stormcaller ranger because some of their best spells are shock based (while the wizard's shock spells are a bit mediocre) and you can also take Wildstrike Shock and go totally crazy in melee when you attack the same enemy the ranger prepared with -6 shock DR.

 

Roger that. Dumping RES and bringing INT back up on the Ranger. I guess I'll have to rely on the Prayer Against Bewilderment and Treachery spells to cover against the mindwhammy effects.

 

Didn't plan for a druid in the party this time around, but I'm actually set up to see well this works out soon enough in my current playthrough; I put Sagani with a maxed Stormcaller and a Shock-specced Hiravias together in the party for the WM2 run. Relentless Storm is a really awesome CC option. Perhaps next time around, if and when I build a party after this one.

 

One last thing; should I keep the Wizard as a Wood Elf, or should I turn her Pale Elf as well to further benefit from Secrets of Rime? Her primary role in the party is ranged CC, but with the ability to flex to ranged DPS with the DAoM-KMB-CMP combo as necessary (and Caedebald's Blackbow for single-target work in the endgame). I'm assuming the Wood Elf's racial helps with that, but I want to be sure.

[Boeroer]

Yes, Distant Advantage will add accuracy to spells, too.

[Ascaloth]

Thanks for all the tips, Boeroer. You've been a great help for me firming up my final party composition. 

 

One last thing; I've only just realized I overlooked the Blackwarden's Breast. Does it stack with Cloak of the Frozen Hunt?

Edited October 4, 2017 by Ascaloth

[Boeroer]

You're welcome.

 

Blackwarden's Breast: Oh - that I can't say. I never used it. I guess the ACC bonus doesn't stack but... it's just a guess.